# Lost Mafia/Werewolf/Psychopath **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 10, 2009, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337 "2009-06-10T15:43:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 81
**Author:** ![Telcontar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Telcontar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telcontar)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1601 "2009-07-10T16:58:55Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > This was the gambit exactly. The Vig taking a bullet for town. The One shot Vig, quasi vanilla, becomming the magnet for all of scum. > > Story would have gotten his read, > > Peded would have protected himself. > > Scum would have shot a Vanilla. > > The town would be no worse off, thanks to the Scum lynch the day before. This actually makes sense. There are very few times it makes sense for town to lie, but i think this might have been one. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1602 "2009-07-10T16:59:27Z")
For the sake of all of us, I would like to motion that we table the discussion on specifically the limited subject of **Meeko** ’s power use choices. _Unless you think he’s lying scum_, there’s not much benefit we can get out of endless recriminations about how he lied about his powers. It was a halfway decent gambit on his part if he’s telling the truth. Personally I’m inclined to believe him, if only because I have trouble imagining scum shooting off a bonus kill on Night One when the bonus killer wasn’t likely to be a Day Two lynch target. Out of curiousity, though, what’re the JSexton numbers for a game with a one-shot bonus scum killer rather than a one-shot vig? ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1603 "2009-07-10T17:02:41Z")
So. If we have other pro town vigs. Don’t identify yourself. I just take issue with the fact that I am a “Gun Owner”. And that my owning a gun was a power unto itself. Mahaloth did not answer my questions on this. Given how he prased the power, I am betting we have at least one other Vig. Perhaps with just one bullet, perhaps with more. I honestly don’t know. - Just that “You are a Gun Owner” is too… not set up for a single vig. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1604 "2009-07-10T17:04:04Z")
> [@Telcontar](#): > > This actually makes sense. There are very few times it makes sense for town to lie, but i think this might have been one. All I said, was that the PM part I cut out, told me how many bullets I held at the start of the game. I then told you all, that I had a Limited number of bullets. 1 is a VERY limited number of bullets. Is it not? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1605 "2009-07-10T17:10:57Z")
OOG Chronos, In spite of the clusterfuck of my survival, I think I am doing a lot better in this game. Compared to Crimson. Do you have any comments? OOG ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1606 "2009-07-10T17:13:47Z")
Chronos - I currently have you as Vanilla. Do I have this right? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1607 "2009-07-10T17:15:22Z")
> [@](#): > > Four Scum, including three ordinary Scum (3 x 4.5 pts = 13.5 pts) and one roleblocker (6 pts) comes out to 19.5 points. Replace one of those vanillas with a Godfather (7 pts) and the Scum go up to 22 pts. Either arrangement is possible. Five Scum is right now as it would be grossly imbalanced, and three Scum would be grossly imbalanced the other way. Are there any other plausible Scum powers that we might have? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1608 "2009-07-10T17:21:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Chronos, In spite of the clusterfuck of my survival, I think I am doing a lot better in this game. Compared to Crimson. > > Do you have any comments? Well, especially with being a one-shot, you using your bullet on Night 1 was a mistake. As a 1-shot, you want to wait for an endgame situation, and do basically what we were all assuming you’d do last Night. That said, though, once that mistake was over and done with, it looks to me like you played your role correctly for the rest of the game, leaving it uncertain how many bullets you had and trying to draw Scum actions. For your play other than your power role, I do think you’re doing better than in Crimson, but you really need to explain your votes better. Keeping a power secret is one thing, but keeping reasoning secret is another. Whenever you post anything cryptic, you should pretty much always assume that the Scum (who have the most information, and can collaborate on their reasoning) are going to figure it out, which means that making things cryptic is only keeping the information away from Town. And yes, I am vanilla. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1609 "2009-07-10T17:22:40Z")
Here is the question then. You mean to tell me, that for ALL games with color, people can Name claim on day 1, and fear nothing? ---
**Author:** ![Telcontar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Telcontar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telcontar)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1610 "2009-07-10T17:23:27Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Are there any other plausible Scum powers that we might have? from the JSP page: \* Basic Mafia: 4.5 \* Godfather: 7 \* Investigator: 6 \* Toughguy (bonus nightkill): 7 \* Daykiller (bonus daykill): 7.5 \* Roleblocker: 6.5 \* Redirector: 7 [http://wiki.flyingcowofdoom.com/mafiaWiki/JSexton\_Points](http://wiki.flyingcowofdoom.com/mafiaWiki/JSexton_Points) So Zeriel is asking what people think of Meeko as being a toughguy (bonus nightkill), i think. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1611 "2009-07-10T17:24:28Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Whenever you post anything cryptic, you should pretty much always assume that the Scum (who have the most information, and can collaborate on their reasoning) are going to figure it out, which means that making things cryptic is only keeping the information away from Town. This is like, the first real take home, direct, advice I have ever gotten on Mafia play. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1612 "2009-07-10T18:35:10Z")
> [@](#): > > Here is the question then. > > You mean to tell me, that for ALL games with color, people can Name claim on day 1, and fear nothing? Well, that depends. In Crimson, you’ll recall, the power roles (mostly) had names, but the vanillas were all just “Townsfolk”, or whatever it was. In other games, the names might be randomized, or Scum might be given safe aliases right from the get-go. For this reason, mass-claiming on Day 1 isn’t necessarily a good idea. However, even without mass-claiming, it does make sense for someone who appears to be in real danger of being lynched to claim. You were in fact in danger of being lynched at the time you claimed, so (even without knowing whether the Scum had aliases), that was a sensible move. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1613 "2009-07-10T18:42:12Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > **Could Pede have protected himself?** \*\*No Comment. What do you guys think of shortening Night? Anyone care either way?\*\* ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1614 "2009-07-10T18:43:26Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > \*\*No Comment. > > What do you guys think of shortening Night? Anyone care either way?\*\* I am in favor. Not much seems to be happening during the Night. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1615 "2009-07-10T19:06:36Z")
I’m tentatively in favor, although it’ll adversely affect the fall of Day times on weekends–if the game goes for what, three more Days then we’ll start having voting ending on the weekend, which at that point I suppose it depends on how long we think game will last. ---
**Author:** ![Telcontar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Telcontar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telcontar)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1616 "2009-07-10T19:13:40Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > \*\*No Comment. > > What do you guys think of shortening Night? Anyone care either way?\*\* Only the scum appear to do anything of interest at night these days, and I’m in favor of them having less time. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1617 "2009-07-10T19:45:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Only the scum appear to do anything of interest at night these days, and I’m in favor of them having less time. Eh, it’s not like they’ll have hard decisions, either, now that the Doctor is dead. I can’t see that a short Night would really make any difference. If anyone might have an objection, I suppose it’d be **storyteller** , but since he’s fine with it, so am I. To clarify, would this mean a corresponding increase in the length of Day, so that the full cycle is still a week, or a shortening of the entire cycle? ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1618 "2009-07-10T20:35:16Z")
We can at least confirm that there is a scum role blocker now, correct? The thing is this. Do scum role blockers get confirmation that their role block worked? Or, yet again, were scum just lucky enough to hit a power role on day 1? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1619 "2009-07-10T20:43:16Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > I’m tentatively in favor, although it’ll adversely affect the fall of Day times on weekends–if the game goes for what, three more Days then we’ll start having voting ending on the weekend, which at that point I suppose it depends on how long we think game will last. **I won’t have a vote end on a weekend. I know how many in this game are playing from work.** > [@Chronos](#): > > To clarify, would this mean a corresponding increase in the length of Day, so that the full cycle is still a week, or a shortening of the entire cycle? \*\*I’ll figure something out…or I’ll leave it the same. I mostly just want to see if anyone has major objections if I alter the timing a bit. I’ll inform everyone in advance.\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2009, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337/1620 "2009-07-10T21:01:06Z")
Hitting a power role with the role-blocker on Night 1 had to have been luck, since any detective power they might have wouldn’t have had a chance to work yet. But it wouldn’t actually take all that much luck: We have presumably about 13 Townies, out of which 4 were power roles, so they had nearly a 1 in 3 chance of hitting one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337.md?page=80) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-mafia-werewolf-psychopath/499337.md?page=82)