# Lost 2.20: "Two for the Road"
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [May 3, 2006, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270 "2006-05-03T18:34:48Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 10
### Author:  [@Flutterby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flutterby)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/181 "2006-05-06T01:04:04Z")
Okay, finally got to watch it!
> [@vaderspal](#):
>
> Is this the correct number for the US? I have tried it on both a land line and cell and it just keeps saying the circuits are busy.
Just tried it, it works. I’m going to keep calling when I have more time to listen to every option.
> [@Mama Tiger](#):
>
> Just a few drive-by coincidences from the writers that I’m 99.9% sure mean nothing other than to drive us nuts: Did anybody else notice that it was Sawyer that Jack’s dad opened the car door into, who yelled, “Hey, I’m walkin’ here!”?
> [@panache45](#):
>
> Yeah, the “walkin’ here” guy definitely looked like Sawyer.
>
> I had no trouble loading the Hanso site, but I’m too sleepy to explore it. Tomorrow.
Yup, that was Sawyer. You got a good look at his face when he yelled in the window.
> [@John Mace](#):
>
> Hmmm. Another singer highlighted who was in a plane crash. Patsy Cline… Walkin’ After Midnight. Anyone else notice that?
I did notice that one!
> [@Team of Scientists](#):
>
> Well, here’s something you can do at [www.thehansofoundation.org](http://www.thehansofoundation.org). Try to sign up for the newsletter. Follow the instructions, and then, when you’re prompted for a password, type in “breakingstrain”. After that, go to Joop’s corner, and send him the word “Persephone.”
That takes you right to one of the letters I posted back in [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7359090&postcount=13).
I still don’t know what to think, maybe if I give it a couple more hours.
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### Author:  [@jaderabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaderabbit)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/182 "2006-05-06T01:16:19Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#):
>
> What about Jack’s dad? I’m starting to wonder if he’s really dead. I don’t remember the circumstances of his death, or if Jack saw his body. Didn’t Jack think he saw him on the island, back in the first season?
Jack had the body with him on the plane, or thought he did (did we ever see it?), but he found only an empty coffin on the island.
Pick one:
a) Jack’s dad never was dead to start with, and he’s pulling the strings.
b) Jack’s dad was dead, and the island made him a whole lot better.
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### Author:  [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/183 "2006-05-06T01:30:39Z")
> [@Stereo Isomer](#):
>
> Ah, I hadn’t thought of that. I don’t know much about guns, though. Do they rattle? I thought it was chattering teeth because I could have sworn you could actually see his jaw moving.
Guns generally don’t rattle - they might click subtley here and there depending on the design. This isn’t necesarily evidence, though - TV sound men are _horrible_ with guns. Every time anyone points a gun, you hear it clicking or cocking.
What was the whole deal with AnaL and Jack’s dad’s relationship? He didn’t need “security”, obviously - what was she guarding him from? I guess he just wanted companionship, but it seems odd that he’d pick someone from LA to try to get to come with him rather than trying to find someone there. It seems like the writing staff making pointless pre-flight connections between characters.
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### Author:  [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/184 "2006-05-06T01:33:12Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#):
>
> . The producers are also on record as saying that they didn’t expect this to make it to a second season, so they started out writing it by making it up as they went along with no vision of long-term continuity.
Cite? I suspect this may be true, but if they actually said as much…
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### Author:  [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/185 "2006-05-06T04:20:02Z")
> [@panamajack](#):
>
> By the way, I watched the episode on ABC’s flash player and thought it was rather nicely done. They skip the last commercial break (and the timeline at the bottom shows when they will occur). The breaks are very short and I only had one commercial with audio (30 sec.). Nice way to catch one you’ve missed.
Are these only available for one week? Or is there a link to archives?
---
### Author:  [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/186 "2006-05-06T06:17:21Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#):
>
> The producers are also on record as saying that they didn’t expect this to make it to a second season, so they started out writing it by making it up as they went along with no vision of long-term continuity.
If you’ve got a cite, then they are ALSO on record (disc 7 of the Season 1 DVDs) saying that one of the first times one of the producers and Damon Linderhof (sp?) sat down and discussed the arc of the show, they came up with about 5 seasons worth of plot (so that’s about 5 months Island Time?) for the show.
Of course, that initital story has likely changed a lot, but I certainly did not get the impression they were making it up as they went along, or that they thought there would only be one season.
> [@jaderabbit](#):
>
> Jack had the body with him on the plane, or thought he did (did we ever see it?), but he found only an empty coffin on the island.
I’ve seen the entirety of season one at least 4 or 5 times, so can say with authority that Jack (and we, the viewers) definitely saw Christian in the Sydney morgue when Jack identified the body. So unless they routinely put bodies in the freezer before checking a pulse, Jack’s dad was in fact dead. At least for a little while.
> [@Wile E](#):
>
> Re: Sawyer at the bar.
> As I remember it Sawyer chickened out the first time he met NotSawyer(shrimp guy). So he went to the bar, had a chat with Jack’s dad something he said fired up Sawyer and then left and shot NotSawyer. Apparently he later went back to that bar or another bar and got in a fight with someone - whether that was Jack’s dad or not we still don’t know.
This is accurate.
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### Author:  [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/187 "2006-05-06T06:25:26Z")
> [@jaderabbit](#):
>
> Jack had the body with him on the plane, or thought he did (did we ever see it?), but he found only an empty coffin on the island.
Oh, but we never did see the coffin actually going on the plane, if that’s what you mean. Jack argued with the counter-lady about it, but presuming she gave in, we don’t know if Jack ever got visual confirmation thereof.
There was, of course, and empty coffin in the wreckage. Whether it was empty or not when it went on the plane is unknown.
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### Author:  [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/188 "2006-05-06T14:03:23Z")
I wonder if Hurley will have another breakdown.
He landed in the mental hospital because he was punishing himself with food after a balcony (?) collapse killed two people. He told Libby he’s obsessed with food. Now, because he was concentrating on food for the picnic and had to send his girlfriend back for blankets and drinks, which led to her death, I wonder if he will see himself as reponsible for her death.
Not that he was, of course, but considering his issues with food…
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### Author:  [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/189 "2006-05-06T15:08:12Z")
> [@](#):
>
> By the way, I watched the episode on ABC’s flash player and thought it was rather nicely done. They skip the last commercial break (and the timeline at the bottom shows when they will occur). The breaks are very short and I only had one commercial with audio (30 sec.). Nice way to catch one you’ve missed.
My daughter watched it last night on the ABC site and thought it was great, but after when we were discussing it I asked her what she thought about the look between Fenry and Michael. She said “What look?”
Apparently for her it cut out right after Michael shot Libby. She went back again to see the end and it cut out there again. Did anyone else have that problem? She didn’t even know Michael shot himself.
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### Author:  [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/190 "2006-05-06T16:20:05Z")
Watching it again.
I don’t think the blonde Australian woman that Christian accosts is old enough to be Clare’s Mom. Aunt maybe…
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### Author:  [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/191 "2006-05-06T17:03:59Z")
Ok, so I was watching the [ABC.com](http://ABC.com) flash site and it played the whole thing for me, no cutting off at the end. It doesn’t include the “next week” stuff though.
I also couldn’t resume playing after pausing. It would just stay paused. I had to to eyeball the progress, re-launch the player, find where I’d eyeballed again, watch an ad, and then it continued. Interestingly, when I did this, the resulting ad seemed to replace the ad that I was supposed to have encountered if I’d watched it all the way through the first time. Like there is a static number of ads, and if you get them all out of the way early, you can enjoy the rest commercial free.
With my noise-cancelling iPod headphones on, there is audible rattling pretty much the entire time Michael has the gun in his hand, not just when he’s in the cell with NotHenry. It sounds to me like actual rattling of the prop gun. There was also nothing spoken by either Michael or Henry, contrary to an early post that one of them said something like “I’m ready.”
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### Author:  [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/192 "2006-05-06T18:34:21Z")
Did the ABC site show the special “commercial” with the phone number? She said she never saw that either.
With dial-up I can’t even get it to play so I have no way of confirming…don’t know what’s going on with her not being able to see the ending. Is there a commercial between the shots and Michael opening the cell door? Maybe it’s just freezing up on her.
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### Author:  [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)
#### Post date: [May 6, 2006, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/193 "2006-05-06T20:41:58Z")
> [@honeydewgrrl](#):
>
> Watching it again.
>
> I don’t think the blonde Australian woman that Christian accosts is old enough to be Clare’s Mom. Aunt maybe…
She looked old enough to be a relatively young mom. she had older eyes.
She looks like she could be in her late 30’s.
[PHOTO](http://lost.cubit.net/pics/2x20/woman.jpg)
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### Author:  [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/194 "2006-05-07T02:35:44Z")
> [@Merijeek](#):
>
> So, does anyone have any spoilers as to whether or not Libby is dead and gone?
>
> -Joe
I saw an episode list for the rest of the season that listed Watros in all of the remaining episodes. Of course, any or all of those could be in flashbacks, and I can’t seem to find the page I was looking at so it may not be right anyway.
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### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/195 "2006-05-07T05:12:04Z")
> [@Stereo Isomer](#):
>
> \*\*The idea that the Others want Henry back keeps popping up, but if you think about it, do we have any reason to assume they know he’s being held captive? \*\* Maybe he was sent on a mission that was supposed to take longer than he’s been away. Even if they did expect him back by now, the most they could know is that for some reason he hasn’t returned yet. Unless the stuff about “remote viewing” turns out to be true, and the Others have the equivalent of a video feed from our Losties’ camp (which I have to admit I’ve considered, since Bluebeard was able to drop their names so easily–I never thought a verbal report from Ethan would be enough for him to recognize them at a quick glance in the jungle at night, where you’d have to go primarily by voice.)
If they didn’t know before they they found out when Jack told them. Zeke had enough time to get micheal to agree to a plan before he came stumbling out of the jungle. Remember Jack started a fire and was waiting around after he annouced to the others that he had Henry.
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### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/196 "2006-05-07T05:22:18Z")
> [@Barbarian](#):
>
> I agree with **Sam Stone** that Michael’s been brainwashed. Because if he did have some crazy deal to get his son back in a trade, he might have stopped to think that Jack was already planning to trade Henry for Michael – and that Jack would probably have been willing to trade Henry for Walt instead.
>
> Part of me is getting frustrated with the show. Go ahead and create tension and drama, but stop having everyone be so incredibly **stupid**.
I think you are a little confused. Jack _was_ trying to trade Henry for Walt. He never tried to trade for Michael. As far a Jack knew Michael was still walking thru the jungle. Zeke told Jack that Michael would never never find them. It was a surprise when Michael came out of the jungle. Micheal would have already known the trade didn’t work.
I agree with those in the not brainwashed camp. He made a deal to get back Walt and doesn’t care who he kills to get him. Remember the look in his eyes when he locked up Jack and John in the vault? He wasn’t brainwashed then, just desperate.
---
### Author:  [@Stereo\_Isomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stereo_Isomer)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/197 "2006-05-07T05:51:03Z")
> [@Loach](#):
>
> If they didn’t know before they they found out when Jack told them. Zeke had enough time to get micheal to agree to a plan before he came stumbling out of the jungle. Remember Jack started a fire and was waiting around after he annouced to the others that he had Henry.
Do we have any reason to assume they heard Jack when he was shouting into the darkness? If they did, why wouldn’t they just have accepted Jack’s offer to trade Henry for Walt, instead of sending Michael in to carry out a risky plan? Better yet, if they really were there, why not just surround Jack and Kate, take them hostage, then trade _them_ for Henry (which is what I thought was going to happen as soon as Jack announced his plan)?
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### Author:  [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/198 "2006-05-07T06:27:14Z")
> [@Stereo Isomer](#):
>
> If they did, why wouldn’t they just have accepted Jack’s offer to trade Henry for Walt, instead of sending Michael in to carry out a risky plan?
Walt is clearly very important, they went out of their way to get him.
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### Author:  [@zuma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zuma)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/199 "2006-05-07T14:52:25Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#):
>
> The producers are also on record as saying that they didn’t expect this to make it to a second season, so they started out writing it by making it up as they went along with no vision of long-term continuity. just to save WAAAAALLLT.
I too don’t want to be lame and sit here asking for a cite, but this is shocking. this is the first time i’ve heard that the producers did not have a long-term plan. Hurry up and expand on this Ethilrist 😃
The few articles I’ve read said that the producers had a multi-year plan mapped.
I’m hot to find out the real plans… everything i thought i knew was a lie?
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### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [May 7, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-20-two-for-the-road/355270/200 "2006-05-07T15:45:04Z")
> [@zuma](#):
>
> I too don’t want to be lame and sit here asking for a cite, but this is shocking. this is the first time i’ve heard that the producers did not have a long-term plan. Hurry up and expand on this Ethilrist 😃
>
> The few articles I’ve read said that the producers had a multi-year plan mapped.
>
> I’m hot to find out the real plans… everything i thought i knew was a lie?
Those two scenerios do not have to be mutually exclusive. They could have had a multi-year plan and still thought it wouldn’t last past the first year. No different than Star Wars, Lucas at least had a bare outline the entire story but didn’t know if he would ever get a chance to tell it.
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