# Mad-Men: 4.09 "The Beautiful Girls" (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 20, 2010, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352 "2010-09-20T01:39:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Leiko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Leiko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leiko)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/61 "2010-09-21T02:11:35Z")
> [@elmwood](#): > > > [@salinqmind](#): > > > > Ms. Blankenship indeed did come a long, long way from her birth in a barn in 1898. She really was ‘an astronaut’. > > My namesake, my grandfather on my mom’s side, was born in 1898. > > The astronaut line was yet another one of the little details of Mad Men that puts the viewer back in time 45 years, in a way that a trip to the graveyard can’t. When I was a kid in the 1970s, there were still a lot of people around born in the 1890s, a few from the 1880s, and plenty of World War I vets. We thought nothing of it. Today, the number of people on this planet born in the 1800s is probably in the low single digits. I loved the little scenes with Blankenship and Cooper. The crossword puzzle, and his contribution to the eulogy, were both lovely little pieces of acting. It’s not quite that rare yet- but in terms of overall percentage, you’re close. Even discounting all Japanese claimants (as they’re undergoing a major scandal as it has been discovered that many supposed supercentenarians have been dead for decades) on[the Wikipedia list](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_living_supercentenarians), there are stilll several dozen people who were born between 1896 and 1899. There are only three living WWI veterans, however. There’s a rare set for you. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/62 "2010-09-21T02:15:16Z")
> [@Leiko](#): > > I loved the little scenes with Blankenship and Cooper. The crossword puzzle, and his contribution to the eulogy, were both lovely little pieces of acting. “Three-letter word for a flightless bird.” “Emu.” “It starts with an _L_.” “The hell it does.” The faux-Pep Boys were amusing too. “They don’t know how to hunt, swing a hammer, or fix their cars.” “You mean like these two” “No, actually I’m from Vermont and Don’s a competitive fly fisherman.” I’m betting Cosgrove made that one up. Fingers crossed that no one offers to take Don fishing. ---
**Author:** ![Fried\_Dough\_Ho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a88e57/32.png) [@Fried\_Dough\_Ho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fried_Dough_Ho)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/63 "2010-09-21T02:17:19Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > > [@DoctorJ](#): > > > > In a previous episode, either last season or the season before, he had Sally mixing drinks for him. > > Which is also completely normal for the time period. Agree ~ I was born in '64 and was taught how to mix a martini by my 6th birthday. ---
**Author:** ![Spyro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/54ee81/32.png) [@Spyro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spyro)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/64 "2010-09-21T02:28:49Z")
I mixed martinis for Pops, too. But what does “that era” have to do with it? Are we so much more puritanical about alcohol now as compared to then? Parents these days :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/65 "2010-09-21T04:34:58Z")
The surest way to get a kid interested in alcohol is to lock it up and tell the kid that it’s _forbidden_. We keep alcohol out in the open. I don’t drink much, but when my daughter asked about it when she was small, I let her sniff it, knowing what kid’s taste buds are like. She wrinkled her nose and went, “ew!” Now she makes fun of us if we have a drink, and has absolutely zero interest in alcohol. On the other hand, if we had a Slurpee machine I’d have to post an armed guard. ---
**Author:** ![kasuo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8c91f0/32.png) [@kasuo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kasuo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/66 "2010-09-21T05:47:04Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > > [@elmwood](#): > > > > My namesake, my grandfather. > > Nitpick: You are his namesake. He can’t be yours (unless there’s a time machine involved). Maybe he’s his own grandpa? ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/67 "2010-09-21T14:49:22Z")
> [@Spyro](#): > > I mixed martinis for Pops, too. But what does “that era” have to do with it? Are we so much more puritanical about alcohol now as compared to then? Parents these days :dubious: > [@DoctorJ](#): > > > [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > > > That bothered me, as it bespeaks a lack of interest in making his home kid-appropriate. > > In a previous episode, either last season or the season before, he had Sally mixing drinks for him. I plan on having my kids make the occasional drink or fetch me a bottle of ale. I have a Homer Simpson bottle opener that shouts some of Homer’s beer quotes when used. I let my three year old help me open up a beer with it. It’s one of our little things, and it’s the tip of introducing that moderate alcohol consumption is not taboo, dangerous, or exotic. When they’re 16 or so, I have no problem with them having a half or quarter glass of wine with dinner - provided they’re in for the night. All of this is to enforce at attitude of ‘this is normal - you have a bit, appreciate it for it’s flavor and craft - and you stop’. I think it’s somewhat of a European approach. This way, when they go to college and their roommate smuggles a plastic handle of vodka and case of Keystone light into the freshman dorm, they’ll be unimpressed and uninterested. I’d sooner have them be snobby alcohol connoisseurs than repressed puritans aching to go crazy. I don’t think that’s a false dichotomy. I want my kids to be almost bored by alcohol. ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/68 "2010-09-21T15:14:21Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > I’m betting Cosgrove made that one up. Fingers crossed that no one offers to take Don fishing. Was Cosgrove getting a bit uppity in that meeting? It seemed like he kept undermining Don – Don would tell the customers that they had to choose an ad campaign and stick to it, and Ken would argue against that. Had Don not had to keep kipping off to deal with all the lovely ladies in his life, I was expecting Cosgrove to get the ol’ smackdown. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/69 "2010-09-21T15:17:48Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > > [@Spyro](#): > > > > I mixed martinis for Pops, too. But what does “that era” have to do with it? Are we so much more puritanical about alcohol now as compared to then? Parents these days :dubious: > > > [@DoctorJ](#): > > > > In a previous episode, either last season or the season before, he had Sally mixing drinks for him. > > I plan on having my kids make the occasional drink or fetch me a bottle of ale. I have a Homer Simpson bottle opener that shouts some of Homer’s beer quotes when used. I let my three year old help me open up a beer with it. It’s one of our little things, and it’s the tip of introducing that moderate alcohol consumption is not taboo, dangerous, or exotic. > > When they’re 16 or so, I have no problem with them having a half or quarter glass of wine with dinner - provided they’re in for the night. All of this is to enforce at attitude of ‘this is normal - you have a bit, appreciate it for it’s flavor and craft - and you stop’. I think it’s somewhat of a European approach. This way, when they go to college and their roommate smuggles a plastic handle of vodka and case of Keystone light into the freshman dorm, they’ll be unimpressed and uninterested. I’d sooner have them be snobby alcohol connoisseurs than repressed puritans aching to go crazy. I don’t think that’s a false dichotomy. I want my kids to be almost bored by alcohol. you MONSTER!!:eek: ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/70 "2010-09-21T16:17:55Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > [QUOTE=Skald the Rhymer] > Why would the warm, loving white mother tolerate the emotionally abusive maid, whatever her race? Sheer unadulterated terror. That’s what would make it a great movie. It’s _Whatever Happened to Baby Jane_ meets _Corinna Corinna_; Cicely Tyson is attached. [QUOTE=Skald the Rhymer] How about a lil black child growing up with a cold, distant, slap happy mom and a loving white governess, which magical powers of course? We could get Tyler Perry to write & direct. [/QUOTE] That could very well be the plot of _House of Payne_ and I wouldn’t know as I’ve never been able to make it past the first 3 minutes. (I’m still trying to figure out how he got into _Star Trek_.) [/QUOTE] You’ve watched 2 minutes and 15 seconds more of HOUSE OF PAYNE than I. As for his presence in STAR TREK, it was in keeping with J. J. Abrams’ artistic decision to people the story with repellent and unsympathetic characters. (Abrams’ only failure in this regard was with Young!Spock.) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/71 "2010-09-21T16:41:46Z")
> [@Fried\_Dough\_Ho](#): > > > [@alphaboi867](#): > > > > Which is also completely normal for the time period. > > Agree ~ I was born in '64 and was taught how to mix a martini by my 6th birthday. I was born in '66 and while I can’t mix a martini I routinely made drinks for my parents and their guests. My parents kept their liquor cabinet unlocked and none of their kids, at least to my knowledge, ever snuck any. (They also kept their many guns free-access, and while we did use those it was with their consent and we never had any accidents.) ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/72 "2010-09-21T17:34:23Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > > [@acsenray](#): > > > > I’m betting Cosgrove made that one up. Fingers crossed that no one offers to take Don fishing. > > Was Cosgrove getting a bit uppity in that meeting? It seemed like he kept undermining Don – Don would tell the customers that they had to choose an ad campaign and stick to it, and Ken would argue against that. Had Don not had to keep kipping off to deal with all the lovely ladies in his life, I was expecting Cosgrove to get the ol’ smackdown. Why did Weiner bring Cosgrove back at all? 😕 He was one of the most boring characters and never really got a subplot of his own. Is something big involving him coming up? Will we ever get to meet his (presumably heavyset) fiancee/wife? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/73 "2010-09-21T18:03:13Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > > [@acsenray](#): > > > > I’m betting Cosgrove made that one up. Fingers crossed that no one offers to take Don fishing. > > Was Cosgrove getting a bit uppity in that meeting? It seemed like he kept undermining Don – Don would tell the customers that they had to choose an ad campaign and stick to it, and Ken would argue against that. Had Don not had to keep kipping off to deal with all the lovely ladies in his life, I was expecting Cosgrove to get the ol’ smackdown. It seems to me part of the routine conflict between account services and creative. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/74 "2010-09-21T19:14:28Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Why did Weiner bring Cosgrove back at all? 😕 He was one of the most boring characters and never really got a subplot of his own. Cosgrove is a great foil for the rest of the agency. He’s the only non-background character who is actually happy, enjoys his work, is good at it and seems to have a decent life. He’s an ad guy (in sales no less) and I wouldn’t leave my 17 year old daughter alone with him but he’s not out to actively screw anyone over. Pete hates him for no other reason than Cosgrove doesn’t seem to have to work at it, professionally or personally, and Pete’s life is a constant mire of conflict. A plot centered around him would be boring and a mistake because there’s no conflict there but I like the idea that not everyone at SCDP has to live in a constant high-drama soap opera and can actually have things go their way. ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/75 "2010-09-21T20:22:56Z")
> [@blilc](#): > > > [@alphaboi867](#): > > > > Was anyone else thinking what I was thinking during Roger & Joan’s public sexing? Joan’s gone off the pill, doesn’t look Roger stopped to put a condom on, is Weiner really going _there_? :eek: It’s so predictable it’s gotta be a red herring, right? > > I think they are going there. Big question will be whether Joan has a third abortion or has the baby and tries to pass it off as hubby’s. Depending on how long ago he left for basic\* the timing of the conception could be suspicious. I doubt very much that Joan or Roger would be leaving their current spouses, at least in the short term. > > - Hard to tell how much time has passed since the last episode, though judging by the post-coital scene Don does seem to have had the time to work off a good portion of his mid-section. Joan was shown on a bus in next week’s preview… heading down to visit her husband during his after-basic leave? Depending on the timeline, she’d need to have sex with Dr. Rapist to have plausible deniability if she got knocked up by Roger. I’m sure Cosgrove is back to provide conflict with Pete with regard to account management. Who brings in the biggest clients or the most ad dollars, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/76 "2010-09-21T20:28:21Z")
> [@lisacurl](#): > > Joan was shown on a bus in next week’s preview… heading down to visit her husband during his after-basic leave? Judging from the usual previews, Joan is probably headed to the drug store to get Don some aspirin. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/77 "2010-09-21T20:31:39Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > > [@lisacurl](#): > > > > Joan was shown on a bus in next week’s preview… heading down to visit her husband during his after-basic leave? > > Judging from the usual previews, Joan is probably headed to the drug store to get Don some aspirin. It’s funny because it’s true. ---
**Author:** ![JXJohns](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jxjohns/32/469_2.png) [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/78 "2010-09-21T21:13:43Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > > [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > > > Yeah, the attorney did warn her of that. But I think a judge would be more inclined to give Betty Frances, married to a stable man in the suburbs custody of Sally rather than a single-father who lives in the village. > > Then there’s Betty’s nuclear option; out Don as army deserter Dick Whitman. “Dick Whitman” died in Korea. He was not a deserter. Correct? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/79 "2010-09-21T21:27:07Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > > [@alphaboi867](#): > > > > Then there’s Betty’s nuclear option; out Don as army deserter Dick Whitman. > > “Dick Whitman” died in Korea. He was not a deserter. Correct? Legally correct, though of course in reality Dick Whitman’s a deserter who changed his name to Don Draper. Betty would have to prove Whitman and Draper are the same, which might prove difficult since those who knew both well are mostly dead. (Any idea if the Army took photographs or fingerprints at the time of induction during the Korean Conflict? Or a brand across the chest?) If Mad Men were real then Draper being brought to account for his desertion would be very interesting and complicated arc that could easily fill a season, which makes me sort of hope it’s never a plotline. Does anybody know if there ever were any cases that would be at all similar to Draper-Whitman years after the fact? ---
**Author:** ![Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a88e4f/32.png) [@Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eleanor_of_Aquitaine)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352/80 "2010-09-21T22:03:30Z")
Wait, how is he a deserter? I thought he woke up in the hospital wearing Don Draper’s dog tags, and he just went along with the mistaken identity. Dick Whitman is officially dead, and Don Draper was honorably (medically?) discharged. If he’d woken up wearing his own dog tags, Dick Whitman would still have been medically discharged, I think. He may be guilty of accepting whatever additional benefits there were for an officer, rather than an enlisted man. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-4-09-the-beautiful-girls-open-spoilers/554352.md?page=5)