# Mad-Men 3.09, Wee Small Hours (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 12, 2009, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475 "2009-10-12T01:52:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/21 "2009-10-12T20:29:52Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > I like the episodes where we are reminded what a jackass Don really is. So…all of them? Actually I think Don is pretty definitely a sex addict, though such a term did not exist in '63. His flirting Hottie!Teacher clearly was a response to the stress and pressure he was under. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/22 "2009-10-12T20:33:46Z")
Poor Sal. Today he’d be on the winning end of a very large lawsuit. Lucky Strikes could turn off their lights…heh. That’s nothing to what Sal could do now. So Don is bored with Betty. I find it interesting he’s falling for a woman who is not glamorous or wealthy or even bohemian. She’s just a small town schoolteacher who rents an apartment above someone’s garage. Maybe that’s the type of person Dick Whitman would fall for? I still see Betty as a child figure. Throwing the money box, getting a passionate kiss from Henry then pouting she doesn’t want to commit The Tawdry…very immature. ---
**Author:** ![Olentzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90ced4/32.png) [@Olentzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Olentzero)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/23 "2009-10-12T20:35:01Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Nonetheless I am going to continue to call Pete Emo!Rapist because, well, he is. I won’t be adapting that naming schema anytime soon, but I fully agree with the sentiment. “I got some off that au pair by twisting her arm! Oh shit, what will Trudy say?!” ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/24 "2009-10-12T20:38:08Z")
> [@Olentzero](#): > > I won’t be adapting that naming schema anytime soon, but I fully agree with the sentiment. “I got some off that au pair by twisting her arm! Oh shit, what will Trudy say?!” Oh, I don’t expect anyone to emulate me. I do wish somebody would beat the holy hell out of Pete with a golf club, though. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/25 "2009-10-12T20:40:29Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > So Don is bored with Betty. I find it interesting he’s falling for a woman who is not glamorous or wealthy or even bohemian. She’s just a small town schoolteacher who rents an apartment above someone’s garage. Maybe that’s the type of person Dick Whitman would fall for? It is deeper than boredom. Don had just lost the Hilton account, has big problems with Lucky Strike, so he has this psychotic need to re-establish his alpha maleness. Don needs to prove to himslef that he is “the man”. What better way to do that than conquer the schoolteacher down the road? ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/26 "2009-10-12T20:57:14Z")
I think there’s a whole laundry list of items why Don went after the school teacher. She pursued him, then resisted his advances. He’s getting the hot-and-cold from Betty. He’s frustrated with his work/his life. But I think a lot of it is the danger – as she mentioned, he’s never done something so stupid: she lives in the neighborhood, knows his wife, used to be his kid’s teacher. Don doesn’t fit the profile of a sex addict, but his serial affairs suggest that he’s going for the thrill of the conquest, moreso than the mechanics of having sex. He should have listened to his own advice to Sal, and limited his exposure. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/27 "2009-10-12T21:18:14Z")
> [@corkboard](#): > > I wonder if Connie Hilton was as much of a wackjob as he’s being portrayed. Calling his ad guy at all hours of the night, insisting on a campaign for a Hilton on the moon? Yeah, I have to imagine that the Hilton family can’t be terribly appreciative of the show. ---
**Author:** ![CJJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/28 "2009-10-12T21:32:45Z")
> [@corkboard](#): > > I wonder if Connie Hilton was as much of a wackjob as he’s being portrayed. Calling his ad guy at all hours of the night, insisting on a campaign for a Hilton on the moon? Hilton was clearly looking for something world-changing in the campaign. During the late-night drink with Don, he was talking about exporting American values to the rest of the world, citing things like the Marshall plan as an example. He wanted the campaign to show how Hilton could bring the greatness of the American spirit to the world, rather than dwell on mundane cultural artifacts like hamburgers. Hilton thought Don shared that vision, so the campaign–although good from a strictly marketing and business perspective–would naturally disappoint him. Don completely missed the importance of the “moon” metaphor, and he looked foolish when he parried Hilton’s “I asked you for the moon” criticism by interpreting the phrase literally. Hilton is a man whose mind bustles with “great notions”–almost like a religious mystic–and so he tends to express himself in oblique language, parables and metaphors. I think it’s simplistic to dismiss him as a whackjob, but he seems crazy to the extent any man with an uncompromising vision can be. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/29 "2009-10-12T22:01:27Z")
Interestingly, Hilton did have his eye on a Moon hotel. The “Lunar Hilton” is discussed in [this 1967 speech](http://www.spacefuture.com/archive/hotels_in_space.shtml)by Barron Hilton. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/30 "2009-10-12T22:03:29Z")
> [@CJJ](#): > > Hilton was clearly looking for something world-changing in the campaign. During the late-night drink with Don, he was talking about exporting American values to the rest of the world, citing things like the Marshall plan as an example. He wanted the campaign to show how Hilton could bring the greatness of the American spirit to the world, rather than dwell on mundane cultural artifacts like hamburgers. One article I read on the episode suggested that Hilton was advocating [American exceptionalism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism), the idea that America holds a special place in the world. ---
**Author:** ![MaddyStrut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dbc845/32.png) [@MaddyStrut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaddyStrut)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/31 "2009-10-12T22:06:25Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Did ya hear the sirens in the background? Sal’s life as he knows it is about to end. He just lost his job, he’s about to be arrested for being a sex pervert (no prosecution, but his name will be printed in the paper), his wife (who already suspects something) will probally leave him (even pre-Vatican II I’m fairly certain she could get an annulment under the circumstances). Things do _no_ look good for him. Hopefully, Sal won’t get arrested, but I do wonder if the Lucky Strike guy overplayed his hand (as bullies do). If Sal has nothing left to lose, what’s to stop him from saying “hell, I’ll take Lucky Strike guy down with me”? Someone more devious than Sal (who doesn’t seem to have a devious bone in his body) could have threatened to tell LS guy’s father unless he asked for Sal to be rehired. Sure, Sal has no proof. However, the way LS guy talked and acted, he’s very much in fear of a controlling father. Somehow, I don’t think it would more than a rumor to get LS guy’s father riled up. Which makes me think things would have gone down very differently if Harry had told someone. If anyone had approached LS guy and asked him “what happened” or “what can we do to fix this”, LS guy would have been forced to think about the situation while sober. If he had, he would have realized Sal could easily ruin him. Sure, it may take Sal down as well, but I think LS guy is a coward and would never take a chance on that. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/32 "2009-10-12T23:08:45Z")
I don’t think Don is bored with Betty. I think he loves what she represents (and I’m pretty sure that’s been said here and elsewhere before). He can’t relate to her on any kind of realistic, honest level. I think he’s a little bit afraid of her too. He knows she could hurt him, absolutely cut him, if she ever found out the truth about his background. But we don’t know if Betty’s the kind of woman who would do that. She’s not particularly nurturing but she’s not cruel either. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/33 "2009-10-12T23:40:13Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > She’s not particularly nurturing but she’s not **cruel** either. :dubious: I see a cruel streak in her a mile-wide. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/34 "2009-10-13T00:27:11Z")
The deliberate kind of cruelty? I haven’t seen that (but I might have forgotten it). She’s been thoughtless and self-involved, like in the scene with her dad, when he was talking about dying. Any other examples? Not a challenge, I need reminders. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/35 "2009-10-13T00:44:39Z")
Betty manipulated her friend at the horsey country club into having an affair with the guy who she’d been crushing on. Can’t remember either of their names, of course, but since her friend was married, that was rather cruel. Also, she was just bitingly cruel to Don upon their return from Italy, upon the occasion of his trying to give her a souvenier to cheer her up. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/36 "2009-10-13T02:59:10Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > So Don is bored with Betty. I find it interesting he’s falling for a woman who is not glamorous or wealthy or even bohemian. She’s just a small town schoolteacher who rents an apartment above someone’s garage. Maybe that’s the type of person Dick Whitman would fall for? Don is such a goddamn pig. He said to the teacher “I want you. I don’t care. Doesn’t that mean anything to someone like you?” I don’t think he meant “someone like you” as “a flirt.” I think he meant it as “a lowly little schoolteacher, wanted by big tough ad man.” Blech. I also wish women would tell him no. And not a bohemian from the city - a nice hippy schoolteacher. Oh well… > [@MaddyStrut](#): > > Hopefully, Sal won’t get arrested, but I do wonder if the Lucky Strike guy overplayed his hand (as bullies do). If Sal has nothing left to lose, what’s to stop him from saying “hell, I’ll take Lucky Strike guy down with me”? Is Sal’s mother still alive? IIRC they established in the first season that he’s one of those classic Italian mama’s boys. Even if his wife finds out and leaves him, I’d bet that Sal will do anything in the world that it takes to keep Mama from finding out. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/37 "2009-10-13T04:19:04Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Yeah, I have to imagine that the Hilton family can’t be terribly appreciative of the show. If the Hilton name has survived that vapid whore of a great-granddaughter running around, I’m sure it’ll survive Mad Men talking about moon hotels 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/38 "2009-10-13T15:06:37Z")
“I asked for the Moon” was both literal and a metaphor. It was a metaphor in the sense that Hilton was saying he wanted an ad campaign that reflected his belief that Hilton was more than just a hotel - it was exporting the American way of life, which Connie saw as being transformative for the world in a good way. He clearly wanted an ad campaign that associated Hilton with America in a positive way, which emphasized a Hilton hotel’s status as a little bit of America away from home. For example, an ad showing some foreign kids staring up at a glittering Hilton hotel in their otherwise drab country, with a caption like, “Hilton. When you’re away from America, America will come to you.” Something like that. Instead, Don went utterly conventional on him. That said, I seem to recall that Hilton DID have an ad featuring a Hilton on the moon. I don’t know if it was in the 60’s or later, though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/39 "2009-10-13T17:36:38Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > I also wish women would tell him no. And not a bohemian from the city - a nice hippy schoolteacher. Oh well… Me, too. I was so disappointed when she gave in to him - she was the first woman who’s called him on his bullshit, and I really thought she was going to hold out. I wonder what he’d do if a woman he wanted was adamant in refusing him. He went in for the schoolteacher pretty aggressively near the end, grabbing her in a way that made it easy for me to imagine that he was determined to have sex with her regardless of whether she eventually acquiesced or not. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475/40 "2009-10-13T17:45:23Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > It is deeper than boredom. Don had just lost the Hilton account… Was I wrong here? I had the impression that Connie wasn’t happy but not that Don up and lost the account. Connie seemed to have more invested in Don than to just call it done. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-3-09-wee-small-hours-open-spoilers/513475.md?page=3)