# Mac, Windows, Linux... **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 28, 2009, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873 "2009-09-28T18:10:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/81 "2009-09-30T02:03:07Z")
IANS, you keep dredging up that Apple remote management sucks…care to post a cite? My google-fu is weak, all I can find is how Apple DOES have a LARGE host of remote management features, but I can’t find anybody that seems to _hate_ it. The price seems right at $500 for unlimited managed devices too. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/82 "2009-09-30T02:30:52Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > Macs cannot handle automated remote management. Not a big deal to your average yuppie, big deal to your average sysadmin. > > Macs do handle the approved list of hardware quite nicely. Hence it being called an approved list of hardware. > > Command lines and script functions…yeah, if you think Macs handle those just fine, you don’t use command lines or script functions for anything interesting. > > The last paragraph you quoted does hold it pretty well. “I am a _creative_ person … blah blah blah blah” I’d didn’t say I was a “creative person,” I said I work in the creative field, as in: I don’t work in IT, data management, nor am I a code monkey. I know… it’s a huge shock that people use computers for other things than whatever esoteric field you’re in. If anyone’s being pretentious, it’s you, as I don’t hold the tools I use in my profession as some sort of snobbery. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/83 "2009-09-30T02:39:20Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > The numbers in your article imply that I can get 2 PCs for $1000. What is the justification for that Apple price premium, again? Is it the fancy logo you get? I paid close to $4,000 for my Mac. Mainly it had to do with staying as compatible as possible with my coworkers, all my invested software (which is probably 4 or 5 times as much as my machine), and to get the Dual-Quad Core processors to cut drastically down on render times. It was the fastest machine on the market, at the time. Also, because I _love_ the OS, their hardware is second to none, and their industrial design makes my living room not looked like it’s furnished with Fisher Price’s MyFirstComputer™. The fancy logo is just gravy.  ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Love](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Dr.Love](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Love)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/84 "2009-09-30T02:52:06Z")
> [@Unintentionally\_Blank](#): > > A point I’d considered earlier today was this: The detractors have a problem with a Mac that costs $2000. That they can get SO much more computer for SO much less money. Does the same hold true for $2000 PC’s? Because they’re not particularly rare. Is a $750 17" Acer better than a $2500 Lenovo? Honestly, $2500 is about $1500 more than I would possibly consider spending on a laptop. Maybe you just need to be rich to own a Mac, but I don’t need a laptop that costs more than 10% of my annual income. > [@Unintentionally\_Blank](#): > > But it’s NOT 50-100%. Not for similar hardware. And it’s _easy_ to neglect the software if it doesn’t suit your argument. And the support. And the case. It’s easy to neglect the software because all the software you mentioned is free. I think I’ve called a support number once, ever, and I’ve never taken a computer into a shop. And who cares about the case? The damn thing sits motionless on my desk 99% of the time. It’s just occasionally nice to be able to transport it once in a while. Also, [Fisher Price’s MyFirstComputer](http://images.apple.com/pr/photos/iMac/imac-hires.jpg)? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Love](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Dr.Love](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Love)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/85 "2009-09-30T02:59:06Z")
> [@Unintentionally\_Blank](#): > > But it’s NOT 50-100%. Not for similar hardware. And it’s _easy_ to neglect the software if it doesn’t suit your argument. And the support. And the case. The hardware was as similar as I could get them. I looked up the Mac that met my criteria for the laptop I would buy (if I wanted a laptop right now), it was $1700. The Dell that met my criteria was $850. Seems like a big difference to me. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/86 "2009-09-30T03:01:43Z")
I voted for Windows…but only for economic reasons. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/87 "2009-09-30T03:08:12Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > I strongly prefer Windows and Linux because OS X feels like it was designed by a sycophant control freak to me. By design you can’t use it on third party computers, even though there’s no technical reason for this. The proof of this is the OSX86 project which has made bootloaders that simulate EFI and boot OS suX on standard x86 hardware. Invisible files and folders are hidden with **no apparent way to make finder view them** , the finder is a piece of trash. Whoever designed finder should have their testicles/ovaries whittled away with an onion peeler. What incompetence. Want to put a path into finder directly, or copy the current path? Fuck you, cause you can’t. Where the fuck is the cut menu option? It has copy, but no cut, why the fuck did those idiots leave out cut? This means if you want to move a file you first have to copy it then go back and delete it. Why? A cut option does this automatically, but being useful isn’t thinking different, I guess. > The thing that truly amazed me was Apple somehow managed to make a file search way less useful then Vista’s. For some reason it locked up the computer (which says to me horrid internal design) while it searched, then it more often then not didn’t find what I was looking for. Especially if it was on an NTFS partition. There just wasn’t a way to search those. Windows and Linux if you can mount a partition you can search the fucker. > > That said, I can’t answer the poll because I’m really conflicted. I love Linux for all the cool things you can do, it’s free as in beer and speech nature, and all the options it gives you. However I also seem to break it alot and fixing it can be a bear. Also a lot of my day to day stuff I end up doing in windows, and I love window’s easy of configuration, and use, but I despise M$ business practices, so yeah. You must’ve been using something else other than OSX. 1. You can view invisible folders/files by using any number of shareware apps, or just typing this into the Terminal (I found it online, so I can’t speak for its effectiveness): ```auto defaults write com.apple.finder AppleShowAllFiles TRUE killall Finder ``` 1. There’s myriad shareware for all kinds of Finder tricks like copying paths, or even navigating strictly with your keyboard. 2. Cut has been a menu option for as long as I can remember. It’s shortcut is Command-X. Not sure why this doesn’t work on a file in the Finder though. But I either just drag it where it’s going, or Copy, then Command-Delete. 3. Never had a problem with Spotlight. It’s always done a great job at indexing all my drives, and finding what I’m looking for, very fast. Anyway, no OS is perfect. And once you’re used to one, chances are, you’re not gonna like the differences of another. I’m sure I can find just as many “WTFs?!” in Windows as you can on a Mac. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/88 "2009-09-30T03:32:14Z")
> [@Dr.Love](#): > > Honestly, $2500 is about $1500 more than I would possibly consider spending on a laptop. Maybe you just need to be rich to own a Mac, but I don’t need a laptop that costs more than 10% of my annual income. > It’s easy to neglect the software because all the software you mentioned is free. I think I’ve called a support number once, ever, and I’ve never taken a computer into a shop. And who cares about the case? The damn thing sits motionless on my desk 99% of the time. It’s just occasionally nice to be able to transport it once in a while. > > Also, [Fisher Price’s MyFirstComputer](http://images.apple.com/pr/photos/iMac/imac-hires.jpg)? Nu-uh. That was 10 years ago, and aimed at consumers. This is the [iMac](http://www.apple.com/imac/) now. I’m talkin’ [This](http://computer-reviews.net/files/Gateway%20420GR%20Pentium%204%202.93GHZ.jpg) vs. [This.](http://tech2.in.com/media/images/2009/Mar/img_126792_apple-mac-pro.jpg) Or, [This](http://www.jnlthriftshop.com/images/JNL-hp_internet_keyboard.jpg) vs. [This.](http://addons.songbirdnest.com/addon-images/3089/appleAlKeyboard_large.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Love](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Dr.Love](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Love)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/89 "2009-09-30T03:40:51Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Nu-uh. That was 10 years ago, and aimed at consumers. This is the [iMac](http://www.apple.com/imac/) now. > > I’m talkin’ [This](http://computer-reviews.net/files/Gateway%20420GR%20Pentium%204%202.93GHZ.jpg) vs. [This.](http://tech2.in.com/media/images/2009/Mar/img_126792_apple-mac-pro.jpg) > > Or, > > [This](http://www.jnlthriftshop.com/images/JNL-hp_internet_keyboard.jpg) vs. [This.](http://addons.songbirdnest.com/addon-images/3089/appleAlKeyboard_large.jpg) Maybe the internet keyboard looks a little toy-ish, but I’m definitely not getting that from the Gateway computer. If you want a real [bad-ass keyboard](http://www.daskeyboard.com/images/front-view-ult-794x395.png)… And if we’re keeping the hardware identical, sholdn’t we be comparing it to something like [this](http://www.dell.com/us/en/home/desktops/alienware-aurora/pd.aspx?refid=alienware-aurora&s=dhs&cs=19)? ---
**Author:** ![LunarPlexus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LunarPlexus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LunarPlexus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/90 "2009-09-30T03:43:13Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Nu-uh. That was 10 years ago, and aimed at consumers. This is the [iMac](http://www.apple.com/imac/) now. > > I’m talkin’ [This](http://computer-reviews.net/files/Gateway%20420GR%20Pentium%204%202.93GHZ.jpg) vs. [This.](http://tech2.in.com/media/images/2009/Mar/img_126792_apple-mac-pro.jpg) > > Or, > > [This](http://www.jnlthriftshop.com/images/JNL-hp_internet_keyboard.jpg) vs. [This.](http://addons.songbirdnest.com/addon-images/3089/appleAlKeyboard_large.jpg) I think the last couple of rounds of Apple keyboards have been pretty sweet. I love the trackpad on my MacBook. Previous to the pinch technology, which I’d love to try out, but 2-finger-on-pad right click seems much more efficient once you get used to it. Overall, it seems like most people’s gripes that you usually see in threads like this are easily attributable to ignorance. There are probably a small percentage of users for whom the Mac is the wrong platform, but it’s way out of proportion to the Sturm und Drang the internet provides on the topic. Edit: Silent “e.” ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/91 "2009-09-30T03:47:16Z")
> [@Unintentionally\_Blank](#): > > IANS, you keep dredging up that Apple remote management sucks…care to post a cite? My google-fu is weak, all I can find is how Apple DOES have a LARGE host of remote management features, but I can’t find anybody that seems to _hate_ it. The price seems right at $500 for unlimited managed devices too. Hum, let’s see. FAI? Nope, can’t do that. Run programs remotely over TCP? Woops, even Windows does this better, and even if you can get it to run you have to do it from another Mac since Apple doesn’t support OSX on non-Apple hardware. Finding a network drive after it’s fallen off the network? Time for a reboot… well it’s quicker, anyway. One would think that with the common utilities and scripts available for UNIX that you wouldn’t need much to run them on OSX… unfortunately the retarded ways that Macs handle non-GUI configs require obscene provisioning that would make a UNIX administrator scratch his head. Have fun trying to make sense of /etc and getting things to work properly. “It just works…sometimes…but it still costs twice as much” Now for some fun with hardware… So do you enjoy buying printers? Do you enjoy looking for “Mac compatible” ? How about Mac SODIMMs and non-Mac SODIMMS? Macs are great fun to upgrade, especially iMacs where you get to peel back the display after fighting your way into the case. Let me just ask another question, since Macs are so great and are so efficient and all that. How many computer servers are running OSX Server…? ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/92 "2009-09-30T03:49:07Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Nu-uh. That was 10 years ago, and aimed at consumers. This is the [iMac](http://www.apple.com/imac/) now. Oh yea bud, she is a beaut. And looks to be a real pleasure to work on should you ever need to poke your head inside. Does opening the case yourself still void the warranty? ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/93 "2009-09-30T03:50:32Z")
Ha! That Alienware Desktop looks like something out of _Battlestar Galactica: The Original Series._ I’d be embarrassed to have that in my living room. If you’re gonna design something — _anything,_ don’t over do it. Don’t make it look like a prop. Don’t use gimmicks. Don’t clutter it up. Keep it as simple as it needs to be, classic, unobtrusive, solid, and tasteful. Not as easy to achieve as it seems, and one has to admit, Apple’s got that in spades. If you don’t find value in aesthetics and solid design, so be it. Personally, I do, and like surrounding myself in my home with attractive and tasteful decor. Yet, this isn’t the whole reason I go with a Mac. I’ve been using them when they looked like [this.](http://listphobia.com/wp-content/uploads/060909-1616-10mostmemor2.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![luv2draw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/46a35a/32.png) [@luv2draw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/luv2draw)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/94 "2009-09-30T03:51:26Z")
Count me in as for MAC!!! My first work computer was a Wang, believe it or not, then I learned MS Windows on a PC. Had no choice for either system–it’s what they had at the places I worked. Screwed up Windows at the last place I worked–screwed up because it was a retail firm that had DOS programs from when they first opened about 25 years ago and all the programs were jerry-rigged into Windows…somehow. I kept hoping the installation where the servers are would blow up and they could just start all over again. The system was that effed up. When it came time to get my own computer, I listened to my creative friend (I’m a creative at heart myself) and went with Mac. I’m looking for a job now and I swear I’ll shoot myself if I have to use Windows again.:eek: ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/95 "2009-09-30T03:51:41Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > Oh yea bud, she is a beaut. And looks to be a real pleasure to work on should you ever need to poke your head inside. Does opening the case yourself still void the warranty? Dunno… I don’t own one. However, the Mac Pros are a dream to open up. ---
**Author:** ![luv2draw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/46a35a/32.png) [@luv2draw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/luv2draw)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/96 "2009-09-30T03:53:02Z")
Oooooo. My vote TIED the poll… ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/97 "2009-09-30T03:57:26Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > I paid close to $4,000 for my Mac. Mainly it had to do with staying as compatible as possible with my coworkers, all my invested software (which is probably 4 or 5 times as much as my machine), and to get the Dual-Quad Core processors to cut drastically down on render times. It was the fastest machine on the market, at the time. Also, because I _love_ the OS, their hardware is second to none, and their industrial design makes my living room not looked like it’s furnished with Fisher Price’s MyFirstComputer™. > > The fancy logo is just gravy.  I will concede (again) that Macs excel at specialized application like video processing, although I think it’s safe to say that 4 grand will get significantly better processing power if thrown at a true UNIX box. That said, good looking PC cases cost like $75. You are cherry picking the most basic of the basic for the PC side. Even my $16 Microsoft keyboard looks better than that PS/2 POS 😃 ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/98 "2009-09-30T04:05:46Z")
> [@luv2draw](#): > > When it came time to get my own computer, I listened to my creative friend (I’m a creative at heart myself) and went with Mac. I’m looking for a job now and I swear I’ll shoot myself if I have to use Windows again.:eek: Yeah, well, you might want to procure some ammo in that case. Macs in the corporate world are about as common as two dollar bills. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/99 "2009-09-30T04:07:40Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > [stuff .00001% of the population cares about… snip] Now for some fun with hardware… So do you enjoy buying printers? Do you enjoy looking for “Mac compatible” ? How about Mac SODIMMs and non-Mac SODIMMS? Macs are great fun to upgrade, especially iMacs where you get to peel back the display after fighting your way into the case. I could walk into a MicroCenter blindfolded and pick a computer that works on a Mac. Upgrading RAM is a cinch. It can be third party. In fact, I recommend it as you’ll get a much better deal. Installation: [iMac](http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1432) [MacBook](http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1651) ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873/100 "2009-09-30T04:11:37Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > I will concede (again) that Macs excel at specialized application like video processing, although I think it’s safe to say that 4 grand will get significantly better processing power if thrown at a true UNIX box. > > That said, good looking PC cases cost like $75. You are cherry picking the most basic of the basic for the PC side. Even my $16 Microsoft keyboard looks better than that PS/2 POS 😃 So what if I save $1000 dollars on a Unix box? I have over 20 grand wrapped up in software, most of which probably doesn’t run on any Linux flavor. Also, Final Cut Pro is fast becoming an industry standard. There’s no other version than Apple. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mac-windows-linux/511873.md?page=6)