# Lost 3.5: The Cost of Living **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 1, 2006, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769 "2006-11-01T19:20:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Rachael\_Rage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/71c47a/32.png) [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/181 "2006-11-04T18:25:44Z")
I just realized we’ve gotten to four pages with no discussion of Desmond’s new future-predicting powers. The lightning incident seemed to prove that though Desmond can predict the future (lighting will strike Claire’s hut), he is able to change/manipulate said future (by constructing a golf-club pole and deflecting the bolt). But didn’t he also attached electrical wire to the golf club? What was the wiring supposed to accomplish? This is a little troubling because whenever you introduce time-manipulation into a story, you run the risk of it getting out of control and turning into a Superman-style “let’s just change the past” gambit. Let’s hope TPTB keep it in check. I like Desmond’s sort of bemused wonder at his new found skills. And just have to add: For the first time in a season and a half, Jack did not annoy the fuck out of me this episode. I loved his incredulous response to Juliet’s “you’re just trying to make me feel better” comment (and I paraphrase): “Look, bitch, like I could give a shit about you!” Yay, Jack. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/182 "2006-11-04T18:34:58Z")
[QUOTE=Darth Vader’s Little Pal] But didn’t he also attached electrical wire to the golf club? What was the wiring supposed to accomplish? [/QUOTE] The lightning needs to be channeled into the ground somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/183 "2006-11-04T20:06:23Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] It’s unclear. It was before they got to the island, but (presumably) after it actually happened in real life. How long was echo a priest? It seems like the show portrays the period as about a week before he chops people up and bugs out. But he actually knows a lot of scripture and stuff, more indicative of years. Maybe he went on to study it after he bailed from his brother’s church? [/QUOTE] Well that, and at some point he was sent to investigate the drowning “miracle.” He had some sort of history with the guy who sent him and was also dealing with a guy who was getting him travel papers. So he left Yemi’s church for England and spent some time there? According to Lostpedia: > [@](#): > > At some later point in time, Eko (known as “Father Tunde”) served as a priest in an Australian church. He took confession from a man who has actually arrived to provide a passport (listing his name as Oduduwa Ulu with a date of issue of April 16, 2004) so Eko could travel to Los Angeles. He was asked by a senior priest to investigate a reported miracle, the apparent resurrection of a young woman who drowned the day before. Eko visits the undertaker, who plays him the tape of his autopsy procedure. He later visited the home of the woman, Charlotte Malkin, and encounters her father, Richard Malkin, who seeks to explain away the “miracle” as a cover-up of the undertaker’s incompetence. Richard is the psychic who told Claire to go on the plane, though he admits to Eko that he is a fraud. At the airport in Sydney, prior to boarding Oceanic Flight 815, Eko encounters Charlotte, who agitates him by saying that she saw his brother, Yemi, when she was “between places,” asking her to tell Eko to have faith. [http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Mr.\_Eko](http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Mr._Eko) ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/184 "2006-11-04T22:04:07Z")
[QUOTE=running piglet cheese] Who’s Marshall Mars? [/QUOTE] Veronica’s dad. ---
**Author:** ![medstar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f07891/32.png) [@medstar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/medstar)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/185 "2006-11-04T22:18:42Z")
Maybe this is just a red herring, but I’m still curious about the man and the woman still strapped into their seats that Kate and Sawyer saw in the first season episode when they found the suitcase with the guns. Does anyone else remember them? Kate and Sawyer were walking around and suddenly came upon a lake with a waterfall. They both dive into the lake and suddenly come across the drowned? couple and the suitcase was right underneath their seats. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/186 "2006-11-04T22:26:04Z")
[QUOTE=medstar] Maybe this is just a red herring, but I’m still curious about the man and the woman still strapped into their seats that Kate and Sawyer saw in the first season episode when they found the suitcase with the guns. Does anyone else remember them? [/QUOTE] Yeah, I remember. What are you curious about? Presumably lots of people died, not just them. I guess they must have been “bad”. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/187 "2006-11-05T00:12:17Z")
[QUOTE=medstar] They both dive into the lake and suddenly come across the drowned? couple and the suitcase was right underneath their seats. [/QUOTE] They were the people sitting in front of the Marshall and Kate, where their carry on luggage would be stored. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/188 "2006-11-05T01:05:06Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] They were the people sitting in front of the Marshall and Kate, where their carry on luggage would be stored. [/QUOTE] I agree. Sometimes an extraneous character is just an extraneous character. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/189 "2006-11-05T01:10:41Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] They were the people sitting in front of the Marshall and Kate, where their carry on luggage would be stored. [/QUOTE] Except that here’s the info we got in a flashback in episode 1x23 “Exodus, Part 1” (security guard in a room, with the Marshall and Kate, before they got on the plane): **Guard** : You’re gonna be armed? **Marshall** : Yes sir, ankle holster. **Guard** (opening up the case with the guns): You have to stow this in the crew luggage compartment in the front. **Marshall** : No problemo. **Guard** : Why do you need 5 guns? So presumably the case was in the crew luggage compartment in the front of the plane during the flight. Meaning those two people could have been anywhere, really. I’d say they’d have to be seats near one of the places that the plane tore into pieces (since they were separate from any of the main airplane pieces – cockpit section, fuselage on the beach, or tail section in the water across the island). In the pilot episode, we see the tail section breaking off about 3 or 4 rows behind Kate’s seat (the seats in front of Kate were still there at least through her flashback). Not that I anal-retentively examine the details or anything why-do-you-ask? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/190 "2006-11-05T04:12:43Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] Veronica’s dad. [/QUOTE] No, you’re thinking of former \*sheriff \*Mars. ---
**Author:** ![Plynck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Plynck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plynck)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/191 "2006-11-05T07:18:09Z")
Considering that none of my predictions (none) have come to pass, this may be safely filed under Ignore. Nevertheless… I think that Ben and Juliette are messing with Jack. For what purpose, I have no idea. But they seem to be a close group who take the deaths of their own quite seriously (even if they view the Losties as expendable) so I can’t see them conspiring to kill one of their own. I think that they knew Jack would suspect some sort of brainwashing, so they started a false one as a smokescreen for the real one. Remember what Ben said to Sawyer about being a better con man… I think that regret may be the reason for Eko’s death, but exactly the opposite of what was earlier proposed. Someone asked when thing’s changed for Eko. Up to this point, Eko had a self imposed vow of silence and carved up his Jesus stick, clearly regretting his actions. It was only in this episode that he appeared unrepentant, and that is when he died. It seems that the flashbacks show that most of the characters have something to regret. Perhaps they are alive because they want a second chance, something that Eko renounced. We still haven’t seen all of Locke’s back story, and he may have some overwhelming regret that would explain why he survived. I’d have to agree with the speculation that Patch-in-the-Hatch may well be “Him” that the Others referred to. Even though they obey Ben, the way that they talked about “Him” implied a certain amount of fear. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/192 "2006-11-05T15:23:22Z")
I predict that we won’t find out who the patch guy is until after the break. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/193 "2006-11-05T16:13:09Z")
[QUOTE=Plynck] I think that Ben and Juliette are messing with Jack. [/quote] If Ben legitimately has a tumor, I can’t see this as being very practical. Jack will have to operate on him some day, and planting the idea of secretly killing him in that surgery even if you countermand it later doesn’t seem like such a good idea. If the whole thing is a mind fuck, though… > [@](#): > > I think that regret may be the reason for Eko’s death, but exactly the opposite of what was earlier proposed. Someone asked when thing’s changed for Eko. Up to this point, Eko had a self imposed vow of silence and carved up his Jesus stick, clearly regretting his actions. It was only in this episode that he appeared unrepentant, and that is when he died. It seems that the flashbacks show that most of the characters have something to regret. Perhaps they are alive because they want a second chance, something that Eko renounced. The idea popped into my head about the purgatory theory - and he worked through his issues, so he was allowed to pass through. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/194 "2006-11-05T17:04:05Z")
One possibility is that the survival of the tail section passengers was a problem as far as the Others (or whoever’s in control) are concerned. They may have simply been working to “correct” this error ever since the groups met - at this point, there’s only one tail section survivor left. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/195 "2006-11-05T17:50:25Z")
I have a theory that the tailies only purpose was to see that Bernard was reunited with Rose. Bernard could not have survived all that time by himself. Bernard had to survive because Rose _knew_ he would. Once Bernard was safe with Rose the other tailies had served their purpose and were no longer needed. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/196 "2006-11-05T17:51:46Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] If Ben legitimately has a tumor, I can’t see this as being very practical. Jack will have to operate on him some day, and planting the idea of secretly killing him in that surgery even if you countermand it later doesn’t seem like such a good idea. [/QUOTE] I’m thinking that yes, Ben has a tumor, and yes, Juliet was manipulating Jack. It’s established that Jack has a savior complex; he needs to _fix_ stuff. But on the other hand, he’s certainly very mistrustful of the Others, which may conflict with his personal ethos. If they had simply started the surgery, Jack might’ve taken it into his own head to botch the operation intentionally, to try and get back at the Others. Now, though, that an Other has planted the idea in his head beforehand, he’s more likely to question the merits of it. If he thinks perhaps that a conspiracy to kill Ben is yet another manipulation, his savior complex might win out. Still, on the off-chance Juliet is honestly trying to get Jack to kill Ben, I still think he won’t. First, of course, there’s that savior complex, not to mention he’s a _doctor_. Then there’s weighing the risks. If he saves Ben, and Ben turns out to be a bad man like Juliet says, he can still perhaps be dealt with. If he kills Ben, and it turns out to have been manipulation and he’s screwed himself by doing so, Ben’s dead and can never come back. I have to admit, I’ll be very surprised if he does botch the operation and Ben dies. Ben seems more like a villain who needs to die by falling off a cliff at a season or series finale than to be killed off as a mid-season plot point. (Of course, Lost has been very good at surprising me, so who knows.) ---
**Author:** ![tanstaafl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba8739/32.png) [@tanstaafl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanstaafl)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/197 "2006-11-05T19:48:00Z")
Something I have thought of is that Ben has told Jack that he will take him home. Whether Jack believes him or not is a different question, but the offer has at least been made. What has Juliet offered Jack? Nothing. Yeah, she made him a hamburger. True, Jack has absolutely no reason to want to help or even trust Ben, but he has absolutely no reason to want to help or trust Juliet either. Ben has at least offered him something. Juliet hasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/198 "2006-11-05T20:01:25Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] The idea popped into my head about the purgatory theory - and he worked through his issues, so he was allowed to pass through. [/QUOTE] Sure, but unless we’re going to get extremely theological, Turniphead kind of messes up the Purgatory theory, IMO. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/199 "2006-11-05T21:00:50Z")
Not necessarily. If you accept the idea of the island being purgatory, then the passengers who were killed early were those who were either good or evil. The “survivors” that we’ve been watching are those people who were balanced between good and evil. They’re being given opportunities to place themselves on either side at which point they’re sent on to their final destination. Aaron, as a newborn baby, would be neither good nor evil. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2006, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769/200 "2006-11-06T04:07:05Z")
What kind of evil does Claire have in her, though? I’ve been reading Charlie’s (semi-requited) crush on her as more of him torturing himself: she’s so virtuous, he feels he can never be worthy. I don’t see any dark/light in Claire; she’s all light. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-3-5-the-cost-of-living/378769.md?page=11)