# Lost property with an identifiable owner. Is there a legal obligation to return it? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 10, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479 "2015-01-10T15:38:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maggie_the_Ocelot)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/21 "2015-01-13T16:04:09Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Where did he find it, how far do you live from him, and how did he return it? > > If I found something lost near my house I’d contact the owner immediately and I certainly wouldn’t try to extort any sort of reward out of them. But I wouldn’t go way out of my way to return it either. I’d be willing to meet the owner at my house, or where I work, or someplace convenient for me. But if they want me to drop it off at their house which is way out of my way and wouldn’t travel to me, I might just put the thing right back where I found it. Or more likely drop it off at a police station or something. He lives down the street from me a couple blocks - the phone fell out of my jacket pocket when I was getting out of the car, as near as I can tell, so he would have found it in the gutter or nearby when he was walking past. He returned it when I put the phone into “Lost” mode with a message “I see my phone has been found! Thank you, neighbor! Please contact me at (my work number), I really need it back.” He called me and asked if there was a reward for the phone, I said a small one (I was really low on funds). I offered to pick it up that evening, but he said he’d stop by my work and drop it off. I didn’t have any cash, so I wrote him a check for $25, which was all I could afford. That evening, he came by my house at 11pm and knocked on the door (having gotten my addy from the check) and said he was having problems cashing the check due to no ID, and asked for cash, and could I possibly make it $100? I said no, but I did have the cash, so I swapped the check for $$. Did I mention he was skeevy as hell? I’ve been locking my doors ever since - I got the distinct feeling we were being “cased”. I think he thought that having an iPhone (even if it is an old model) meant I was swimming in money and just being stingy. Anyway. That’s all beside the point of the OP, which was me wondering what I could have done if he’d declined to return it. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/22 "2015-01-13T17:41:22Z")
The glaring problem with arresting people who don’t turn the wallet/phone in to an officer is that that is both what a thief would do, and what an honest person who knows that some other people are dishonest would do. If I find a wallet, I’m not turning it in to a police officer. I know that not all police officers are 100% honest, and that somewhere between my hands and the owner’s, the cash might disappear. However, since I know _I’m_ not going to steal it, then it’s perfectly safe with me. I can go look the owner up, give them a call, and they’ll get their wallet back. ---
**Author:** ![vomit\_comet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/73ab20/32.png) [@vomit\_comet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vomit_comet)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/23 "2015-01-13T18:13:14Z")
> [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](#): > > Did I mention he was skeevy as hell? I’ve been locking my doors ever since - I got the distinct feeling we were being “cased”. I think he thought that having an iPhone (even if it is an old model) meant I was swimming in money and just being stingy. > > Anyway. That’s all beside the point of the OP, which was me wondering what I could have done if he’d declined to return it. I don’t know where you live but you **just started locking your doors**? Man, there are skeevy people in all walks of life, all professions, all neighborhoods. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/24 "2015-01-13T19:35:49Z")
I would never, ever, turn over found property to the police, unless it was a weapon or drugs or a body or something the police would actually be interested in. If you drop your wallet, I’m giving it back to you, no middle man involved. I highly suspect the police would “lose” the money inside and/or let it rot in an evidence room, anyway. Seriously, why would the cops even pull that stunt? Police know better than anyone that they aren’t the lost and found. They have more important things to do. ---
**Author:** ![steadierfooting](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@steadierfooting](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steadierfooting)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/25 "2015-01-13T19:43:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Quote: > Originally Posted by Maggie the Ocelot View Post > Very interesting! Looks like the local PD was just being lazy, then. (We knew it had been found, and what house it was in, but the fellow took a really long time to return it, the cops said they couldn’t do anything.) > Why didn’t you go to the prosecution attorney and file charges if you knew where it was. > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Alley Dweller View Post > This reminds me of New York City Police Department’s Operation Lucky Bag. > > The police left random valuable objects around the city while watching from a distance. If someone picked an object up and walked past a police officer stationed nearby, plain clothes police would arrest them. If the person turned the object in to the police officer, the officer would frisk them, demand ID, and check them for warrants. Wow! I found a wallet once, and a cell phone another time, took it home, and returned it some time a week or so later at my convenience to a at&t store, and a police station. Just like everything else these days, crap like this has ruined it for me. Now I’ll walk past it. ---
**Author:** ![Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maggie_the_Ocelot)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/26 "2015-01-13T20:24:38Z")
> [@vomit\_comet](#): > > I don’t know where you live but you **just started locking your doors**? Man, there are skeevy people in all walks of life, all professions, all neighborhoods. When I’m home, awake, and active? Yeah. If I’m at home I normally wouldn’t lock the door until bedtime, especially during the day. _shrug_ We’ve had this debate here before. Some folks lock and bolt everything as a matter of course, no matter what; some folks only do so when they won’t be home; some don’t even own a set of keys to their house. It’s all personal preference and how much risk you’re willing to put up with. ---
**Author:** ![Ornery\_Bob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/da6949/32.png) [@Ornery\_Bob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ornery_Bob)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/27 "2015-01-13T21:15:20Z")
I lost my cell phone once and immediately cancelled the service on that phone and ordered a new one. About a week later I got a call from a guy saying that he bought my phone and would I please call the phone company so they will authorize it. Naturally, I told him, “No, you’ve purchased a stolen phone and you should return it to me.” “Are you going to pay me for it?” “Dude, you bought stolen property and you’re committing a crime by not returning it to it’s rightful owner.” Click. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/28 "2015-01-13T21:33:04Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > The police left random valuable objects around the city while watching from a distance. If someone picked an object up and walked past a police officer stationed nearby, plain clothes police would arrest them. **If the person turned the object in to the police officer, the officer would frisk them, demand ID, and check them for warrants.** emphasis added And NYPD wonders why it has so many problems with the community. Oh and why is this not entrapment? And why is there probable cause for a frisk? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/29 "2015-01-13T21:46:27Z")
It’s not entrapment because people who take stuff they find lying around are predisposed to take stuff they find lying around. Entrapment is when the police get you to do something you wouldn’t otherwise do. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/30 "2015-01-13T22:27:38Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > The logic escapes me. Was there an epidemic of dropped wallets going missing, obviously pointing to thefts? Maybe they couldn’t make their jaywalking ticket quota. Unfortunately, there’s probably some degree of truth to that. Setting up a crime to happen and then arresting people is an easy way to rack up a number of arrests. After all, you have police officers already waiting at the scene before the crime is committed. It’s a lot easier than going out and finding real criminals. So let’s say there was some bad publicity about there being a lot of robberies on the subway system. The police could try to catch existing robbers and might find and arrest a few. Or they could set up a sting like this, arrest a bunch of people, and then report that they had done something about subway crime by making all those arrests. ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/31 "2015-01-13T22:33:25Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > **Alley Dweller** , that link doesn’t say what you think it says. It says that the guy they frisked had not removed the money from the wallet, but he didn’t turn it over to the police officer until after the police stopped him. Nowhere does it say anything about people who voluntarily turned over the wallet being frisked. The article says this (referring to Deputy Police Commissioner Paul Browne) before it discusses the specific example of Photographer Carlos Alayo: > [@](#): > > For almost every person busted, there was a good Samaritan who actively tried to return the wallet to the undercover who dropped it moments before or to a nearby uniformed officer. > > Browne said people who picked up the wallet but did not remove the cash were stopped, frisked and checked for outstanding warrants and released. After that general statement, they discuss the case of Alayo, who did not try to return the wallet. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/32 "2015-01-13T22:53:33Z")
Yes, but that doesn’t say “people who picked up the wallet, didn’t remove the cash, and turned the wallet over to police”. Absent any statement to the contrary, I assume that means people who walked past the uniformed officer without removing the money (as opposed to people who walked past the officer after removing the money, whom I assume were arrested instead of just frisked). ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2015, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/33 "2015-01-13T23:35:03Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, but that doesn’t say “people who picked up the wallet, didn’t remove the cash, and turned the wallet over to police”. Absent any statement to the contrary, I assume that means people who walked past the uniformed officer without removing the money (as opposed to people who walked past the officer after removing the money, whom I assume were arrested instead of just frisked). I would hope that your assumption is correct. But I would point out that “people who picked up the wallet, didn’t remove the cash, and turned the wallet over to police” is a proper subset of “people who picked up the wallet but did not remove the cash.” I mean it also doesn’t say “people who picked up the wallet, didn’t remove the cash, and had blue eyes.” Absent any statement to the contrary, should we assume blue-eyed people were not frisked? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479/34 "2015-01-14T00:16:39Z")
There’s no reason to assume anything about eye color. But if people who turned over the wallet to police still got frisked, that’d be quite a notable circumstance, notable enough that one would expect news stories to say it explicitly. Given that the news stories didn’t say it explicitly, it seems safe to assume that it didn’t happen. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-property-with-an-identifiable-owner-is-there-a-legal-obligation-to-return-it/709479.md?page=1)