# 'luci Reports to Ms Persson's Office for Scolding and Correction **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2006, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622 "2006-10-07T17:32:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/381 "2006-10-09T21:43:38Z")
But do you brag about it afterward? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/382 "2006-10-09T21:52:06Z")
Brag about it? He posts about it on an international message board! ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/383 "2006-10-09T21:56:31Z")
[QUOTE=Miller] Brag about it? He posts about it on an international message board! [/QUOTE] But is he scratching his nutsack while he types? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/384 "2006-10-09T22:04:14Z")
I think we’ve begun to [milk the chimp](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=391436) on this subject. ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/385 "2006-10-09T22:04:20Z")
[QUOTE=EddyTeddyFreddy] But is he scratching his nutsack while he types? [/QUOTE] Has he still got one? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/386 "2006-10-09T22:09:59Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] I burp and fart a lot. [/QUOTE] I don’t. But without even noticing my hands are always going to my nuts. (not even sure if I do it in public). As for feeling male, well, as a kid/young man, yeah, BIG TIME. I mean I just LOVED being a guy, chasing women and being a jock to boot. I remember thinking all the time just how lucky I was for being one. Now, not so much – after reading this thread and what with fuckin’ alimony and child support, sex change doesn’t sound so bad. Anyway, quite an informative thread. Still trying to get some concepts into my thick skull, but hey if the surgery works as some your cites have shown and it truly makes some people lead better lives…go for it! Well then, now that this one is winding down **'luc** , how’s about you start another one on penile implants, pumps, meds and aphrodisiacs. Mayhaps we could learn a thing or two there as well 😉 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/387 "2006-10-09T22:16:33Z")
[QUOTE=matt\_mcl] Most men, even if they’re not at all stereotypically macho, seem to share some kinds of experiences that they regard as being essentially masculine, or somehow affirming their masculinity in a positive way. I don’t share any such experience. When other men have tried to include me as “one of the guys,” it’s fallen completely flat. It’s not just a matter of not being interested in the activity - it’s a feeling of _who ARE these people?_ Men in general seem to have this thing of a sense of their masculinity or maleness, however defined, which I don’t really have to anywhere near the same extent; in its place there’s this unusual bunch of feelings and impulses that seem to be my gender. [/QUOTE] In all seriousness, I think it has to do with how we relate to different groups, and how we establish ourselves in hierarchies within those groups. We are, afterall, just another social primate species. If I’m in a group with women, there’s always a very different kind of tension/dynamic going on than if it’s just men. Some of this may be cultural, but from what I’ve read on the subject, I think most of it isn’t. If each of us were alone on a desert island, I don’t think we’d feel particularly male or female. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2006, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/388 "2006-10-09T22:36:48Z")
[QUOTE=RedFury] …Well then, now that this one is winding down **'luc** , how’s about you start another one on penile implants, pumps, meds and aphrodisiacs. Mayhaps we could learn a thing or two there as well 😉 [/QUOTE] Gee, what a swell idea, **Rojo**. No, really, thanks so much! But what I was really hoping for was a pony. With anthrax, if at all possible. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/389 "2006-10-10T00:41:01Z")
> [@](#): > > what with fuckin’ alimony and child support, sex change doesn’t sound so bad. I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t get you out of the alimony and child support, brother. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/390 "2006-10-10T00:43:53Z")
[Apparently not automatically, anyway.](http://cbs4.com/local/local_story_279164001.html) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/391 "2006-10-10T03:40:11Z")
[QUOTE=EddyTeddyFreddy] :dubious: Speak for yourself, pal. [/QUOTE] Of course, most men would prefer to be a horse, a lot for a man to envy in a horse. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/392 "2006-10-10T04:10:01Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Of course, most men would prefer to be a horse, a lot for a man to envy in a horse. [/QUOTE] It’s really not all it’s cracked up to be. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/393 "2006-10-10T04:20:35Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Of course, most men would prefer to be a horse, a lot for a man to envy in a horse. [/QUOTE] Unless, of course, you’re the cowpoke in the old joke who remembered too late he was riding Old Bess. Could be worse, could be a gelding. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2006, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/394 "2006-10-10T04:26:10Z")
[QUOTE=kaylasdad99] [Apparently not automatically, anyway.](http://cbs4.com/local/local_story_279164001.html) [/QUOTE] Holy guacamole! Trust I didn’t break yet _another_ can of beans with my off the cuff comment. :eek: I swear, some of this stuff makes my brain hurt. ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/395 "2006-10-11T13:34:31Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] But, like being gay, there is no known genetic [or] biological cause. [/QUOTE] I’m not quite sure what you mean by that. Sure, no one yet has been able to uneqivocally identify which specific genes are involved, but since there is strong evidence that male homosexuality (at least) has a very real genetic/biological component (whether within the subject or the subject’s mother), that is almost certainly only a temporary state of ignorance. Would you agree? ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/396 "2006-10-11T13:36:04Z")
[QUOTE=Steve Wright] The British Medical Journal is a legitimate scientific publication, and not a bastion of political correctness as far as I’m aware. [/QUOTE] I’m not so sure. I’ve read some ridiculously absurd, anti-scientific articles in the BMJ. For example, many vigorous defenses of HIV “dissenters” such as that bottomlessly evil douchebag Duesberg. My hunch is that the BMJ doesn’t have nearly the same level of prestige as, say, _JAMA_ (not to be parochial; I just don’t know which British medical journals are equally respected). ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/397 "2006-10-11T13:39:06Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] That was a noble effort, **Weirdy** (and welcome back) but I fear it’s all for naught. The PC Gestappo isn’t satisified with mere tolerance and political alliance. They’ll settle for nothing less than absolute adherence to the hive mind. It’s not enough to agree with them, you must agree with them for exactly the same reasons, be offended by exactly the same things, and perceive things subjectively exactly the same way. You are never permitted to have any unauthorized philosophical doubts or private squicks. It’s not enough to say that somthing should be allowable or legal, you have to _like_ it as well or you’re a “bigot.” . . . Man, when _elucidator_ is no longer liberal enough for this board, that’s saying something. [/QUOTE] Assuming you’re over 18, can I tell you how much I love you? ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/398 "2006-10-11T13:41:30Z")
[QUOTE=Excalibre] It’s my movement. Obviously different queers will disagree on this but, frankly, my opinions about queer rights come from the experience of being queer, while you are on the outside and watching. You might have insightful things to say (I’ll let you know if I spot any) but this fundamentally is not your movement. I appreciate straight people who support equal rights for queers; I don’t think you have the right to tell us how we should seek them, though. (Note also that Miller, lissener, and I are all queer - and note that the folks agreeing with you are not; this should tell you something about how much you really can understand the queer movement from the outside.) [/QUOTE] Well, _ **I’m** _ queer, and on the very narrow and specific point about whether it’s wisest to include the transgendered and the rest of the whole kit and kaboodle in the “gay rights” movement, I tend to agree with **elucidator** , even though I wouldn’t put it quite the way he did. In any event, I’ve started a GD thread to further explore this specific issue: [Must the Gay Rights Movement Include the Transgendered?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=7858041) ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/399 "2006-10-11T15:29:03Z")
> [@](#): > > there is strong evidence that male homosexuality (at least) has a very real genetic/biological component I’d like to amend this statement by saying that there is _some_ evidence that _some_ instances of male homosexuality have a genetic component. Even in MZ twin studies, although the concordance rate is higher than for DZ twins, the number of pairs whose sexual orientations differ is still larger than those that are the same. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622/400 "2006-10-11T15:31:53Z")
[QUOTE=ambushed] Well, _ **I’m** _ queer, and on the very narrow and specific point about whether it’s wisest to include the transgendered and the rest of the whole kit and kaboodle in the “gay rights” movement, I tend to agree with **elucidator** , even though I wouldn’t put it quite the way he did. In any event, I’ve started a GD thread to further explore this specific issue: [Must the Gay Rights Movement Include the Transgendered?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=7858041) [/QUOTE] You have the right to your opinion, though I think matt\_mcl has offered pretty good reasons for why it’s ultimately harmful to us. Nevertheless, there’s always differences of opinion as to how we should pursue the changes we’re seeking; I frankly think it’s presumptuous for a straight person to refer to it as “our” movement or to tell queer people how we should proceed - particularly when he’s so obviously arguing from ignorance. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/luci-reports-to-ms-perssons-office-for-scolding-and-correction/375622.md?page=21)