# LOST 6.10 "The Package" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 30, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351 "2010-03-30T17:53:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2010, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/121 "2010-04-01T22:54:43Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I like the idea of Ben thinking he was working for Jacob when all along he was working for MiB. Remember when Locke first went to the cabin, Ben was incredulous that Locke actually heard Jacob. And didn’t we find out that Ben had never actually seen Jacob? The thing is, we find it out from Ben himself. In the Season 5 finale, Ben states to both Sun and Flocke that he has never seen or met Jacob. Then, at the end, right before killing Jacob he rants about how he was never allowed to talk to him directly and had to rely on instructions delivered by Richard. If, all those years, he had been deceived by the MiB into _believing_ he was talking with Jacob, he wouldn’t say that. ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2010, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/122 "2010-04-01T23:01:03Z")
Wait a minute, Hoss…I thought _I_ was the one accused of being pissy. (?) Now I’m _really_ lost. Anyway, I don’t get how some feel it must be proven to them that the writers had every major detail mapped out from Day One, and only then will the series be worthy of our devotion. I personally don’t give a flip if MIB was not even a glimmer in Abrams’ eye way back when. Things seem to be unfolding nicely and I expect this will continue. _That’s_ why I bought my ticket. ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2010, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/123 "2010-04-01T23:05:58Z")
> [@Arcite](#): > > **Ellis Dee** isn’t being pissy; he’s being honest. It would almost be funny, if it weren’t so annoying, that people are still saying they seriously expect answers to mysteries that were so obviously written in on a whim just to highten the drama. You can’t tell me you seriously think that the writers ever had an explanation in mind for the things **jackdavinci** refers to at the time the episodes were written. They just said to themselves, “hey, let’s put blast doors in the Swan station, and show a blacklight-lit map of the island on one of them. That’ll get people tuning in next time. Maybe if the show lasts long enough, we can invent an explanation for it later, that is, as long as we haven’t written ourselves into a corner by then.” Heck, the blast door map shows Dharma stations evenly spaced all around the island, contradicting the very idea of “Dharma territory” vs. “Others territory” we learned about later! Even if we never learn why Radzinsky drew the map (I’m guessing memory loss due to the Incident), it was very valuable. It teased several mysteries that were actually SOLVED along the way (look back. There have been plenty of solutions). E.g.- Cerberus vents, Tovar Hanso, Black Rock, all the stations, etc. Plus, I think the map has passed the test of time. Dharma was clearly building stations in Other territory. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/124 "2010-04-02T01:21:57Z")
They definitely need to explain why the hell Ben even KNEW about the cabin if he never saw Jacob or anyone else there. Why would he take John there instead of to the foot or even just some other special place where he could fake some mumbo jumbo in front of John? And does Richard know about the cabin? Does he know that Ben knows? What role does it play in anything? There must be SOMETHING to it. I mean, they go to the trouble of burning it later on. If they never even mention it again, that’ll be a bit of a storytelling gip after all the potent meaning they once gave it and all the creepy stuff that happened inside it. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Prize](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sir\_Prize](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Prize)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/125 "2010-04-02T01:49:15Z")
Kate’s name was listed at the lighthouse but not the cave. Apparently MiB is not aware so he thinks it’s OK if Claire disposes of Kate after she has helped gather the candidates. A theory: Claire is going to do something to Kate that will mess up MiB plans to get off the island. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/126 "2010-04-02T01:57:24Z")
> [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > Kate’s name was listed at the lighthouse but not the cave. Apparently MiB is not aware so he thinks it’s OK if Claire disposes of Kate after she has helped gather the candidates. > > A theory: Claire is going to do something to Kate that will mess up MiB plans to get off the island. I believe the producers have acknowledged that Kate’s name was in fact written on the cave, but you just can’t see it and/or the scenes where you could see it were edited out, or something to that effect. ---
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/127 "2010-04-02T02:26:09Z")
> [@Apos](#): > > They definitely need to explain why the hell Ben even KNEW about the cabin if he never saw Jacob or anyone else there. Why would he take John there instead of to the foot or even just some other special place where he could fake some mumbo jumbo in front of John? And does Richard know about the cabin? Does he know that Ben knows? What role does it play in anything? > > There must be SOMETHING to it. I mean, they go to the trouble of burning it later on. If they never even mention it again, that’ll be a bit of a storytelling gip after all the potent meaning they once gave it and all the creepy stuff that happened inside it. This is one thing I think it’s reasonable to hope they will explain. The cabin is part of the Jacob/MiB story, which has become the focus of the end of the series, and if the podcasts, online rumors, and such are to be believed, they’re going to wrap it up pretty tightly. What it’s pointless to even worry about anymore are the Dharma initiative and all those assorted questions from the early seasons (why the blast door map, what’s Henry Gale’s story, why was the orientation film edited, why did the hatch say “quaratine” on the inside, etc.) Though one of the online rumors says that they _are_ going to explain why the Dharma food drops kept occurring after the purge. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/128 "2010-04-02T03:05:57Z")
> [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > Kate’s name was listed at the lighthouse but not the cave. Apparently MiB is not aware so he thinks it’s OK if Claire disposes of Kate after she has helped gather the candidates. > > A theory: Claire is going to do something to Kate that will mess up MiB plans to get off the island. MiB said that Kate’s name is not on the wall “anymore.” I think this means that it was supposed to be crossed off. Yet since Jacob isn’t around, no one is crossing off names. So if Kate’s name isn’t crossed off in the lighthouse that doesn’t mean she’s still a candidate, it could just mean Jacob was killed before he could cross her name off. That’s assuming that you can be disqualified from being a candidate while you’re still alive. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/129 "2010-04-02T04:24:54Z")
> [@Morbo](#): > > I want the finale to end thusly: > > Locke is about to board the plane as everyone else watches helplessly, and then Vincent jumps on him from out of frame and bites him in the neck. > > Credits. I would be cool with this. The producers have said that, Vincent will be back > [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > I believe the producers have acknowledged that Kate’s name was in fact written on the cave, but you just can’t see it and/or the scenes where you could see it were edited out, or something to that effect. This is my memory as well. EDIT: Also what LAKAI said. ---
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/130 "2010-04-02T04:30:29Z")
I have no doubt that the “sideways” reality is the one that our heroes get “dumped” into after the climax on the island. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/131 "2010-04-02T05:04:08Z")
> [@B.Serum](#): > > I have no doubt that the “sideways” reality is the one that our heroes get “dumped” into after the climax on the island. I’m thinking this is probably the case as well what with what little time is left and I would be satisfied with it. I just don’t see how they could wrap up the main mysteries and explain what the hell the sideways flashes are in the episodes that are left unless the sideways timeline is the epilogue to the show. ---
**Author:** ![vinniepaz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@vinniepaz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vinniepaz)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/132 "2010-04-02T15:12:51Z")
> [@B.Serum](#): > > I have no doubt that the “sideways” reality is the one that our heroes get “dumped” into after the climax on the island. I really hope not. I think the epilogue theory is kind of obvious, so I’m hoping they have a twist in there at the end. I really dislike the flash-sideways. Someone mentioned it in this thread, but I find it annoying that basically half of this final season is devoted to characters that we don’t really care about. If the ATL is the epilogue, I would agree that it would be cool in retrospect but it bothers me that it comes at the expense of the enjoyment of watching it sequentially. Perhaps the producers have started to think about the legacy of the show, which I think would lend credence to the epilogue theory. Once all is said and done and we know how it’s resolved, intercutting the postscript to the story with the whole final season could be really satisfying. I just wish they hadn’t taken that route. At this point, I don’t think there’s any explanation for the ATL that would make me happy, because it was still annoying to watch “live.” ---
**Author:** ![Monocracy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monocracy/32/4493_2.png) [@Monocracy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monocracy)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/133 "2010-04-02T17:34:07Z")
I think the flash-sideways is the prologue, the beginning of the time loop. Something will happen in the last ALT story that will create the Jacob/Island/MIB situation. It will probably have something to do with Dharma. If they want to wrap it up nice and neat, they’ll also end the time loop in the last episode. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/134 "2010-04-02T18:01:45Z")
The flash-sideways was kind of interesting at first, but as has basically been pointed out up-thread, it’s hard to stay interested in it, because it’s an alternate reality and as such I’m not really invested in what happens to the characters in it. And let’s face it, the flashbacks/flashforwards/flash-sideways have always just been ways to flesh out the characters and add a little interest to the story; they’ve really never been the primary thrust of the story. I mean, OK, Jack’s a dad in the ATL. So? Ben’s a manipulative teacher. So? Unless they are going to do something with having the ATL cross over or merge with the regular timeline in some kind of spectacular and/or catastrophic way, I just don’t see the ATL mattering that much, and frankly I’m getting really bored with it. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/135 "2010-04-02T18:18:04Z")
The ATL has features of lots of pre-island changes, tho. Starting with the new 815 plane ride, we are shown that things and people aren’t the same as the original 815 flight. So it can’t just be a look at “what would have happened if 815 didn’t crash”…I think it’s more “what would have happened if Jacob never touched these people to begin with.” Or if the island never existed. Which may come to pass if something happens that causes the island to cease to be. As for all of the “filler” and unanswered mystery nonsense…I blame ABC. From what I gathered, the original writers and producers had a 3-or-4-season story arc that they presented. But ABC told them that they will need to stretch the show out indefinitely until ABC decided how long it was going to be. So the writers just started throwing in bullshit to drag the story out. Plus, at least 4 actors flaked on their contracts (the two women who got busted for DUI, Eko and Richard) so things had to be re-arranged for them (Richard did come back, natch). It wasn’t until pretty recently, IIRC, that ABC told them “ok, 6 seasons” and then the writers had to scramble back to wrapping it up on a deadline. What should have happened is that the creators said “we have a 56-episode story line.” And then ABC booked them for 3 or 4 years, set the actors contracts accordingly, and let them make one hell of a show. Instead, people got greedy and the show suffered because of it. I’m not banking on answers to all of my questions by the final episode, but I’m not putting blame on the writers at all. It’s been a fun ride at least. ---
**Author:** ![CoolHandCox](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coolhandcox/32/16233_2.png) [@CoolHandCox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CoolHandCox)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/136 "2010-04-02T19:10:29Z")
> [@CoolHandCox](#): > > …why would Jacob ever bring people to the island risking MIB’s possible escape? > [@EllisDee](#): > > If we buy into the idea that the candidates are a collective stopgap for Jacob, then the MiB couldn’t leave unless Jacob went with him, which Jacob would never do. Jacob may be less than thrilled with eternal boredom and so keeps bringing people to the island to replace him. Viable candidates are known as, uh, “candidates.” heh, those Lost writers sure are clever. I just got to thinking, when Jacob leaves the island (to go visit someone on the mainland), is that a window for MIB to leave? Is there no longer a stopgap during that time? Regardless, it seems that MIB has to leave by normal means (boat, plane, sub, ect). Therefore, with just Jacob and MIB on the island, Jacob could just head to the mainland anytime he felt bored…catch a movie, watch a ballgame, smoke a bowl, hit up some nyc clubs, go to Jazzfest, travel the world, anything…What difference does it make whether he’s “domiciled” on the island or the mainland. Jacob can leave the island in ways MIB can’t. Jacob risked everything by bringing people to the island for reasons I don’t get. It seems Jacob should be trying to keep people _off_ the island (or just planes, boats and submarines). Unless people happened onto the island by chance, but I don’ get that impression. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/137 "2010-04-02T19:59:55Z")
Cool Hand Cox: > [@](#): > > I just got to thinking, when Jacob leaves the island (to go visit someone on the mainland), is that a window for MIB to leave? Assuming that Jacob takes his job seriously - and all indications are that he does - it must not be the case. If Jacob leaving allowed the MIB to leave, I have to think he would just never leave. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/138 "2010-04-02T20:25:54Z")
Maybe MIB was getting ash-locked in the cabin while Jacob traveled? ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/139 "2010-04-02T22:03:50Z")
> [@CoolHandCox](#): > > I just got to thinking, when Jacob leaves the island (to go visit someone on the mainland), is that a window for MIB to leave? That’s a great question that hurts the stopgap theory but may not necessarily destroy it completely. We know Jacob left the island many times. Maybe MiB has to leave _with_ the plug, as in on the same vehicle? Desmond couldn’t navigate off the island when he tried to just sail away, and we later learned that boats and helicopters need to follow a very specific heading to leave the island. Maybe MiB can’t leave by some other unrelated but similar phenomenon, and his one heading that lets him leave is “with the plug.” ---
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2010, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351/140 "2010-04-03T04:37:22Z")
> [@CoolHandCox](#): > > It seems Jacob should be trying to keep people _off_ the island (or just planes, boats and submarines). > > Unless people happened onto the island by chance, but I don’ get that impression. This is what I’ve been thinking for a while, too. If it’s so important to Jacob that MiB not leave the Island, and if the only way people reach the island is if Jacob uses his Magic Touch to bring them there, it would seem the best strategy for him would be to bring no one to the island, ditch Mib there, and just enjoy his semi-immortal life in the outside world. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-6-10-the-package/534351.md?page=8)