# Lots of people are running against Pelosi. Who (if anyone) replaces her? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 19, 2018, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824 "2018-03-19T14:08:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/1 "2018-03-19T14:08:41Z")
IMHO, the whole anti-Pelosi boomlet in the Democratic Party is a bad case of Dems internalizing GOP demonization of one of their own. Be that as it may, though, the boomlet is there. But it seems to lack an alternative. As the #2 man in the House Democratic Caucus, Steny Hoyer (who incidentally is my Rep) would be the obvious choice. Maybe I’m not reading the right places, but I haven’t heard much pro-Hoyer chatter. The NYT Politics twitter feed [says](https://twitter.com/nytpolitics/status/975451031285968896): > [@](#): > > Senior Democrats have begun jockeying to replace Nancy Pelosi as their House leader. Several veteran lawmakers have endorsed Joseph Crowley to succeed her. “I think we should start fresh,” one explained. Ummm, _who??_ I may not be the junkiest of political junkies, but I follow politics pretty closely, and I have no recollection of having heard this guy’s name before. He represents Queens and the Bronx, [was basically handed his seat by his predecessor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Crowley#U.S._House_of_Representatives) two decades ago, and doesn’t appear to have done anything particularly noteworthy since. Anyhow, here’s a thread for discussing whether someone should replace Pelosi as Speaker or House Minority Leader, depending on the midterms, and who should be the replacement. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/2 "2018-03-19T14:53:31Z")
Well, Pelosi wasn’t exactly famous before she ascended to the leadership, either. She was known but not a national figure. One of the essential requirements for a Majority Leader/Speaker is that it goes to someone with a safe seat. If they’re busy wrangling things on the bigger stage they need to not be worrying about re-election. Whoever has it WILL take some actions that piss off their own party base from time to time so having a large margin for error is an essential part of the gig. Pelosi has such a seat. No party other than the D has held it since 1949. If she keeps the primary under control she doesn’t have to worry about such. Crowley first won in 1999 in the NY-07 and is now in the NY-14. He hasn’t taken less than 69% of the vote in NY-07. He’s got the safe seat part locked down. Whether he’s got the rest of what it takes I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/3 "2018-03-19T15:00:22Z")
Not sure if Crowley would be good or not but the fact that the bench of “qualified” next generation Dems in the House to replace the ones well over 70 (Pelosi is 77, Hoyer is 78, Clyburn is 77) is so thin is a real problem. The raw talent is likely there. The now elderly leadership seems to have failed to groom and advance them. Maybe they see their positions best secured if there is no alternative prepared? In that context someone not so old needs to jump in to be the upstart. Waiting to be advanced and being deferential to the established old guard won’t do. Crowley seems to be the likeliest to do so and not too objectionable to any faction. Will there be a more progressive alternative? A more Blue Dog one? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/4 "2018-03-19T15:00:45Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > IMHO, the whole anti-Pelosi boomlet in the Democratic Party is a bad case of Dems internalizing GOP demonization of one of their own. To the extent that it exists among voters, it’s the same old misogyny telling itself it’s really about corruption, the Old Ways, the Establishment, the Corporate Fascists etc. that we’ve seen so much of when focused on Clinton. To the extent you see it among candidates (is there more than just the guy who won in PA?), it’s pandering, and they’ll do what they need to do when they get to DC. So, shrug it off. The more interesting aspect is what Mueller is going to come up with on Pence, not just Trump. If they both go overboard (whether by jumping or pushing), the choice of Speaker is the choice of the next President. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/5 "2018-03-19T15:05:20Z")
She’s CA 12th district. That’s about as deeply blue as anywhere in the world. Trump targets her because trump hates CA as much as CA hates trump. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/6 "2018-03-19T15:13:31Z")
There’s also been some talk of Adam Schiff (he of the House Intelligence Committee). My guess is that Pelosi survives. If the Ds take back the House, it would be difficult to oust their leader in the wake of that achievement, and the argument for doing so would be a lot less compelling. If the Ds fail to do this, then the anti-Pelosi argument gets easier, but conversely that would mean that there would be fewer centrist members, and it’s from this group that the opposition to Pelosi tends to be drawn. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/7 "2018-03-19T15:22:04Z")
I think Nancy Pelosi is great and a very capable Speaker, far more so than Boehner and Ryan have been. She can run her caucus far better than they, perhaps due in part to the fact that her caucus does not have a batshit crazy wing. Despite all of that, I would prefer that she stepped aside in favor of someone less toxic to the opposition and someone that Republican candidates will not be running against in 2018. The goal is to maximize Democratic seats, and if an alternate leader accomplishes that we should take it. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/8 "2018-03-19T15:24:14Z")
Absolutely not. Letting the opposition have veto power over your leaders shows only weakness to an electorate that values strength. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/9 "2018-03-19T15:47:06Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Absolutely not. Letting the opposition have veto power over your leaders shows only weakness to an electorate that values strength. I suppose it really doesn’t matter much as the red side needs to put a face on the blue side, then try and make that face evil. It’s going to come down to someone. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/10 "2018-03-19T15:47:36Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > To the extent that it exists among voters, it’s the same old misogyny … Which of course is why voters dislike Paul Ryan just as much. Nothing at all to do with the voters’ dislike of how Congress does not work well in general and the always salable “change” mantra. Pelosi’s strengths have been fundraising and being a field marshal. Her weakness is her poor ability to strongly articulate a unifying positive vision for the party. The times may need fundraising from the powerful less and someone who can be that a strong voice more. (Being a field marshal still is needed.) She likely stays because they’ve not prepared a next generation to take over and there may be no viable alternative. But that is bad. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/11 "2018-03-19T15:50:23Z")
It’s not letting the opposition choose your leaders, I think it’s recognizing that the leader that you currently have may be costing you a few seats and potentially even the control of the Senate if enough anti-Pelosi sentiment keeps the Democrats short of flipping that chamber. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/12 "2018-03-19T15:54:00Z")
You’re mistaking anti-Pelosi sentiment for what is mostly anti-whoever-is-the-Dems’-leadership sentiment. That will \*always \*be there, whoever that is, because They will always manufacture it. There is absolutely no point in going down the list until you find someone the regressives will find acceptable, especially if that means disqualifying all women. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/13 "2018-03-19T16:24:24Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > The more interesting aspect is what Mueller is going to come up with on Pence, not just Trump. If they both go overboard (whether by jumping or pushing), the choice of Speaker is the choice of the next President. It’s a nice fantasy, but they’ll never go down simultaneously. Actually, they’ll never go down at all with a republican congress. If Trump was impeached and convicted, Pence would become president and choose a new VP. The new VP would have to be confirmed, of course. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/14 "2018-03-19T17:36:27Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > To the extent that it exists among voters, it’s the same old misogyny telling itself it’s really about corruption, the Old Ways, the Establishment, the Corporate Fascists etc. that we’ve seen so much of when focused on Clinton. To the extent you see it among candidates (is there more than just the guy who won in PA?), it’s pandering, and they’ll do what they need to do when they get to DC. So, shrug it off. > > The more interesting aspect is what Mueller is going to come up with on Pence, not just Trump. If they both go overboard (whether by jumping or pushing), the choice of Speaker is the choice of the next President. this is why i’m wondering what happens between nov. and jan. should the dem.s get majorities. i would think that rep.s would rather have trump out with pence sliding into place than take the chance of president pelosi. i believe that nov. to jan. is going to be the most dangerous time for the trump presidency. the elections are done, should the dem’s pull out a huge win, there would be less reason to stick with trump. there is a small chance of pence getting knocked by mud from being part of the campaign. although i’m fairly confident that pence had no idea of what was going on with trump’s finances and campaign shenanagans. pence is not an “inner circle” guy. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/15 "2018-03-19T19:29:55Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > If Trump was impeached and convicted, Pence would become president and choose a new VP. The new VP would have to be confirmed, of course. Which takes majority votes of both houses of Congress. If that happened anytime between now and January 2, 2019, Pence’s choice for veep would sail through. Still won’t happen, though. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/16 "2018-03-19T19:38:34Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Well, Pelosi wasn’t exactly famous before she ascended to the leadership, either. She was known but not a national figure. She had been House Minority Whip for a few years before becoming Minority Leader. And before that, she’d been ranking member on the House Intelligence Committee, and on the Appropriations Committee. She was hardly some nobody, got quoted in the papers frequently. Crowley is more like the Dems’ answer to Dennis Hastert. And in Hastert’s case, Tom DeLay was clearly the power behind the Speaker’s chair. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/17 "2018-03-19T19:45:30Z")
If the Republicans like to point out that Nancy Pelosi is from that evuhl hotbed of liberalism, San Francisco, is Joseph Crowley in better, being from that evuhl hotbed of liberalism, New York City? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/18 "2018-03-19T19:46:38Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Not sure if Crowley would be good or not but the fact that the bench of “qualified” next generation Dems in the House to replace the ones well over 70 (Pelosi is 77, Hoyer is 78, Clyburn is 77) is so thin is a real problem. > > The raw talent is likely there. The now elderly leadership seems to have failed to groom and advance them. Maybe they see their positions best secured if there is no alternative prepared? > > In that context someone not so old needs to jump in to be the upstart. Waiting to be advanced and being deferential to the established old guard won’t do. > > Crowley seems to be the likeliest to do so and not too objectionable to any faction. Crowley’s Google pix make him look like he’s at least 70 - I was surprised to find out he’s only 56. He may be a new generation, but he’s damned sure not going to look the part. I think that if the Dems re-take the House in November, Pelosi could be Speaker once again, but work to get younger people in the Majority Leader, Majority Whip, etc. posts. (Take one for the team, Steny. :)) ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/19 "2018-03-19T19:46:45Z")
If Tom DeLay would have had enough support he would have become Speaker himself. IIRC, the way Hastert made it to the top was that a couple of Speakers or Speaker candidates had just resigned due to extramarital affairs or similar scandals, and at that point the Republicans were looking for the safest choice possible. At the time, Hastert seemed like the guy, inoffensive guy well liked by everyone. Little did anyone know … I don’t think the Democrats are in a similar situation, but from what I’ve read about Crowley, his candidacy is based on a somewhat similar dynamic. This is an example of how the insiders see things differently than the public at large. The insiders see the non-flashy types. The public only sees the ones who get on TV or make dramatic moves and speeches. The problem with the latter is that they frequently have strong opponents as well as strong supporters. Crowley is apparently someone who hasn’t alienated anyone, and his candidacy is (said to be) based on a broader appeal than some of the better known names. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2018, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824/20 "2018-03-19T19:53:55Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I think Nancy Pelosi is great and a very capable Speaker, far more so than Boehner and Ryan have been. She can run her caucus far better than they, perhaps due in part to the fact that her caucus does not have a batshit crazy wing. > > Despite all of that, I would prefer that she stepped aside in favor of someone less toxic to the opposition and someone that Republican candidates will not be running against in 2018. The goal is to maximize Democratic seats, and if an alternate leader accomplishes that we should take it. I mostly agree, but I think she should step aside just because she’s getting too old and the Democrats need to get some young folks into the highly visible spots. And by “young” I mean someone who is closer to 45 or 50 rather than 80. Pelosi was a very good Speaker, but her time has passed. She and Hillary and Bernie and even Biden need to let it go. And although the Republicans like to demonize Pelosi as being far on the left fringe, a little known fact is that she is actually the most conservative person in the entire city of San Francisco! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lots-of-people-are-running-against-pelosi-who-if-anyone-replaces-her/810824.md?page=2)