# Lost 5.8 "LaFleur" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 4, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302 "2009-03-04T18:55:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/81 "2009-03-05T16:02:49Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Keep in mind that we didn’t see the feet of the statue, but we’re assuming that it’s the same as the four-toed one we saw in the second-season episode “Live Together, Die Alone.” Given that, I’m curious about one thing. So if it was intact in 1974 but only one foot remained in 2004, what happened to the rest of it? It appears to be made of stone, so even if it fell, the remains should have been present. Nope. I think. From what I had understood, they jumped. Stood around and saw the fully-erect (heh heh) statue and then they jumped again. Or so I understood it. I kind of got the idea that the producers showed us the statue to get us excited in a “finally we get to see what the deal is! yes!” kind of way and then jerked the rug out while laughing with maniacal glee by making them jump again. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/82 "2009-03-05T16:17:16Z")
Also, I liked Richard’s line about the sonic fence keeping “other things” out but “not us.” Is he talking about Smokey? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/83 "2009-03-05T16:23:05Z")
> [@middleman](#): > > Also, I liked Richard’s line about the sonic fence keeping “other things” out but “not us.” Is he talking about Smokey? Probably. But on the other hand, keep in mind that as long as The Others have mastered “Ladder Technology” that sonic fence won’t keep anyone out. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/84 "2009-03-05T16:30:44Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Probably. But on the other hand, keep in mind that as long as The Others have mastered “Ladder Technology” that sonic fence won’t keep anyone out. > > -Joe This reminds me of the line from the Simpsons parody of Paul Bunyen, “Why is it that we have ladders that can put a man on the roof, but we can’t find a renewable source of food?” ---
**Author:** ![TooSchoolforCool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tooschoolforcool/32/19621_2.png) [@TooSchoolforCool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TooSchoolforCool)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/85 "2009-03-05T18:05:27Z")
> [@Gfactor](#): > > We saw the back of the statue. 😃 I don’t know what disturbed me more: that it was gigantic, or that it had FOUR ASSES…!!! ---
**Author:** ![TooSchoolforCool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tooschoolforcool/32/19621_2.png) [@TooSchoolforCool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TooSchoolforCool)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/86 "2009-03-05T18:24:02Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > Does anybody know why it was so important for Richard to carry a body back to his people? > > It seems to be a weird request. As the leader of his people couldn’t he just say to them, “I saw the body of a man whom I believe was shot by our missing comrades.” This is in keeping with what we’ve learned of Richard. He’s held in reverence by his people, but he’s not THE leader, and he’s not treated as a god or anything. He’s just a guy who for some curious reason, never ages. So he would need proof to convince hotheads like Charles Widmore that what he’s saying is actually true, that they should cool it. ---
**Author:** ![tds1273](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/df705f/32.png) [@tds1273](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tds1273)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/87 "2009-03-05T18:24:48Z")
Great episode. It might just be a coincidence(if anything really is on this show), but was anyone else struck by how much Horace and Amy bore a resemblance to Sawyer and Kate? This episode at least, their pictures on Lostipedia, don’t quite do them justice. However, looking on Lostipedia, [Paul](http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Paul_%28DHARMA_Initiative%29)looks awfully similar too. Horace also shares a surname with [Olivia](http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Olivia_Goodspeed)(blond, good with a gun, smart(teacher)) ---
**Author:** ![TooSchoolforCool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tooschoolforcool/32/19621_2.png) [@TooSchoolforCool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TooSchoolforCool)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/88 "2009-03-05T18:28:10Z")
Confusion/Plot Hole time: - Why does ANYONE show surprise that any human being can bypass the sonic fence. As Kate and Locke demonstrated, all you really need is a ladder to climb over it… just like any fence. As Richard implies, it likely exists only to keep the smoke monster at bay (as we saw in season 3). But this raises the question of why the other Dharma stations aren’t similarly protected. The smoke monster can’t batter down hatches? -There is NO WAY that the time-spinny 5 (Sawyer, Juliet, Jin, Daniel, Miles), let alone the returned Oceanic 6, could have lived with Dharma during the time that Ben was there and not have run into him. If this happened, then Ben would (now) remember it, and Ben has never shown even a hint of knowing about “Le Fluer” being a Dharma muckety muck (and not even in a “Ben is a liar” sort of way: Ben is a character that’d at least let on that he mysteriously knows something about them). So I’m assuming that a) Ben arrives as a teenage boy sometime after the 3 years, and that this means that b) the time-spinny 5 won’t stick around in Dharma-ville much longer. However, and this is a super duper stretch… we still don’t know why Jin being alive was so important to Ben. It might simply have been that Locke promising not to bring Sun back was unacceptable to Ben. But, and I’m speculating wildly here… if Ben knows that Jin was part of Dharma at some point, couldn’t that info from Locke about Jin being alive have meant something important to Ben? -If that redhead that Daniel saw was NOT Charlotte (as it could not have been if we all have the times right) then you’d think the show creators would do a better job of pointing that out. It certainly makes sense that Daniel would want to stick around to warn Charlotte (no wait, it doesn’t, because Daniel already knows that he can’t change anything!!!) and for that to give him a reason to stick around for 3 years until she arrives. But they really confused the audience, in a sloppy storytelling way rather than a LOST mystery way, if that redhead was merely symbolic and not THE Charlotte. Also, re: Daniel: > [@](#): > > stammery science guy. I LOVE IT! ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/89 "2009-03-05T18:40:53Z")
Crazy theory: What if Bernard and Rose were left behind when the flash occurred to the time of the giant statue and were stranded there, eventually to die and have their corpses discovered later as Adam and Eve, leaving the black and white stones as a sign who they were. The only problem is that according to Lostpedia, Jack said that the bodies were 40-50 years old. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/90 "2009-03-05T18:43:50Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Can’t be, because Juliet was all concerned about Sun, because she’d conceived on the island. > > So, nope. Not just Otherized women. > > -Joe I dont know if we know that for sure. Juliet’s only experience with pregnancy complications on the island was with Others women. When she finds out Sun is pregnant she naturally assumes the worst. But it could be just an Others problem and not an island problem. We really don’t know much about the Others prior to the purge, and maybe it’s a problem they have from years of inbreeding or something (could be why they shot Paul and were trying to take Amy). As far as I remember, there wasn’t anything to lead us to believe Sun was having complications except for the fact that Juliet was worried about her (based on her history with Other women). I could definitely be forgetting something though. > [@middleman](#): > > Bernard was old navy man wasn’t he? He knew Morse code, and I cannot think of any other reason he would know it. Didn’t he say he picked it up in the Navy? Natural fit to be on a scavage boat if he had navy experience. > > A few random thoughts: > > - I totally missed the statue. I fast forwarded my DVR past it, because I thought it was all part of the “Previously…” I had no idea ol’ four-toe (along with Adam and Eve, my absolute obsessions on this show) made an appearance. Looks Egyptian to me. > > - There can be duplicates of people. Remember the Orchid video with the two rabbits. Apparently we just don’t want them touching each other. When did Adam and Eve make an appearance? I agree about duplicate people. I think the reason Locke didn’t want to investigate the pillar of light a few episodes ago was because he didn’t want to meet himself and alter things. A thought of my own: Why was the rope still there (buried in the ground) after Locke fell and they all flashed back in time? Was it because Sawyer was touching it when the flash happened? ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/91 "2009-03-05T18:51:13Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Crazy theory: What if Bernard and Rose were left behind when the flash occurred to the time of the giant statue and were stranded there, eventually to die and have their corpses discovered later as Adam and Eve, leaving the black and white stones as a sign who they were. The only problem is that according to Lostpedia, Jack said that the bodies were 40-50 years old. 1. Jack’s an idiot. 2. I think it’s more likely that they simply wound up as the last two standing after the reshirts all got killed off, moved to the same time zone as Sawyer and crew, died, and were possibly even found and hidden by Sawyer, et al. The previews show that he’s already having to lie a bunch more to splain where Hurley, Jack, and Kate came from. He’d probably want to do what he could to maintain his credibility. 1. I wonder if Ben learned the art of conning from Sawyer. 2. The list that supposedly came from Jacob was could actually have been made by Ben based upon his encounter with the Sawyer and crew. We haven’t been given any explanation about why they wanted them. ---
**Author:** ![Shark\_Sandwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@Shark\_Sandwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shark_Sandwich)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/92 "2009-03-05T18:58:39Z")
> [@well\_he\_s\_back](#): > > Sawyer’s eyeliner remark was just the best thing ever. The eyeliner remark was distracting for me. I’ve alway noticed it about Richard’s eyes, but I didn’t know if it was the actor, or the character (if that makes sense). Here’s a SUPER stretch: Assuming that Richard either doesn’t age, or he’s jumping back and forth through time. Richard = eyeliner Eyeliner = Eqyptian Statue = Egyptian Richard = statue So the statue is of Richard. Maybe he’ll take off his left shoe in the next episode. ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/93 "2009-03-05T19:26:56Z")
Maybe kid Charlotte did some time-hopping of her own to end up adult Charlotte in time to have Daniel fall in love with her? I just have to say, it’s amazing that one show can have the most convoluted time-travel storyline ever (Lost) and another show can have one that’s not nearly as convoluted (Heroes) and the former will be praised and the latter panned. Wild! I have just about given up on figuring out exactly what the timeline is on Lost by now. ---
**Author:** ![HoboStew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f17d59/32.png) [@HoboStew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoboStew)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/94 "2009-03-05T19:31:14Z")
> [@Trion](#): > > Which leads me to a theory I’m develping. It seems that whatever caused the baby making problem hasn’t happened yet (circa 1977). Probably “The Incident” that resulted in the button in the Swan hasn’t happened yet. Here’s the theory a buddy of mine and I are working on: When Ben takes over, he does stuff that ultimately causes him to lose the favor of the island, and the island starts trying to get rid of him. Now it can’t do it directly, thats too easy. So it starts doing it in weird islandy ways like bringing a plane with locke to replace him, giving him the illness, not allowing women to have babies causing his ranks to dwindle, getting locke to make ben turn the wheel, etc. ---
**Author:** ![psychonaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/psychonaut/32/4655_2.png) [@psychonaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychonaut)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/95 "2009-03-05T19:40:40Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Crazy theory: What if Bernard and Rose were left behind when the flash occurred to the time of the giant statue and were stranded there, eventually to die and have their corpses discovered later as Adam and Eve, leaving the black and white stones as a sign who they were. The only problem is that according to Lostpedia, Jack said that the bodies were 40-50 years old. Yeah, but does that mean he determined that Adam and Eve were 40–50 years old at their time of death, or that they’d been dead for 40–50 years when Jack examined them? If the former, they could well have been Bernard and Rose. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/96 "2009-03-05T20:09:25Z")
There’s pretty [convincing evidence (at least for me) out there](http://lost.cubit.net/) that the Statue is that of Egyptian god, Anubis. If you [look](http://lost.cubit.net/assets_c/2009/03/anubis-compare-2063.php) in his hands, it looks like he’s holding an Ankh in each. Also, I’d say the [little red-headed girl](http://lost.cubit.net/assets_c/2009/03/5x08_charlotte_girl-2021.php) that is proposed to be young-Charlotte, is only 4 years old, tops. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/97 "2009-03-05T20:19:06Z")
> [@TooSchoolforCool](#): > > Confusion/Plot Hole time: > > - Why does ANYONE show surprise that any human being can bypass the sonic fence. As Kate and Locke demonstrated, all you really need is a ladder to climb over it… just like any fence. As Richard implies, it likely exists only to keep the smoke monster at bay (as we saw in season 3). But this raises the question of why the other Dharma stations aren’t similarly protected. The smoke monster can’t batter down hatches? Remember that the BSM operates in limited area - apparently related to the Temple. For all anyone knows, New Otherton is built within the danger radius, but the others aren’t. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Trion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@Trion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trion)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/98 "2009-03-05T20:19:23Z")
> [@HoboStew](#): > > Here’s the theory a buddy of mine and I are working on: When Ben takes over, he does stuff that ultimately causes him to lose the favor of the island, and the island starts trying to get rid of him. Now it can’t do it directly, thats too easy. So it starts doing it in weird islandy ways like bringing a plane with locke to replace him, giving him the illness, not allowing women to have babies causing his ranks to dwindle, getting locke to make ben turn the wheel, etc. That’s certainly a viable theory. I think we can pretty much take it for granted that Ben looses the island’s favor. Anyway, here’s my thoery so far. Perhaps with enough duct tape and crazy glue we can fashion something that works. Like I said upthread, the island is a unique point in which the spacetime tube can be viewed/experienced in it’s complete fixed form. The Dharma Initiative concoct an experiment to link people to this aspect of the island so that people can see the future. For a while this works. The Specials brought in to view the future are able to see points in the island’s history - but there’s a little bleed through in the process, resulting in the whispers. This should have been a warning, because it’s all about to go horribly wrong. Jacob, one of the specials, get’s stuck in the experiment. He get’s spread throughout the island’s spacetime, becoming insubstantial to all but a few. Jacob goes a bit mad and wants out. We know that spacetime is slightly flexible. If something goes wrong with the small details, it can course correct. Jacob uses this ability to play with fate and destiny to bring O815 to the island, hoping the survivors can help him. So far so good. But the Survivors wind up in the past. The do something big. This incident was _really_ not supposed to happen and the universe can’t course correct on its own. It needs to be fixed and the Survivors need to get back to fix it. And when they do, they then need to get Jacob out of the experiment so he can’t do any more damage. And all this is taking place while Ben and Whidmore fight for control of the island. Oh, and there’s this monster. And some four toed statue. And, ummm… some other stuff. I haven’t got it all worked out yet, OK? ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/99 "2009-03-05T20:21:56Z")
OK, the scene where Sawyer approached the Others as they were about to kill Amy: It looked like Sawyer got shot, and he seemed surprised that he didn’t. Then it looked like they sped the camera up while he delivered perfect rifle shots of his own to the two Others. I thought that meant Sawyer had somehow gained the “Others Invisiblity” at that point…until Amy said “Who are you?” Am I alone there? ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2009, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302/100 "2009-03-05T20:25:38Z")
I thought Juliet killed the Others…or at least one of the Others…Sawyer was surprised because he thought the gunshot came from the Others but it was Juliet’s shot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-5-8-lafleur/488302.md?page=6)