# Mad-Men: 5.04 "Signal 30" (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 16, 2012, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907 "2012-04-16T00:34:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/101 "2012-04-17T19:46:57Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Peggy is a writer. She clearly wants to write more than just ad copy. I’m going to trot out this old chestnut…Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/102 "2012-04-17T19:50:11Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > i don’t know why, but i was absolutely fuming during the scene when cynthia was spilling the beans about ken’s writing on the side. “_Cynthia_!” ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/103 "2012-04-17T20:04:13Z")
Yes that was hilarious. I really like Megan. (What happened to all the capitalization in your quote from my post?) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/104 "2012-04-17T20:57:14Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Yes that was hilarious. I really like Megan. > > (What happened to all the capitalization in your quote from my post?) Transfered like that for some reason- I didn’t change it. I loved that it turns Megan on seeing Don do handyman work. Have they ever mentioned Don growing up in a whorehouse before? His bio-mother was a prostitute, but he was raised by the Whitmans on a farm so I was wonderingi f that was a lie or if his stepmother and ‘uncle’ (who he claimed he liked) were in the biz. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/105 "2012-04-17T21:01:19Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > And Roger telling Ken he can’t write stories on his own time? WTF? Good for him simply creating a new pseudonym. Does this have any basis in real life, or was this plucked from someone’s butt? On what planet…? ---
**Author:** ![Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8dc957/32.png) [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Christopher_Robin_Davies)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/106 "2012-04-17T21:08:52Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Does this have any basis in real life, or was this plucked from someone’s butt? On what planet…? Roger essentially told Ken that he could not moonlight. Not unheard of though unreasonable in this case. We are not allowed to moonlight on my job and we have told a freelance writer who worked here that writing was included in that. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/107 "2012-04-17T21:35:34Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Does this have any basis in real life, or was this plucked from someone’s butt? On what planet…? Not at all. Most professionals working for a corporation, as part of their contract, have to follow rules involving outside employment. Usually they aren’t that harsh but it’s certainly within the realm of possibility. He’s not telling him that he can’t write. He’s telling him that he can’t have a second career. ---
**Author:** ![Bleach23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Bleach23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bleach23)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/108 "2012-04-17T21:51:08Z")
I thought Peggy was mainly upset about Ken’s writing because she feels she needs to have a backup plan. SCDP is still a new agency that could fail. Since having a female copy writer is still a fairly new and uncommon practice she may think Ken could help put in a good word for her if he left. I also found Ken’s story about the robot and the bridge fascinating. I think the story was somewhat about his feelings for his own career. That he feels stuck in a confined position where he has no real authority (he can just tighten or loosen the screw). ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/109 "2012-04-17T22:10:51Z")
> [@Bleach23](#): > > I also found Ken’s story about the robot and the bridge fascinating. I think the story was somewhat about his feelings for his own career. That he feels stuck in a confined position where he has no real authority (he can just tighten or loosen the screw). i wonder if it was a bit of foreshadowing, he could, if he felt like, simply “loosen a bolt” at SCDP and the whole thing could fall apart. ---
**Author:** ![Shalmanese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shalmanese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shalmanese)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/110 "2012-04-17T22:15:58Z")
Based on the timeline, Ken wrote the story just before meeting his fiancee so it’s plausible that he wrote it while working at the imploding Sterling Cooper before joining SCDP. I interpreted it as Ken working through his emotions of feeling powerless and mindlessly executing the orders of an out of touch executive team that was unwittingly destroying the company. When he interviewed at SCDP, he was clearly unhappy with the direction of the old Sterling Cooper. ---
**Author:** ![Bleach23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Bleach23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bleach23)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/111 "2012-04-17T22:15:59Z")
Interesting Gangster, I hadn’t thought about it like that but you might be right. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2012, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/112 "2012-04-17T23:12:29Z")
When I was working in Georgia, early 2002, some brainstorm legislator tried to push through a ‘moonlighting’ bill that would have given the University System of Georgia a percentage of the profits for any writings or consulting or other for-profit endeavors by professors at Georgia state colleges and universities. I can’t remember exactly what the argument was- something about a couple of professors having earned gazillions from developing electronics while working at Georgia supported universities and a couple who became wealthy when their books about Afghanistan/the Taliban/Osama became totally unexpected bestsellers after 9-11, and the argument being that they wouldn’t have had the liberty to do the research/writing/etc. without the taxpayers footing the bill OR that they couldn’t be doing a very good job teaching if they were doing that much moonlighting, etc., and thus the state should have a stake in it. Of course it caused a near rebellion since many professors dream of one day hitting it big with their writing or sidework or being a CNN consultant or whatever, and many more were afraid of “what if I transfer from here to Florida _then_ do something big- is Georgia still going to come after me?”, but it was an English professor who happened to also be a pseudonymous Star Trek novelist who really led the charge (he actually made more money writing ST novels than teaching, but taught for the insurance) by having some copyright attorneys he knew well send a “9 major reasons that this will monetarily cost you 5 times more to enforce that you could ever conceivably reap in financial gain” at the same time as some of the biggest names in the state were threatening to leave (this being 2002 when that was feasible). Anyway, could be a similar thing with SCDP: “We’re not making you busy enough if you have time to do this, and if you’re writing at work or being inspired by anything you see at work you owe us.” Ken reminds me of one of Kurt Vonnegut’s continual laments: that there was a time (lasted through the early 70s or so) when sci-fi/fantasy writers (like Kilgore Trout) could actually make a living or at least a nice side income due to all the sci-fi magazines and also the anthology and even soft core porn mags that paid for short stories. After the '70s (per Vonnegut) you had to write novels because there was no market for stories, and only a few novelists could ever make anything close to a decent living at it. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/113 "2012-04-18T00:00:22Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Ken reminds me of one of Kurt Vonnegut’s continual laments: that there was a time (lasted through the early 70s or so) when sci-fi/fantasy writers (like Kilgore Trout) could actually make a living or at least a nice side income due to all the sci-fi magazines and also the anthology and even soft core porn mags that paid for short stories. After the '70s (per Vonnegut) you had to write novels because there was no market for stories, and only a few novelists could ever make anything close to a decent living at it. One of you has the timing wrong. The collapse of the magazine market took place in the late 50s, when the major distribution network went bankrupt. The field went from around 40 magazines to a half-dozen or so. However, the novel market was already becoming more important than the short story market. Amazingly, there was basically no publisher for genre science fiction novels in the 1940s until several small presses started by fans filled the gap starting around 1948 or 1949. In the 50s Doubleday and Ballantine had good results with sf and by the end of the decade most publishers were creating sf lines. Samuel R. Delany was able to publish 6 or 7 novels starting in 1962 before he ever published a short story. But in 1966 Farrar, Strauss & Giroux was as likely to publish a collection of genre sf short stories by an unknown as Jaguar was to sponsor NASCAR. Or at any time since for that matter. ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/114 "2012-04-18T01:00:13Z")
> [@Shalmanese](#): > > Based on the timeline, Ken wrote the story just before meeting his fiancee so it’s plausible that he wrote it while working at the imploding Sterling Cooper before joining SCDP. I interpreted it as Ken working through his emotions of feeling powerless and mindlessly executing the orders of an out of touch executive team that was unwittingly destroying the company. When he interviewed at SCDP, he was clearly unhappy with the direction of the old Sterling Cooper. So maybe the only decision that Ken could make on his own was whether or not to bring a lawnmower into the office… ---
**Author:** ![Bleach23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Bleach23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bleach23)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/115 "2012-04-18T02:56:22Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > So maybe the only decision that Ken could make on his own was whether or not to bring a lawnmower into the office… LOL ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/116 "2012-04-18T03:22:55Z")
> [@salinqmind](#): > > Because they are all grown women married to those men? And not young high school girls being hit on by a screwup who is hoping to use them to make himself feel better? Jane was 20 yrs old and Roger was in his late 40s/early 50s when he left his wife for her. Not only was he farther appart from her in age than Pete was with the HS girl Roger even has a daughter the same age as Jane. > [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Back in the time frame of this show, there wasn’t as much of a taboo on men of Pete’s age chasing after 17-18 year old girls. Heck, half the pop-songs that came out around that time are about the practice. > [@salinqmind](#): > > The ultimate skeeze was drunken horse’s ass Roger playing giddyup with one of the twin models, in her underwear, in the office after hours. That was a truly vomitous scene. In real life the actresses were 18. But according to some, that’s perfectly fine because they were over the ‘age of consent’. Don’t forget about wanting the girls to kiss eacher and trying to work up to a menage a trio. ---
**Author:** ![Nunzio\_Tavulari](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Nunzio\_Tavulari](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nunzio_Tavulari)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/117 "2012-04-18T08:47:17Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > But in 1966 Farrar, Strauss & Giroux was as likely to publish a collection of genre sf short stories by an unknown as Jaguar was to sponsor NASCAR. Or at any time since for that matter. Although not relevant to your discussion, in the sixty years of NASCAR before Toyota won in 2008, Jaguar was the only foreign make to win a race at the top level. There was a time when MGs and even VW Beetles raced in NASCAR. cite: [http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/headlines/cup/03/09/toyota.first.win.atlanta/index.html](http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/headlines/cup/03/09/toyota.first.win.atlanta/index.html) > [@](#): > > June 13, 1954, when Al Keller drove a Jaguar to Victory Lane at Linden Airport in New Jersey. That day, Jaguars took four of the top six positions. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Downtown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Mr\_Downtown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Downtown)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/118 "2012-04-18T14:55:07Z")
I was shocked to hear Lane refer to “Jaguar, Incorporated.” Surely it would have been “Jaguar, Limited” and the difference would have been apparent to his British ear. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/119 "2012-04-18T14:58:35Z")
Maybe its U.S. subsidiary or affiliate was Jaguar Inc. ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907/120 "2012-04-18T15:36:25Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > ETA: I dug the Beethoven in the credits clearly being fuzzy from an LP. Me, too. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-5-04-signal-30-open-spoilers/618907.md?page=7)