# Lost (but known) musical recordings: What are we missing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 18, 2009, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708 "2009-12-18T03:21:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_Wikipedia_Cites)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/1 "2009-12-18T03:21:35Z")
Reading a recent book, “The Book of Lost Books”, which discusses all the major known books that have since been lost, I got to wonder, what about musical recordings? What past musical recordings did we once have, but are now lost? I know I can’t read what went up in flames at the Great Library of Alexandria, so now tell me what I am missing musical-wise. ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/2 "2009-12-18T03:40:32Z")
[Buddy Bolden](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddy_Bolden) is supposed to have recorded a couple of cylinders. No recording of him survives today. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/3 "2009-12-18T03:45:36Z")
Very little since the 1940s. Before that, a lot of stuff that was recorded is gone, unless a copy of a lost 78 turns up. Before recording, a lot of written music has been lost, some of which we know about and some we’ve never even heard of. Chances are there are lost works by _every_ major composer before the 19th century, and doubtless some from the last couple of centuries. Before musical notation became common, there’s pretty much _nothing_ that has survived. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/4 "2009-12-18T04:09:18Z")
I know Scott Joplin wrote a ragtime opera called _The Guest of Honor_. Nothing from it survives. I suppose we must be grateful _Treemonisha_ is still here, but I don’t know if the politically correct crowd would approve of it being done anywhere. A pity, because it is wonderful, and no more objectionable than _Porgy and Bess_. So the white guy’s jazz opera gets staged and the black guy’s ragtime opera is ignored. Ironic. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/5 "2009-12-18T06:55:04Z")
But it hasn’t been ignored, **Two Many Cats**. It was also lost for fifty years. In the early 1970s Atlanta staged a production of it. Houston Grand Opera Company also had performances and made a cast recording which is available at Amazon and has had good reviews. I know that it’s been on Broadway and last January it was staged in Memphis. I’m sure there are other places that I am not aware of. I expect that we will hear more and more about it. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/6 "2009-12-18T08:33:36Z")
There’s a bunch of music mixed in [this list](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_work). ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/7 "2009-12-18T13:16:19Z")
The great Paragon Ragtime Orchestra tours with _Treemonisha_ periodically and will again [beginning in February 2011](http://www.newworldclassics.com/treemonisha.htm). If you are interested, please read Rick Benjamin’s notes, for he knows whereof he speaks. ETA: On looking at the Paragon site, that is the Memphis date that **Zoe** mentions. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/8 "2009-12-18T14:30:20Z")
Drive Shaft and Geronimo Jackson. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/9 "2009-12-18T14:37:23Z")
**The Cherry Sisters** – legendarily bad performers who were supposedly unaware of their awfulness. I’d be curious to hear if they really were worse than, say, Debbie Boone, or some of the people I’ve performed musical theater with. I’d heard for years that they never recorded, but there is this: > [@](#): > > Sadly (but understandably), the Cherrys were never invited to make commercial recordings; however, Jessie cut a demo disc of her show-stopping “Fair Columbia.” A few years after her death, a brief item appeared in an Iowa paper noting that the surviving sibs were trying to buy the disc from its owner so they could hear their dear, dead sister’s voice. Problem was, they couldn’t afford the asking price of $100. (The record’s eventual disposition is unknown; it’s probably in an attic somewhere, alongside the missing reels of von Stroheim’s Greed.) > **[Early LCD | Cherry Bomb](https://www.wfmu.org/lcd/Early/cherry.html)** So there exists a possibility that we can hear _one_ of them performing. > **[Cherry Sisters](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_Sisters)** > > The Cherry Sisters – Addie (1859–1942), Effie (1867–1944), Ella (1854–1934), Lizzie (1857–1936), and Jessie Cherry (1871–1903) – were five sisters from Marion, Iowa who formed a notorious vaudeville touring act in the late 19th century. They were also the plaintiffs in a landmark 1901 legal case heard by the Iowa Supreme Court, Cherry v. Des Moines Leader, which was instrumental in establishing and confirming the right of the press to fair comment. > The Cherry Sisters' vaudeville act, Something ... ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/10 "2009-12-18T15:36:09Z")
Also – it’s not musical, but I mourn its passing – Arch Oboler’s **Lights Out** show. Apparently (according to a radio theater guy I know) someone literally dropped a stack of his fragile recordings, and the only known recordings of many were thus lost. This includes the famous _Chicken Heart_ episode, referred to in writings about the show and by Bill Cosby. Oboler recreated it for a record album in 1962, and I have a re-creation done only a couple of years ago, but it’d be interesting to have the original one, if only for historical and nostalgic reasons. > **[Lights Out (radio show)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lights_Out_(radio_show))** > > Lights Out is an American old-time radio program devoted mostly to horror and the supernatural. > Created by Wyllis Cooper and then eventually taken over by Arch Oboler, versions of Lights Out aired on different networks, at various times, from January 3, 1934 to the summer of 1947 and the series eventually made the transition to television. Lights Out was one of the earliest radio horror programs, predating Suspense and Inner Sanctum. > In the fall of 1933, NBC writer Wyllis Cooper conceived the i... > **[Arch Oboler](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arch_Oboler)** > > Arch Oboler (December 7, 1909 – March 19, 1987) was an American playwright, screenwriter, novelist, producer, and director who was active in radio, films, theater, and television. He generated much attention with his radio scripts, particularly the horror series Lights Out, and his work in radio remains the outstanding period of his career. Praised as one of broadcasting's top talents, he is regarded today as a key innovator of radio drama. Oboler's personality and ego were larger than life. Radi... ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/11 "2009-12-18T16:36:57Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Also – it’s not musical, but I mourn its passing – Arch Oboler’s **Lights Out** show. Apparently (according to a radio theater guy I know) someone literally dropped a stack of his fragile recordings, and the only known recordings of many were thus lost. This includes the famous _Chicken Heart_ episode, referred to in writings about the show and by Bill Cosby. Oboler recreated it for a record album in 1962, and I have a re-creation done only a couple of years ago, but it’d be interesting to have the original one, if only for historical and nostalgic reasons. I’ve got that 1962 album. There’s some pretty intense stuff on there! ---
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/12 "2009-12-18T16:47:35Z")
I was just reading about the Cherry Sisters recently, glad they were mentioned! It’s kind of strange to think there were aficianados of the Awful a hundred years ago, one thinks of it as a snarky contemporary mindset. (have to say, reading the title of this thread, my first thought was ‘whatever happened to my Queen album that ‘disappeared’ from that party we held at Mark’s parents’ house in the 70’s, when they went out of town for a weekend?’ I never did get that album back, nobody knew nothin’ - it was STOLEN, I just know it!) ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/13 "2009-12-19T07:32:24Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > But it hasn’t been ignored, **Two Many Cats**. It was also lost for fifty years. In the early 1970s Atlanta staged a production of it. Houston Grand Opera Company also had performances and made a cast recording which is available at Amazon and has had good reviews. I know that it’s been on Broadway and last January it was staged in Memphis. I’m sure there are other places that I am not aware of. I expect that we will hear more and more about it. Well, I’m glad to hear it. The only performance I had heard of was that Atlanta one back in the Seventies, and I saw it on videotape. I hadn’t heard of the other productions. Certainly the Lyric Opera of Chicago never touched it. I figured it was because of a _Song of the South_ type of problem. I’m glad it’s finally coming into its own after all these years. The Seventies was a long time ago. ---
**Author:** ![JHE1967](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3bc359/32.png) [@JHE1967](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JHE1967)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2010, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/14 "2010-03-14T10:05:18Z")
The 1967 Pink Floyd song “She Was A Millionaire”, written by Syd Barrett, is thought to be lost. The song was strong enough to be considered for release as the Floyd’s 3rd 1967 single but wasn’t released. No copies of the song are known to exist save for a very loose instrumental rehearsal recorded in 1970 during the Barrett LP sessions. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Q](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/898d66/32.png) [@Johnny\_Q](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Q)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2010, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/15 "2010-03-14T11:27:49Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Also – it’s not musical, but I mourn its passing – Arch Oboler’s **Lights Out** show. Apparently (according to a radio theater guy I know) someone literally dropped a stack of his fragile recordings, and the only known recordings of many were thus lost. This includes the famous _Chicken Heart_ episode, referred to in writings about the show and by Bill Cosby. Oboler recreated it for a record album in 1962, and I have a re-creation done only a couple of years ago, but it’d be interesting to have the original one, if only for historical and nostalgic reasons. > [Lights Out (radio show) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lights_Out_(radio_show)) > > [Arch Oboler - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arch_Oboler) Is it scary enough to make you want to spread jello over the kitchen floor? ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2010, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/16 "2010-03-14T16:28:39Z")
A photo exists of the night the Beatles spent a few hours with Elvis at Graceland. Apparently, it was rather an awkward meeting for all involved, but at some point they all started jamming. Nobody recorded the results but I think that would be something to hear, if only for the historic value. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/17 "2010-03-14T18:23:47Z")
Here’s a [2007 piece from Rolling Stone](http://www.rollingstone.com/rockdaily/index.php/2007/02/09/lost-music-green-days-stolen-album-kurts-demos-and-other-mythical-masterpieces/) on lost music. It does include things that aren’t truly lost, they’re just not readily available to the public (e.g. whatever Kurt Cobain demos that Courtney Love might own), as well as uncompleted projects. Not a recording, but in 1992, while Pearl Jam was on tour in Europe, two of Eddie Vedder’s notebooks were stolen from the band’s dressing room. One of these was apparently a personal journal and one was his book of lyrics in progress. Some of these songs probably would never have been recorded anyway and I guess Vedder may have salvaged some from memory, but this theft most likely did cause some Pearl Jam songs to be lost in the sense that they were never completed or recorded. ---
**Author:** ![breezman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@breezman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/breezman)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2010, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/18 "2010-03-15T02:50:54Z")
When the album Axis: Bold as Love was first produced, Jimi Hendrix lost the original mix of the first side of the album. They had to remix the whole thing, and they claimed that some of the songs, in particular “If Six was Nine” were never quite the same. Jimi left the tapes in a taxi, so it’s interesting to think that it’s possible, albeit HIGHLY improbable that it’s still out there, in some cabbie’s possession. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2010, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/19 "2010-03-15T03:05:39Z")
The original demo tapes for _Band on the Run_ were stolen from Paul in Lagos. He waxed philosophic about it years later, wondering if the mugger ever realized what was on the cassettes that he took. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2010, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708/20 "2010-03-15T03:12:36Z")
> [@Johnny\_Q](#): > > Is it scary enough to make you want to spread jello over the kitchen floor? There’s smoke and fire and Jello! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-but-known-musical-recordings-what-are-we-missing/521708.md?page=2)