# LOTR Question - Who else could have carried the ring? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 15, 2006, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810 "2006-04-15T21:47:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/61 "2006-04-17T19:50:47Z")
> [@Revenant Threshold](#): > > Anyway, I have a further question. What’s stopping Frodo just putting the ring on a chicken or something, and then just carrying the chicken in a box? In the place of a Dark Lord you would have a Chicken! Not dark, but juicy and tasty as the KFC! Treacherous as the Kung-Pao! Stronger and spicier than the Seshwan! All shall love it and want it deep fried, with gravy on the side! ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/62 "2006-04-17T19:50:54Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > If he were to do as you describe, he’d feel the incessant urge to choke the chicken… :dubious: The dirty little bugger. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/63 "2006-04-17T20:01:15Z")
> [@Revenant Threshold](#): > > Anyway, I have a further question. What’s stopping Frodo just putting the ring on a chicken or something, and then just carrying the chicken in a box? You saw (or read, or both) the way Bilbo reacted to seeing the Ring again. It would gall Frodo constantly, as \*\*Chronos \*\* says. That’s provided he could even give it up in the first place! There’s only two people who ever gave up the Ring willingly, I believe…Sam and Bilbo. And Sam doesn’t really count as he only wore it for a short time. Even Frodo couldn’t give it up willingly. > [@Chronos](#): > > (snip)he’d feel the incessant urge to choke the chicken… Gawd, I’m juvenile but this made me giggle like a madwoman. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/64 "2006-04-17T20:36:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Also note, that when Frodo asked for the ring back, Sam just _gives it to him_. No cajoling, no trying to keep it, no forgetting the envelope was still in his pocket, not on the mantleplace. He just gives it up, easily and willingly. That’s a feat entirely unparalleled, and darn near unrivalled, in the sordid history of the Ring. Sam is indeed an amazing specimine. He did have one moment of delusional grandiosity whilst wearing the Ring, but then snaps out of it, figure’s he just a gardener worth no more than a gardener’s due, and concludes the vision was absurd. I sometimes wonder if Sam was the wisest of all Hobbits, or suffered from chronic low self-esteem due to the Gaffer’s put-downs. ---
**Author:** ![Pazu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pazu/32/15522_2.png) [@Pazu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pazu)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/65 "2006-04-17T21:05:00Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > In the place of a Dark Lord you would have a Chicken! Not dark, but juicy and tasty as the KFC! Treacherous as the Kung-Pao! Stronger and spicier than the Seshwan! All shall love it and want it deep fried, with gravy on the side! And thus is also the question of “Why didn’t Gwaihir the Windlord carry it?” answered. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/66 "2006-04-17T21:57:13Z")
If what **Chrönös** postulated had indeed happened in Tolkein’s work, then instead of seeing graffiti in the 60s saying _ **FRODO LIVES!** _ we would have seen _ **FRODO’S MASTURBATING LIKE A RINGWRAITH!** _ which would have been very interesting… ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/67 "2006-04-17T22:11:00Z")
> [@Revenant Threshold](#): > > I’m not sure if this is answered in the books at all, and I read them a good while back. Who else would have been able to carry the ring as far as Frodo did without being corrupted? Frodo’s boyfriend could have carried it. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/68 "2006-04-17T22:26:18Z")
> [@Loopydude](#): > > Sam is indeed an amazing specimine. He did have one moment of delusional grandiosity whilst wearing the Ring, but then snaps out of it, figure’s he just a gardener worth no more than a gardener’s due, and concludes the vision was absurd. I sometimes wonder if Sam was the wisest of all Hobbits, or suffered from chronic low self-esteem due to the Gaffer’s put-downs. I think it is both. Sam was a most remarkable and wise Hobbit and he did have low self esteem. Not just from Gaffer, but from being the only commoner among the upper class and Royalty. Frodo, Merry, Pippin & Gimli were all educated and upper-class. Boromir, Legolas and Aragorn were nobility. Gandalf was Gandalf. After the scouring of the shire there is a line about the respect of the Shire. > [@](#): > > Frodo dropped quietly out of all the doings of the Shire, and > Sam was pained to notice how little honour he had in his own country. Few > people knew or wanted to know about his deeds and adventures; their > admiration and respect were given mostly to Mr. Meriadoc and Mr. Peregrin > and (if Sam had known it) to himself. > [@Anaamika](#): > > You saw (or read, or both) the way Bilbo reacted to seeing the Ring again. It would gall Frodo constantly, as \*\*Chronos \*\* says. > That’s provided he could even give it up in the first place! > There’s only two people who ever gave up the Ring willingly, I believe…Sam and Bilbo. And Sam doesn’t really count as he only wore it for a short time. Even Frodo couldn’t give it up willingly. Frodo was prepared to give up the ring at the Council. He offered it to Gandalf and Galadriel and let Tom physically hold it. The Ring had far less hold on Frodo early on. But it was too strong for him in the end, especially in his weakened state. I doubt Bilbo would have been able to drop it in Mt. Doom either. Samwise I think may have been able to complete the quest, but only because the ring would have had little time to work on him. Jim ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/69 "2006-04-17T22:42:29Z")
> [@What Exit?](#): > > Frodo was prepared to give up the ring at the Council. He offered it to Gandalf and Galadriel and let Tom physically hold it. The Ring had far less hold on Frodo early on. But it was too strong for him in the end, especially in his weakened state. I doubt Bilbo would have been able to drop it in Mt. Doom either. Samwise I think may have been able to complete the quest, but only because the ring would have had little time to work on him. > > Jim _But Bilbo did give it up_. The importance of that moment is unparalleled, AFAIK, throughout the history of the world. Yes, he gave it up because he thought it would be safe, but he still did what no one else could do. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/70 "2006-04-17T22:43:30Z")
Sorry, didn’t finish: But I do agree that at the moment over Mount Doom, the ring was working to its utmost. It sensed its own destruction, no doubt, and was fighting for its very survival. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/71 "2006-04-17T22:48:16Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > _But Bilbo did give it up_. The importance of that moment is unparalleled, AFAIK, throughout the history of the world. Yes, he gave it up because he thought it would be safe, but he still did what no one else could do. Very true and even Bilbo had problems in the end. First he forgot to leave it, then he put it back in his pocket. Mr. Bilbo Baggins was a most remarkable Hobbit and cherished by Elves, Dwarves and future Kings. In all of Gandalf’s years, he never made a wiser or more fortuitous decision than Shanghaiing Bilbo into the Erebor enterprise. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2006, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/72 "2006-04-17T22:49:33Z")
> [@What Exit?](#): > > Very true and even Bilbo had problems in the end. First he forgot to leave it, then he put it back in his pocket. Mr. Bilbo Baggins was a most remarkable Hobbit and cherished by Elves, Dwarves and future Kings. In all of Gandalf’s years, he never made a wiser or more fortuitous decision than Shanghaiing Bilbo into the Erebor enterprise. Oh yes. Who knew? Amazing what fate leads us into. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/73 "2006-04-18T01:58:44Z")
> [@BMax](#): > > **Quadgop the Mercotan** could have carried the ring to Mount Doom. Hell, anyone could have carried it as long as there were a couple watching him, ready to shove him into the crevice of lava should he decide to keep the ring for himself. I think it’d be rather interesting to see Sybly Whyte’s version of LOTR, with a Mercotan slithering its way up Mount Doom. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/74 "2006-04-18T02:11:38Z")
**Quadgop** , I just went searching for what the heck a Mercotan was. Haven’t found it yet, but is there a website maintained by you with your posts on this board? It has no name on it… ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/75 "2006-04-18T02:12:39Z")
Sigh…Ok, I give. What is a Mercotan? ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/76 "2006-04-18T02:21:57Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > Don’t loose sight of the fact that Radagast _failed_ as one of the Istari. All he had to do was chat up the people of Middle-Earth, tell them to keep a stiff upper lip, that sort of thing. But, no. He has to go off to play with the bunnies and birds. That wizard may have been a granola eater, but didn’t have a lot of moral fibre. No way! Oh, I can see how it might _appear_ that way to some of your more short-sighted, self-involved mortal races, but when one considers the big picture, Radagast’s key role becomes clear. Indeed, you just said as much yourself: the Istari were sent to rally the peoples of Middle-Earth, and you suggest that Radagast abdicated that responsibility by focusing on “the bunnies and birds.” Gandalf himself also notes of Radagast that “the birds are especially his friends.” This bears emphasis: _The birds are especially his friends_. And in Middle-Earth, the birds are a force to be reckoned with. How many times did the Eagles save the day in the nick of time? We are told that they are “not kindly birds;” proud and aloof of bearing, denizens of high mountains and far wild places. Yet time and again they went out of their way to aid the forces of Men and Elves when things were at their worst. Why should this be the case? I suggest that it was in fact Radagast who constantly urged the Eagles to action, in much the same way that Gandalf sought to rally and inspire Men. Note that Radagast was said to live at Rhogsobel, which is practically within spitting distance of the Misty Mountain Eagles’ eyrie-- quite convenient for a valued counsellor to the Lord of the Eagles. Recall, also, the manner in which Gandalf escaped from Orthanc. Earlier he’d asked Radagast to gather as much information as he could and send it to Orthanc by messenger. Obviously such a task could have been carried out by any swift, trusty Eagle (or raven or thrush, for that matter). Yet who actually went out of their way to deliver those messages? Gwaihir, one of the mightiest of the Eagle lords. Why? _Because Radagast asked him to._ That’s how respected Radagast was among the bird folk. Would there be a King in Gondor were it not for the timely arrival of the Eagles at the gates of Mordor? Unlikely. Again, the hand of Radagast at work. The rout of the Goblins at the Battle of Five Armies? Radagast. I’m telling you, _it’s all about Radagast._ > [@](#): > > Also, that’s not an umlaut; it’s a diaresis. It’s there to tell you to voice the “ë”, not to shift its pronounciation. You’re saying that instead of wielding a flaming umlaut… I have flaming diaresis? _Curse those Mordor beans!!!_ ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/77 "2006-04-18T02:39:06Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > **Quadgop** , I just went searching for what the heck a Mercotan was. Haven’t found it yet, but is there a website maintained by you with your posts on this board? It has no name on it… Nope, not me. What is a Mercotan? Perhaps you should ask what is _not_ a Mercotan? When you can unlock that riddle, then you will be prepared for the whole story. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/78 "2006-04-18T02:47:50Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > Nope, not me. > > What is a Mercotan? Perhaps you should ask what is _not_ a Mercotan? When you can unlock that riddle, then you will be prepared for the whole story. > > 😃 Er…do you want the link? Because it sure has a \*lot \*of your posts. Aha! Is this it: > [@](#): > > Edward E. Smith has written military SF (see detailed battle tactics in > various books), romance SF (Kim/Chris), space opera (well, duh), SF > comedy (Quadgop the Mercotan), SF mysteries (who was the murderer on > Radelix) and fantasy (human lensmen who are ‘utterly incorruptable’). ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/79 "2006-04-18T02:59:55Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Er…do you want the link? Because it sure has a \*lot \*of your posts. Not necessary, thanks. > [@](#): > > Aha! Is this it: **Qadgop the Mercotan** was a novel written by Sybly Whyte, about the adventures of said QtM. Sadly, only a few passages from the novel survive. And there’s no U in Qadgop. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2006, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810/80 "2006-04-18T03:03:48Z")
[hijack]And if you really want to learn more, google “zymolosely polydactile tongue” [/hijack] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lotr-question-who-else-could-have-carried-the-ring/352810.md?page=5)