# LSD: what is the nature of a "bad trip?" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 21, 2014, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222 "2014-11-21T03:21:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2014, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/41 "2014-11-22T18:33:44Z")
A trip is a wish your [neurogenetic circuit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-circuit_model_of_consciousness#7._The_neurogenetic_or_morphogenetic_circuit) makes. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2014, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/42 "2014-11-22T19:59:39Z")
> [@HoneyBadgerDC](#): > > I did have one pretty horrible experience but I don’t think it lasted long. Pac man style meteors comming at me before pac man was invented. Fortunately I was able to outrun them. Was this before or after [The Langoliers](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Langoliers) was published? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![micky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a5b964/32.png) [@micky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/micky)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2014, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/43 "2014-11-22T22:54:30Z")
> [@Flywheel](#): > > To quote the last entry of MAD Magazine’s “A Psychedelic Diary”: Everything is back to norbal. Hahaha, That’s hysterical Growing up in the 60s I did way more psychedelics than necessary, some trips were good, some were bad, some were terrifying. Much later in life I discovered that the bad ones were just like the anxiety acts I was having. A couple of Lorazepan and gone! Amazing. Kind of bummed to realize I was paying $2 bucks a hit for anxiety attacks. Makes me feel like a Woody Allen movie. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2014, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/44 "2014-11-23T21:59:42Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Not to hijack, but if the role of a babysitter is to keep you from having a bad trip, could some intelligence-agency interrogator deliberately give a subject LSD and then try to make the trip as nightmarish as possible? > [@njtt](#): > > I believe, though, that eh CIA came to the conclusion that this was not a very useful interrogation technique. I think subjects just became incoherent, rather then telling the interrogators what they wanted to know. > > Unlike physical torture, with a bad trip, the torturer cannot readily make it stop, and so cannot promise to. Yeah, it’s very good for inflicting psychological suffering and emotional trauma and such, but damn near worthless for extracting valuable information. It took the Americans quite a while to give up on it, though - throughout the 50’s and 60’s, [there were a lot of tests, often on unwilling and unwitting subjects](http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/high-anxiety-lsd-in-the-cold-war). Absolutely incredible article, that one - and often very disturbing. For example, in order to figure out “if the Oriental reaction to LSD was different from the Caucasian reaction,” the Army intelligence command set up shop in a number of Asian countries, and went to work, administering gargantuan doses: > [@](#): > > On September 10th [1962], a subject was slipped LSD shortly before 11:30 A.M., and by 12:25 P.M. he began to exhibit severe reactions. “He broke out into a sweat and collapsed over the table,” a medical report noted. “He was carried to a bed with imperceptible pulse, obviously in shock; corneal and lid reflexes were imperceptible.” After remaining unconscious for an hour, the man gradually became more alert, but he was still addled. “He was propped up in an interrogation chair by team members and interrogation attempted no relevant answers,” the report explained. Every fifteen seconds or so, “with little regard of pain,” the subject would allow his head to collapse onto the table. Hours later, he began to babble to one of the Special Purpose Team members, who responded only by humming cryptically. The report noted that after six hours the subject began to speak, and “begged to be spared the torture he was receiving. In this confused state, he even asked to be killed in order to alleviate his suffering.” The American reaction? Next time, they increased the dose by 50%. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/45 "2014-11-24T01:27:21Z")
I’m still waiting for the flashbacks I was promised! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CheshireKat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheshirekat/32/1207_2.png) [@CheshireKat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CheshireKat)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/46 "2014-11-24T01:35:26Z")
> [@picunurse](#): > > I’m still waiting for the flashbacks I was promised! 😃 Yes, me too! I would love to see that Van Gogh sky again. ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/47 "2014-11-24T03:25:12Z")
I don’t think you could call anything I experienced actual hallucinations, but, changes in perceptions. My first time we went to the main campus at KU. I sat on the lawn in front of the statue of [Icarus Falling](https://www.google.com/search?q=icarus+falling+statue+at+KU&biw=1876&bih=948&tbm=isch&imgil=cBhyvEQhS3wM-M%253A%253Bl1tAb2e9NVKE2M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fdregstudiosart.blogspot.com%25252F2013%25252F09%25252F76-images-from-philadelphia-museum-of.html&source=iu&pf=m&fir=cBhyvEQhS3wM-M%253A%252Cl1tAb2e9NVKE2M%252C_&usg=__qsdLPWvLzMasAtIn68i9Q_lB6ss%3D&ved=0CCsQyjc&ei=kaByVJZtiauMAp_6gPgK#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=n3WgXz-NlWqUzM%253A%3B8SYW--hsR9ZJZM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fbuildings.ku.edu%252Fui%252Fimages%252Fsculptures%252Ficarus_lg.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.woodenboat.com%252Fshowthread.php%253F156046-Photo-Scrabble%252Fpage7%3B400%3B600) and cried. It was outside the school of aeronautics or some such. (It was 40 years ago, so memory does not serve.) If I remember correctly, I thought it really meant that all attempts to advance society were futile. I was with 5 other people, four of whom had the maturity of mayflies. The other was our “safe net” He was completey sober and he was the only one who got it. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/48 "2014-11-24T03:43:04Z")
> [@picunurse](#): > > I don’t think you could call anything I experienced actual hallucinations, but, changes in perceptions. First time I did it, I knew it took an hour to set in. I took a half a hit (of something I knew was very strong). Waited an hour…nothing, took another half…nothing, took a third half (I’m not sure if I realized how much I was taking at this point) and felt VERY energetic. I didn’t know getting all bouncing off the walls feeling was just the onset and I thought that was it, so I took the last part. A little while later I had mostly forgotten about the TWO hits of acid I took and went with some friends and smoked a bowl. I remember thinking A)What IS this song (it was The End by The Doors) and B)Why is the wood grain on her desk filling in with colors. Then I remembered that I took all that acid and the pot kick started it. I did remembering hearing that the trick to getting your trip started is getting high. I had full on visual and audio hallucinations. My audio ones were pretty much just what you might call disturbances in my hearing, nothing added, but I remember the radio sounded like a skipping CD. But the visuals…wow. I always compare it to the scene in Fear And Loathing when the [carpet starts moving](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOmtVFQ3WF8#t=1m0s), that’s just about exactly what I had a few hours of. Anything with any kind of a pattern in it came alive. It didn’t climb off the plane it was on (like it does in that clip), but it would move around, fill in with color, raise up and fall back down. It was surreal, for lack of a better term. “Changes in Perception” sound more like shrooms to me, but that’s probably because they were so gross tasting I couldn’t eat enough of them to really go balls to the wall. “Hey guys, lets put them in our ice cream”. Know what that does, it makes your ice cream taste like chewy crunchy nasty dried mushrooms. I think eating them with a handful of potato chips was about the easiest way to get them down since it sort of covers the consistency as well. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/49 "2014-11-24T04:11:31Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > But the visuals…wow. I always compare it to the scene in Fear And Loathing when the [carpet starts moving](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOmtVFQ3WF8#t=1m0s), that’s just about exactly what I had a few hours of. Anything with any kind of a pattern in it came alive. It didn’t climb off the plane it was on (like it does in that clip), but it would move around, fill in with color, raise up and fall back down. It was surreal, for lack of a better term. I posted [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEYRBTZWu8U) in MPSIMS a year or two ago, and a respondent felt that it captured the feel of his LSD experiences very well. Does it bear any resemblance to the effects you saw? ---
**Author:** ![CheshireKat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheshirekat/32/1207_2.png) [@CheshireKat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CheshireKat)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/50 "2014-11-24T04:28:48Z")
[THIS](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCHFAsXYHGA) is more what it was like for me. Halfway through, when he starts manipulating the painting - that’s what it was like to finger paint on acid. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/51 "2014-11-24T04:31:11Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I posted [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEYRBTZWu8U) in MPSIMS a year or two ago, and a respondent felt that it captured the feel of his LSD experiences very well. Does it bear any resemblance to the effects you saw? No, not at all. That’s far more intense than what I had. It was almost dead on to that scene in Fear And Loathing when the pattern in the carpet was moving. At least as far as the visuals were concerned. Also, once, I felt like I was about 100 times higher than I had ever been, but once I kept that in mind, I was more than aware that what I was seeing was just a hallucination (as opposed to a delusion), that it was from the drug that I took and that it would settle down in a few hours. For me, nothing was cartoony and I wasn’t lost or immersed in it. It sort of added some new colors and patterns to reality, it didn’t replace it. I wasn’t going to start talking to the walls or worry that I was never going to come back. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/52 "2014-11-24T07:38:56Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I posted [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEYRBTZWu8U) in MPSIMS a year or two ago, and a respondent felt that it captured the feel of his LSD experiences very well. Does it bear any resemblance to the effects you saw? There you go. 😃 That expressed the the impressions of the more radical levels of it better than any media production I’ve ever seen before. > [@CheshireKat](#): > > [THIS](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCHFAsXYHGA) is more what it was like for me. Halfway through, when he starts manipulating the painting - that’s what it was like to finger paint on acid. Wow. That one too. That feels very true to the more moderate levels of the experience. Just unearthly beautiful. ---
**Author:** ![by-tor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/by-tor/32/266_2.png) [@by-tor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/by-tor)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2014, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/53 "2014-11-24T15:44:50Z")
My bad trips on LSD taught me that you can physically feel the horror of the existential meaninglessness of the universe. Not fun. Also, apparently there are undulating faces in everything, including your skin and they are not happy. They look like souls trapped in Hades. Grass fields looked like oceans of arms, much too alive and freaky. Pine trees on the other hand, were pretty neat, as spinning warriors. The overall, yucky, “artificial, chemical” feeling of acid took months to leave my brain. These bad trips felt like years of traumatic psychotherapy condensed in a few days. Yes, bad tripping for days sucks. Finally, never talk to your parents on acid, especially about their (lack of) reasons for bringing you into this world. It is just sad. I’ll stick to Cubensis mushrooms thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Mangosteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Mangosteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangosteen)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/54 "2014-11-25T00:07:46Z")
Never was really comfortable taking what was supposed to be LSD. I just didn’t know where it came from or who made it. Fortunately my friends and I lived in the San Diego area and knew someone that smuggled in peyote buttons from Mexico. Never had any experience with peyote that could be called a bad trip. I just made sure that I was in the middle of nowhere either on a deserted beach or in the desert before eating it. Never understood people taking hallucinogens at a party. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/55 "2014-11-25T05:20:06Z")
A different type of bad trip includes seeing potentially terrifying images of snakes, spiders, dragons, or assorted demons lunging at you and regenerating. It can be pretty cool if you have the confidence to see it through, but it’s actually a moral test, like an initiation, ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/56 "2014-11-25T14:25:29Z")
The essense of a Bad Trip comes from your own innermost fears. > [@by-tor](#): > > My bad trips on LSD taught me that you can physically feel the horror of the existential meaninglessness of the universe. Not fun. > > Also, apparently there are undulating faces in everything, including your skin and they are not happy. They look like souls trapped in Hades. Were you raised in a household that went to church on a regular basis? You may have the notion (albiet, subconscious) that the “truths” you learned are not true. Or you might just be nuts 😃 > [@Joey P](#): > > I had full on visual and audio hallucinations. My audio ones were pretty much just what you might call disturbances in my hearing, nothing added, but I remember the radio sounded like a skipping CD. But the visuals…wow. I always compare it to the scene in Fear And Loathing when the carpet starts moving, that’s just about exactly what I had a few hours of. Anything with any kind of a pattern in it came alive. It didn’t climb off the plane it was on (like it does in that clip), but it would move around, fill in with color, raise up and fall back down. It was surreal, for lack of a better term. You knew that the carpet wasn’t actually moving, right? In a true hallucination, you actually _believe_ what you see is actually happening. So, _that_ was a change in perception. The movement you “see” is probably you noticing the minute movements of your eyes. (physicological nystagmus) and/or the blood flow through your visual field. We tune those out as we learn language and interaction with others. Back in the late '60s and early '70s I was a health volunteer for several drug studies. (No, none of the psychoactive variety.) While waiting for blood to be drawn, or other “sit and waits” I was often left in a confrence room that had the complete collection (to date) of the medical journals on psychedelics. I spent a lot of time waiting and reading. [Here](https://www.erowid.org/library/periodicals/periodicals_article1.shtml) is a list of medical and lay publications on psychoactive drugs from the 1940s to the present. And [here is a recent study on the lifetime use of psychedelics](http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0063972) > [@](#): > > In this study, lifetime use of psychedelics and past year use of LSD was not associated with past year symptoms of visual phenomena (“seeing something others could not”), panic attacks, psychosis, or overall serious psychological distress. Thus, our findings does not support either the idea of “flashbacks” described in extreme cases as recurrent psychotic episodes, hallucinations, or panic attacks, or the more recent “hallucinogen persisting perceptual disorder” (HPPD) described as persistent visual phenomena with accompanying anxiety and distress. Well, I guess I can stop waiting. It appears that flashbacks are a myth, or at least mis-information. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/57 "2014-11-25T15:01:36Z")
> [@picunurse](#): > > You knew that the carpet wasn’t actually moving, right? In a true hallucination, you actually _believe_ what you see is actually happening. I read once, somewhere, that hallucinations are things you know aren’t real and delusions are things you think are real. Don’t know where I picked it up but it’s what I’ve always worked with. Anyways, yes, I knew it wasn’t real, once I got my head in the right space (whatever that means when you’re on acid), I was well aware that what I was seeing wasn’t real and just a manifestation of the drug. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/58 "2014-11-25T16:24:55Z")
Yeah, some people insist that the term “[pseudohallucination](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudohallucination)” be used when the, uh, hallucinator recognises that what’s going in “isn’t real.” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/59 "2014-11-25T16:29:08Z")
> [@Steken](#): > > Yeah, some people insist that the term “[pseudohallucination](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudohallucination)” be used when the, uh, hallucinator recognises that what’s going in “isn’t real.” We (and I think most people) just called them “visuals”. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2014, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222/60 "2014-11-25T16:33:28Z")
In casual conversation, I tend to use “visuals” and “hallucinations” interchangeably. Except when I’m feeling extra grandiose, then I call 'em “visions.” 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lsd-what-is-the-nature-of-a-bad-trip/705222.md?page=4)