# Lost 5.6 "316" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 18, 2009, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427 "2009-02-18T18:30:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/121 "2009-02-19T20:21:55Z")
Maybe I missed something, but… wasn’t Sun only going along because Ben told her there was a woman who could prove Jin was still alive. How did that morph into “well, I’ll get on this plane and trust all these crazy people simply on their say-so that he’s still alive, with no proof whatsoever”? That was what bugged me the most. Well, along with the innocents-on-the-plane. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/122 "2009-02-19T20:26:35Z")
She believed the story because Ben had Jin’s ring, which would convince me only that he’d had access to Jin’s finger at some point. I certainly wouldn’t buy his story about Locke giving it to him. It is ironic that Jin gave the ring to Locke to both: 1. Keep Sun away from the island; and 2. Convince Sun he is dead and Ben managed to thwart both goals with the self-same ring. ---
**Author:** ![well\_he\_s\_back](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3ab097/32.png) [@well\_he\_s\_back](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/well_he_s_back)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/123 "2009-02-19T20:47:34Z")
Ok I hereby officially apologize for the “slut” comment earlier. I’m not really a sexist pig, I just want my Sawyer happy. Sheesh. Anyway, still curious about the Ben/Widmore connections. Ben must have been keeping an eye on Widmore for awhile - He was able to plant Michael on Widmore’s freighter which somehow found its way to the island, after all. And about finding the island - did someone here speculate that Desmond’s boat (acquired from Libby) was somehow rigged to land there? Either because Desmond’s special to the island or because Widmore wanted him away from Penny. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/124 "2009-02-19T20:59:18Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > Ok I hereby officially apologize for the “slut” comment earlier. I’m not really a sexist pig, I just want my Sawyer happy. Sheesh… Sounds like you were channeling Dan Aykroyd: “Jane, you ignorant slut!” That is, showing exasperation at the character, not standing in judgment. But others in the thread started repeating the word. As far as explicating the deeper meaning of the show, I’ll let the experts continue. Loved it in the first year, then lost interest. Since the end is in sight, I’m back on board. And glad to be surrounded by people who kept the faith & can spoil me retroactively. (Although “back on board” sounds a bit scary in this context.) ---
**Author:** ![Alias](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e4f/32.png) [@Alias](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alias)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/125 "2009-02-19T21:01:05Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > Ok I hereby officially apologize for the “slut” comment earlier. I’m not really a sexist pig, I just want my Sawyer happy. Sheesh. I hate Kate. I don’t necessarily think she’s a slut, but she’s definitely fickle, isn’t she? Seriously, she goes back and forth between Sawyer and Jack depending on who is more convenient at the time. It might just be two men over a period of a few years, but the back and forth thing is a little sick. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/126 "2009-02-19T21:04:12Z")
> [@Alias](#): > > I hate Kate. I don’t necessarily think she’s a slut, but she’s definitely fickle, isn’t she? Seriously, she goes back and forth between Sawyer and Jack depending on who is more convenient at the time. It might just be two men over a period of a few years, but the back and forth thing is a little sick. I’m still waiting for the zombie three-way. On a barly-related note: The running podcast gag about the zombie season appears to be partially true given Locke’s resurrection in the preview ---
**Author:** ![Rich\_Mann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@Rich\_Mann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rich_Mann)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/127 "2009-02-19T22:07:07Z")
I would bet real money that Aaron is now in the care of his maternal grandmother. In other news; Ben (speaking to Locke last season) made a big deal about the sacrifice he was making in turning the donkey wheel instead of Locke. It meant he could never come back to the Island. So, was this just another lie or is he still on the plane, coming in for a landing at Guam International? ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/128 "2009-02-19T22:39:29Z")
> [@Rich\_Mann](#): > > I would bet real money that Aaron is now in the care of his maternal grandmother. That’s what I said to my wife during that scene last night. > [@](#): > > In other news; Ben (speaking to Locke last season) made a big deal about the sacrifice he was making in turning the donkey wheel instead of Locke. It meant he could never come back to the Island. So, was this just another lie or is he still on the plane, coming in for a landing at Guam International? I am not convinced the plane did land. I believe previews showed the female “law enforcement officer” who had Sayid handcuffed on the island. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/129 "2009-02-19T23:05:50Z")
> [@Rich\_Mann](#): > > I would bet real money that Aaron is now in the care of his maternal grandmother. > > In other news; Ben (speaking to Locke last season) made a big deal about the sacrifice he was making in turning the donkey wheel instead of Locke. It meant he could never come back to the Island. So, was this just another lie or is he still on the plane, coming in for a landing at Guam International? I think Ben’s “can never come back” was really meant as a “shouldn’t come back/really really hard to come back.” Meaning that there’s not a physical barrier preventing him, but Jacob is gonna be pissed. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/130 "2009-02-19T23:28:54Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > I am not convinced the plane did land. I believe previews showed the female “law enforcement officer” who had Sayid handcuffed on the island. That only establishes that additional people made it to the island. We expected Sayid to be there, and Jack and co. were looking around when we left them. There are at least two mystery people who were featured too prominently to be throw aways, and LEO was one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/131 "2009-02-19T23:29:50Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > I think Ben’s “can never come back” was really meant as a “shouldn’t come back/really really hard to come back.” Meaning that there’s not a physical barrier preventing him, but Jacob is gonna be pissed. I think Jacob was pissed because Ben left in the first place–he wanted Locke to go. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/132 "2009-02-20T00:38:35Z")
> [@Alias](#): > > I hate Kate. I don’t necessarily think she’s a slut, but she’s definitely fickle, isn’t she? Seriously, she goes back and forth between Sawyer and Jack depending on who is more convenient at the time. It might just be two men over a period of a few years, but the back and forth thing is a little sick. What back and forth? I don’t recall Kate and Jack banging gongs on the island the way she did with Sawyer. By the time she hooked up with Jack, she and he were off the island… and Sawyer wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/133 "2009-02-20T01:01:40Z")
I’m not sure why the thing with Sayid is that perplexing. It requires a little bit of twisting to see him on a plane to Guam, but there are two easy explanations. 1) He was being extradited to somewhere in SE Asia. I don’t recall his entire backstory but I’m sure he could be wanted in either Australia, India, Indonesia, Japan or Korea and the US Marshall was taking to Guam to transfer him to foreign possession. 2) Guam is a huge US military installation and Sayid has had plenty of contact with the CIA and other US military, perhaps he’s being taken to Guam to be used once again as a undercover agent or to answer for going AWOL. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/134 "2009-02-20T03:43:31Z")
This is what I was saying earlier - there are a lot of things that weren’t explained: how Locke died, how Sayid got arrested, how Hurley got on the plane, what happened to Aaron, what happened to Ben, etc. Considering that next week’s episode is about Locke, I’m predicting that over the next few episodes, they’re going to reveal one story per episode, meaning it’s going to be a month or two before they start actually telling the main story again. I mean, I’m guessing they’ll be revealed through flashbacks, so there will still be some progress on the main storyline, but we’re going to be stuck here for a while, and really, I don’t think it matters. They were all on the plane. Move on. Of course, there’s an outside chance that I could be completely wrong. But I doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![Strider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Strider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strider)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/135 "2009-02-20T04:28:22Z")
So how are you guys figuring that Ben was trying to kill Penny? I remember that he was standing at a pay phone on what appeared to be a waterfront but… Ahh crap, I just remembered that Ben told Widmore that he was going to kill his daughter. I forgot about that. Ahh crap… -n ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/136 "2009-02-20T04:56:58Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Of course, there’s an outside chance that I could be completely wrong. But I doubt it. [spoiler]The next episode is about Locke and how he died, but then they turn back to other stuff, it looks like from episode titles and descriptions: A bunch about Dharma, Ben, and the Lostie Dharma infiltration. [noparse][http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2008/11/season-5-episode-guide.html[/noparse][/spoiler]](http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2008/11/season-5-episode-guide.html%5B/noparse%5D%5B/spoiler%5D) ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/137 "2009-02-20T05:16:01Z")
I think there is a general rule that things in physical contact with the time-shifters shifts with them, whether or not it is inanimate objects like the guitar case, or the rope from the well, or animately hottie marshals (wasn’t she the Sheik’s daughter from Hidalgo?), or presumably the character played by the recognizable actor who overheard Jack at the ticket counter. ---
**Author:** ![Pigs\_in\_Space](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@Pigs\_in\_Space](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pigs_in_Space)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/138 "2009-02-20T06:46:49Z")
> [@Gfactor](#): > > It’s possible some were (we only saw the beginning of his career as Ben’s gunsel). Sayid did a lot for Ben, but I don’t think he did [that.](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gunsel) That said, “My mother taught me” was my favorite bit for so many reasons. ---
**Author:** ![GSV\_Consolation\_of\_Dreams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f1d935/32.png) [@GSV\_Consolation\_of\_Dreams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GSV_Consolation_of_Dreams)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/139 "2009-02-20T09:53:46Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > I too am confused about the number of passengers on the plane. It sort of looked like the gang was in 1st class but it also seemed like the plane was small and where they were sitting was the only section. But I, too, saw what looked like a mess of people behind the curtain while Jack was waiting for Lupidas. My WAG is that Hurley bought every **available** ticket, so the redshirts in the back, and the new arabic looking chap are people who bought their tickets before Hurley. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2009, 10:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427/140 "2009-02-20T10:14:34Z")
> [@Risha](#): > > Hm. I wonder how literally this “character substitution” is going to be. Or more specifically, if Frank is the pilot this time, is the smoke monster going to go after him? Frank was originally scheduled to be the pilot for 815, so it may be that he was supposed to be on the island. Hopefully he makes it there as I’d like to see more of him. I’m wondering if Kate seduced Jack in order to get pregnant and thereby be a Claire proxy and also fill the loss of losing Aaron. > [@Qwisp](#): > > My thought about the plane was that after it went over the island the original 6 just time traveled to the island during a flash.That would mean the rest of the passengers stayed put. Of course this doesn’t explain why the pilot would not make it to Guam. They found an Ajira water bottle in the future on the island, I wonder if some of the passengers are not in the same time period? We haven’t seen Jin, Sayid, Sun, or Ben yet, as well as Frank, and the two mysterious passengers. > [@Rachael\_Rage](#): > > Woo hoo - [Said Taghmaoui](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0846548/)!! > > I’ve just started listening to the podcasts. Does anyone know why Carlton and Damon call the other surivors from Flight 815 “socks?” As in, “most of the socks got killed in the flaming arrow attack.” I’m excited about Said being on the show too, if only as eye candy. “Socks” is just their way of saying “redshirt” or “unimportant background character”. Probably short for “meatsock”. > [@cmyk](#): > > It also seemed, in all his rage, he dodged getting splattered by that pendulum with blind luck. Yes! Every time he walked in the middle of the room I kept expecting the pendulum to smack him to the ground! > [@DoctorJ](#): > > In earlier episodes she would have just said, “It’s complicated,” and Jack would have accepted this as a complete and satisfying answer. As far as Ben is concerned I figured no one bothers asking him anything anymore because every word out of his mouth is some kind of lie. > [@Hampshire](#): > > I almost get the gut feeling that Widmore is behind getting them back to the island also. . I find it odd that both Widmore and Ben, enemies, are connected to Hawking. Also interesting from the preview: Locke has scenes with both Widmore and the woman who takes Sayid into custody. > [@Merijeek](#): > > I’d like to hear ANY kind explanation of why Wanted Fugitive Kate has been living a perfectly normal life in L.A. for three years. There was a whole episode about that last season (“Eggtown”). Her Mom decided not to testify against her, so the DA made a deal getting her off in return for her promising not to leave the state. > [@middleman](#): > > - Some (new?) mysterious figure built the Lamp post. Who is it?\*\* The “really clever man” was said to create the equations, not build the equations. I’m thinking Valenzetti, who was also responsible for the Numbers equation. > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Maybe I missed something, but… wasn’t Sun only going along because Ben told her there was a woman who could prove Jin was still alive. That was just a ruse to get her to the church. The real ‘proof’ was Jin’s ring which he somehow procured from Locke. What I want to know is how she knew this was his ring. It looked like a plain gold wedding band to me. Was there an inscription? > [@Rich\_Mann](#): > > It meant he could never come back to the Island. So, was this just another lie or is he still on the plane, coming in for a landing at Guam International? Well maybe: A) Ben was lying B) He can get back, but he’s not supposed to C) It transports you off the island and moves it, so it’s likely you will never be able to find it again D) All of the above I really liked this episode. The Lamp Post station was really cool with the pendulum and map on the floor (I wonder if the map, which I noticed has country lines, is current, or if it has the same countries as when it was first painted, which might give a clue as to when it was first made). The excitement of being on the plane and knowing any minute they would get to the island (and maybe crash!). Everyone ending up on the plane. The new characters. The new mysteries of what happened to Kate, Sayid, and Hurely to get them on the plane as well as what happened to Ji Yeon. The one thing I didn’t like was the whole “proxy” thing. I hope that’s not the only explanation for why Locke died. It’s kind of silly and so far doesn’t seem to be playing any major role in the plot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-6-316/486427.md?page=8)