# M\*A\*S\*H fans: do you prefer the early, middle, or late seasons? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 27, 2014, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446 "2014-02-27T21:29:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/61 "2014-03-04T16:37:18Z")
> [@MovieMogul](#): > > I could see how Loretta Swit might’ve fought to be warmer, softer, more well-rounded because as an actor, you want to have a character that will grow and deepen and have more colors after many years. And she became definitely more complex. Just less funny. That was always my assumption – that Swit (as well as the other actors who were in the series for a long time) wanted to make her character less of a caricature. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Prize](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sir\_Prize](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Prize)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/62 "2014-03-04T17:41:25Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > That was always my assumption – that Swit (as well as the other actors who were in the series for a long time) wanted to make her character less of a caricature. And she got her chance because Larry Linville did not want to continue as the one-note Frank Burns. Ironically, it was the transition episodes where Burns was going through an identiy crisis/breakdown because he lost Margret that he finally became interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/63 "2014-03-04T18:28:42Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > I liked the Winchester/Radar overlap years the best. But I think the show was very good to great for most of its run. > > The show was more mature with the cast change-over. Burn’s humor had run its course long before he left. So I probably have a negative opinion of his contribution to the show based on the later years. I guess I liked the dramedy years better than the early comedy years. > This surprises me, she still does not seem that attractive to me, especially compared to many of the other nurses on the show. When I was first watching the show she was far too old for me (like you) but even now in my mid-40s she still holds only mild appeal to me. Even as a lad l thought Loretta Swit was made of hotness. She, Jayne Kennedy, Maureen O’Sullivan, Phyllis Coates, and Jayne Kennedy are what made me heterosexual. ETA: I seem to have put Kennedy on the list twice. Obviously that is a mistake; she should be there three times. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/64 "2014-03-04T18:40:27Z")
I liked the early episodes because they had a bit of an edge to them. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/65 "2014-03-04T19:03:41Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Even as a lad l thought Loretta Swit was made of hotness. She, Jayne Kennedy, Maureen O’Sullivan, Phyllis Coates, and Jayne Kennedy are what made me heterosexual. > > ETA: I seem to have put Kennedy on the list twice. Obviously that is a mistake; she should be there three times. I’ll swap you three Phyllis Coates for one Noel Neill. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/66 "2014-03-04T19:18:03Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Even as a lad l thought Loretta Swit was made of hotness. She, Jayne Kennedy, Maureen O’Sullivan, Phyllis Coates, and Jayne Kennedy are what made me heterosexual. > > ETA: I seem to have put Kennedy on the list twice. Obviously that is a mistake; she should be there three times. When M_A_S\*H was on, I didn’t know who Jayne Kennedy, Maureen O’Sullivan or Phyllis Coates were. I recall liking Valerie Bertinelli & [Kristy McNichol](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001531/?ref_=tt_cl_t4) and the girl from Fish who upon looking her up was [Denise Miller](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0588220/?ref_=tt_cl_t5). ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/67 "2014-03-04T21:01:56Z")
> [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > And she got her chance because Larry Linville did not want to continue as the one-note Frank Burns. Ironically, it was the transition episodes where Burns was going through an identiy crisis/breakdown because he lost Margret that he finally became interesting. Exactly. I remember as Margaret and Donald are leaving on their honeymoon, Frank is the last one at the landing pad just watching their chopper disappear. He just whispers, “Goodbye, Margaret.” The best moment he ever had on the show. ---
**Author:** ![GreenElf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@GreenElf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenElf)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2014, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/68 "2014-03-06T06:16:07Z")
I prefer seasons 1-3, but also like 4,6 and 8. Season 5 was Penebscott this and Penebscott that, and brought a power imbalance to the show which was restored by the arrival of Winchester. Burns had some backing from Blake and Houlihan during the first 3-4 seasons. Seasons 6 & 8 were the best of the Winchester years. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2014, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/69 "2014-03-08T01:57:26Z")
See, while I’m not absolutely sure on any of the rest, I know for sure that I preferred Potter to Henry. That alone makes the first three seasons not as good. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/70 "2014-03-28T13:59:02Z")
Skald, I bring unto Rhymer Industries some valuable data, courtesy of the Geeks at GraphTV. Many Banthas died to bring this information… wait, that’s something else I have going on. Nobody died to get this info, though I did bang my knee against the desk a few minutes ago. Does this gig have a health plan? [http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0068098](http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0068098) MASH fans and critics favored the first three seasons more than any other season, and the overall trend line for the show is downward in slope. Interestingly enough, the final season seemed to be saddled with more lesser episodes than any other. It’s also interesting to see how Seasons 4-6 start strong, then fade as the season progresses. The least liked episode of all? Season 11, episode 11 - “Strange Bedfellows”, the one where Charles’s snoring is driving everybody crazy: ["M\*A\*S\*H" Strange Bedfellows (TV Episode 1983) - IMDb](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0638414/) Some other shows… Buffy: [http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0118276](http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0118276) Breaking Bad: [http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0903747](http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0903747) The Simpsons: [http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0096697](http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0096697) ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/71 "2014-03-28T15:56:59Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I don’t know precisely when in the run this puts it, but Potter is in charge, Radar is present and being uncanny, and Klinger, if he shows up at all (I don’t know how much overlap he had with Radar) must be in drag. Klinger was there from the beginning. It was supposed to be a one-off character, but Jaime Farr did such a good job impressing the producers that they kept him on the full run of the show. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/72 "2014-03-28T15:57:57Z")
I simply felt that many of the early characters that eventually left had little depth-it might have been a funnier show back then, strictly speaking, but it was also more one-dimensional, and unlike most other sitcoms it was definitely a dramedy. When I watch old reruns, I cringe at the early antics of Burns and Hot Lips, for example. ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/73 "2014-03-29T09:20:24Z")
It’s hard to choose between Seasons 1-3 and Seasons 4-7 because they feel almost like two different shows. The exit of both Henry Blake and Trapper John McIntyre and the entrance of Sherman Potter and BJ Hunnicut was a HUGE change. It changed the fundamental set-up of the show, IMHO. I like both shows. Henry Blake may not have been much of a camp commander, but he was a helluva nice guy and a great foil for the team of Pierce and McIntyre. And when called upon for a dramatic scene (e.g. “All I know is what they taught me in command school. Rule 1 is: Young men sometimes die. Rule 2 is: Doctors can’t change Rule 1”) McLean Stevenson could truly hit it out of the park. As for the rest… you can take the last three seasons and maybe come up with a half-dozen good episodes. You can tell the writers were just running out of gas. Even the finale is just not that great. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/74 "2014-03-29T19:49:23Z")
First three seasons were the best, although I will admit Winchester was a better foil than Burns. I agree with Sam Stone. Radar was a much better character when he was a conniving country boy. The episode where he was mailing a jeep home piece by piece was hilarious. The episode about Tuttle did a much better job of ridiculing the stupidity and waste of war and the Burns/Houlihan brand of patriotism than all the Alan Aldo preaching. First three seasons were a classic. Also agree that Henry Blake was a competent doctor, he just sucked at running a camp per Army regs. (I must also admit I have a soft spot for Blake because I played him in high school when we put on MASH for the senior play. It was pretty funny because we kids wanted to have Klinger in the cast – “He doesn’t have to say anything, Mrs. \_\_\_, he can just run around in a dress” – but the teacher vetoed it. She was afraid of the parents’ reaction. This was in southern Indiana in late 1976 and I guess all the conservatives were afraid the kids would be corrupted by seeing Klinger. LIke we weren’t watching the show with our parents anyway.) ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/75 "2014-03-29T21:26:20Z")
There’s no box for “I liked them all.” I preferred Winchester to Burns. In general, I prefer a competent rival to a buffoon\*. Likewise, I preferred it when Houlihan’s character was allowed to grow a bit. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/76 "2014-03-30T18:57:44Z")
I always thought the whole point of the Henry Blake character was that, despite his totally non-army way of doing things, the MASH actually ran pretty effectively under his command. He was well aware, for instance, that despite being a stickler for the rules, Frank was quite useless or even dangerous, whereas Hawkeye and Trapper, despite being cut-ups with utter contempt for anything military, and who totally did not want to be there, were, in fact, very competent and caring doctors who were saving lots of lives, always came through in the pinch, and, in fact, were the keys to the hospital’s success. He also understood how to get the best out of other types of odd, unmilitary people like Radar and Klinger, and even not so odd, more conventionally military ones, like Margaret. Henry’s character was a key part of the anti-war, anti-military, and generally radical message of the early series of MASH, and this was considerably blunted when he was replaced by Potter (who, unlike essentially all of the original characters, managed to make the traditional military look good, and whose character was undoubtedly created with just that purpose in mind). I do not think that the original versions of Hawkeye and Trapper would have responded well to Potter at all. The fact that they accepted him when he actually did arrive can be explained either by the fact that they had become more inured to army life over their time serving under Henry, or to the fact that the rebellious aspects of their characters had been gradually toned down (perhaps under pressure from the network) to make the show more safe and acceptable to conservative sensibilities, and less subversive (and by the fact that Trapper turned into BJ). ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/77 "2014-03-30T20:18:54Z")
Potter ensured that he was worthy of respect, and he winked at/ignored almost as much silliness as Henry did, in the end. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/78 "2014-03-30T21:40:47Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > Potter ensured that he was worthy of respect, and he winked at/ignored almost as much silliness as Henry did, in the end. Sure, but that is not the point. Henry’s management style sent the message (to the viewer) that the military style sucks, or, at least, it is wrong for smart, talented people. Potter’s style sent the opposite message, that military style, smartly and sensitively handled, works great for smart, talented people. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/79 "2014-03-30T23:02:02Z")
\ Not everyone has to be an archtype. Plus I think Larry Gelbart et al. were shooting for new characters which weren’t like their old counterparts, and seeing how they would work with the remaining cast members. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446/80 "2014-03-30T23:35:34Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Nope. Trapper left the show at the same time as Henry. McLean Stevenson got an offer to have his own comedy show, and decided to leave MASH to become a big comedy star. Possibly the worst mistake in TV history. The show he left MASH for was “Hello Larry.” And if you don’t remember it… point’s made. A common myth, spread by MAD magazine, (or was it _Cracked_?) He left to do _The McLean Stevenson Show_, 1976–77. \*Hello, Larry \*was several years later, 1979-80. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/m-a-s-h-fans-do-you-prefer-the-early-middle-or-late-seasons/682446.md?page=3)