# Lunar combat **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 19, 2019, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013 "2019-10-19T20:30:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/41 "2019-10-21T02:01:04Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > In such an environment, would guns or rockets tend to make more sense? One of the things that hampers guns is that their highest velocity tends to occur in a high air density zone which slows them down. In space, you don’t have to worry about air resistance or winds messing up your range or accuracy. Rockets. Gyrojet sized bullets, probably with guidance systems. Reason: less heating of the gun barrel (hard to shed the heat in vacuum), less recoil. Also more efficient flight - the bullet could cant over more like a spacecraft and apply it’s velocity vector more optimally. But on the other hand, it just might be easier, for decades, to start with a far better developed form of weapons technology - conventional firearms - and modify them to work in space, than to more or less start over with rocket ammo. ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/42 "2019-10-21T02:19:11Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > Yeah, I just can’t really see people fighting on the moon. What’s the military objective? > > If country A doesn’t like the fact that country B holds certain places on the moon, it would probably be cheaper and easier to bombard it from earth than to maneuver on it from the actual moon. > > If country A wants to steal moon stuff from country B, then they would probably maneuver into a position where they could cut power/depressurize/isolate them logistically and wait for them to die. I should think if you want to avoid consequences back on Earth, the trick would be to arrange for some industrial sabotage on the level of a catastrophic “accident” that makes, say, a country or corporation’s base of operations for a mining operation untenable, to the extent that they’d have to dump a whole lot more capital onto the moon to make it profitable again, thereby encouraging them to sell it off to the saboteur (who would presumably already be in a position to exploit said mine at a discount). Or something like that. But, yeah, open combat on the moon makes little sense, unless it’s coupled to a wider campaign back on Earth. Which, I guess, isn’t completely out sigue realm of possibility. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/43 "2019-10-21T11:01:03Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > Yeah, I just can’t really see people fighting on the moon. What’s the military objective? Wars have been fought on earth over oil; on the moon, maybe cheese? ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/44 "2019-10-21T14:08:30Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Wars have been fought on earth over oil; on the moon, maybe cheese? You know, I could see a niche market developing for genuine lunar cheese if a lunar economy ever takes hold. I imagine it wouldn’t be anything special, but would be more in line with the branding that comes with, say, Champagne vs. wine that is merely sparkling and produced in other regions of France or, god forbid, Cal-i-for-nay-yay. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/45 "2019-10-21T14:54:29Z")
There was a Cold War-era short story in which US and Soviet troops got into a gun battle on the lunar surface. The rounds which didn’t hit anything entered \*very \*low orbits, so both countries’ bases had to put up walls to stop them. Which, of course, set off a “wall race.” > [@ftg](#): > > Given the glove/trigger problem, it might be easier to have it remotely controlled. The shooter might say “Alexa, fire a round … now.” 😉 The soldiers in John Scalzi’s excellent military sf novel _Old Man’s War_ use AI rifles with nanotechnology that can, at a mental order, adapt and create just the right ammo to suit the occasion. Very cool. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/46 "2019-10-21T16:01:25Z")
Another reason orbiting shots are a problem: the Moon rotates (slowly), so you will have moved away some by the time the shot comes back around. (Remember those old Mercury program, etc., maps that showed the orbits of [Glenn](https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/10436/11118034_1.jpg) and such? Same thing on the Moon only closer together.) And if you’re talking about rotation and artillery, the slower rotation means less correction for it when doing long distance shooting. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/47 "2019-10-21T16:03:50Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > There was a Cold War-era short story in which US and Soviet troops got into a gun battle on the lunar surface. The rounds which didn’t hit anything entered \*very \*low orbits, so both countries’ bases had to put up walls to stop them. Which, of course, set off a “wall race.” > . Ben Bova, Men of Good Will. 1965. Very good story! It wasn’t a “wall race”, but computers. They needed bigger and better computers to track all the bullets, because every 28th day the perilun of their orbits was right at the base. And every time the bullets hit something, their orbits changed. Everyone was afraid to shoot again because the computers would be overloaded and “they’d have to spend every 28th day sheltered.” But the Americans were secretly building a wall! And then they’d get those Russkies! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/48 "2019-10-21T19:46:57Z")
Ah, thanks. It’s been awhile since I read it. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/49 "2019-10-21T21:26:15Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Ah, thanks. It’s been awhile since I read it. It holds up well. ---
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/50 "2019-10-22T11:27:07Z")
Ok, why bother with guns? How about a small drone, flown out to the moon pirates before they’re in gun range? Then you fly your drone into the suit of the pirate-buggy driver. Better yet, the drone could detonate a small charge in the midst of the pirate buggy. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/51 "2019-10-22T11:43:43Z")
> [@Capn\_Carl](#): > > Ok, why bother with guns? How about a small drone, flown out to the moon pirates before they’re in gun range? Then you fly your drone into the suit of the pirate-buggy driver. > Better yet, the drone could detonate a small charge in the midst of the pirate buggy. I dont see how drones, at least ones that fly, would work. Remember on earth they are just tiny helicopters but in space they are little lunar modules that have to use tiny, liquid fueled, rocket motors for going forward, left, right, up/down and have to constantly correct their direction so that would be a big problem. Now after saying that I remember one sci fi story where someone uses an ordinary shoulder fired Stinger infrared guided anti aircraft missile to shoot down an enemy lunar module. I dont know if that would really work or not. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/52 "2019-10-22T12:31:13Z")
Phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range. ---
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/53 "2019-10-22T13:14:38Z")
> [@Ignotus](#): > > That’s a beauty! Or, spray your enemy with ClF[Sub]3[/Sub]. That stuff eats almost anything! But how effective would it be, or any other liquid acid for that matter, in the cold vacuum of space? ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/54 "2019-10-22T13:19:10Z")
The only thing more tragic, destructive and wasteful than war would be war for supremacy on an airless, waterless, hostile satellite. An airless environment with 1/6 the gravity of earth would make it interesting, though. Particle beam weapons, which cannot be used on earth because they degrade very quickly over distance, would be effective on the moon because they would be traveling through a vacuum. Also, immensely large and heavy weapons that would be too ponderous on earth could be used in that low gravity environment. Imagine something like a 400 ton tank with several turrets and multiple weapon systems that would have a chromium steel skin 2 feet thick. Stop that with a bazooka. LOL ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/55 "2019-10-22T13:32:23Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Now after saying that I remember one sci fi story where someone uses an ordinary shoulder fired Stinger infrared guided anti aircraft missile to shoot down an enemy lunar module. I dont know if that would really work or not. Pretty sure the Stinger uses aerodynamic flight control surfaces (i.e. fins) for directional control. These would not work on the moon. The missile would basically go in the direction you launched it, unable to turn to follow its (presumably moving) target. Almost certainly there would be some tiny mass imbalance that results in the missile following a long corkscrew path rather than a laser-straight line, but in any event this would be an unguided missile; the only way you’d score a hit is if you got extremely lucky. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/56 "2019-10-22T13:33:10Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > Phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range. “Just what you see, pal.” LOL ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/57 "2019-10-22T22:15:35Z")
Shoulder-fired tactical nukes all the way! Why bother with anything less? ---
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2019, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013/58 "2019-10-22T22:29:54Z")
> [@RioRico](#): > > Shoulder-fired tactical nukes all the way! Why bother with anything less? Supposedly the neat thing is the lethal radius of those nukes in a vacuum is way less than you would expect. You practically have to get to point blank. Though on the Moon what you would do is have the missile fly up and then come from above, set to delayed groundburst. Basically create a new crater on the Moon and the fragments kill your target. Err. The above is semi wrong. [History Publications and Resources - NASA](https://history.nasa.gov/conghand/nuclear.htm) It seems the lethal radiation distance from a nuke, to a human being who is protected only by a spacesuit or thin spacecraft wall, is enormous. But the nuke won’t do much to machines that have resistant electronics. (Unless, again, at extreme short ranges) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lunar-combat/842013.md?page=2)