# Mad-Men: 7.14 "Person to Person", SERIES FINALE (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 17, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273 "2015-05-17T23:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/161 "2015-05-19T17:05:12Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > _ **You’re** _ shortchanging Peggy’s character. That’s not “what her wrap-up amounted to.” Why can’t she have her career and be brilliant at McCann AND also be loved by a man who supports her ambition and sees her creative potential? Are these two things mutually exclusive in your mind? I don’t have a problem with Peggy winding up in a good place; my issue is with _how_ her story got her there. Mad Men has never been a rom-com, but now with literally five minutes left in the whole series, for the first time ever, she suddenly turns giggling and breathless and realizes “You were right in front of me and I’ve loved you all along!” That’s not letting her have it all, that’s turning her into a different person for the sake of fanservice, in my view. Note too that Weiner did the opposite with Joan, giving her an out-of-nowhere love of her life in the last few episodes, basically to force her to have to choose between love and career. This is part of a larger problem I had with the last few episodes, how so many characters were turned into different people at the last minute. Pete decided to change his whole outlook on life and head off to the heartland, and Trudy immediately decided to trust him and go with him. Roger decided it was time to settle down. Betty became a rock of personal strength. Heck, even comic-relief Meredith revealed hidden competence. Certainly, it’s plausible that any of this might happen, but all of it at once just feels uncharacteristically tidy. Besides, this show has always sent the message that people _don’t_ change; we’ve always seen everyone doing the same things over and over. I don’t mean to overstate my feelings. I didn’t hate it; I really didn’t. The acting was stellar as always, and I would have continued to watch these people even if Weiner had sent them all off to run an inn together in Vermont. I’m just trying to articulate why the writing has left me somewhat put off. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/162 "2015-05-19T17:11:23Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > I don’t have a problem with Peggy winding up in a good place; my issue is with _how_ her story got her there. Mad Men has never been a rom-com, but now with literally five minutes left in the whole series, for the first time ever, she suddenly turns giggling and breathless and realizes “You were right in front of me and I’ve loved you all along!” That’s not letting her have it all, that’s turning her into a different person for the sake of fanservice, in my view. I thought they’ve been building a PEggy-Stan romance for quite a while. He was the she kept in touch with when she went to Ted Chaough’s company, she revealed to him about her adopted baby, they spent many long hours together in personal conversation. While her realization did seem a bit quick, the pairing of those two didn’t seem surprising at all. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/163 "2015-05-19T17:16:33Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > But we leave Don in the lotus position going, “Ohm?” > [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Must. Resist. You prefer he kept spreading his siemen? ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/164 "2015-05-19T17:29:07Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > I thought they’ve been building a Peggy-Stan romance for quite a while. He was the she kept in touch with when she went to Ted Chaough’s company, she revealed to him about her adopted baby, they spent many long hours together in personal conversation. > > While her realization did seem a bit quick, the pairing of those two didn’t seem surprising at all. I felt the same. The actual moment (who didn’t call “he’s coming down the hall” when his line was dead?) was a bit Hollywood but the build up had been real over the past several years. And Stan was right: Peggy always could talk to him for ages on the phone and then say the shittiest stuff to his face. When he’d be right there and she was forced to confront her feelings with him in person, she’d just short out. I felt that Trudy had been mourning her marriage for a long time and never really moved on but just soldiered forth. And Pete was always jealous of the idea that she might start dating again and even scuttled his relationship with the LA real estate agent because of his feelings for Trudy. Like Peggy & Stan, it wrapped up in a hurry but I felt like the groundwork was there. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/165 "2015-05-19T17:34:26Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > You prefer he kept spreading his siemen? Cecil should write a coulomb about this. And he should be sure to keep it current. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/166 "2015-05-19T18:44:05Z")
Sepinwall mentions [in his review of the finale](http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/series-finale-review-mad-men-person-to-person-id-like-to-buy-the-world-a-coke) that Wiener said that he didn’t want to use real life taglines after the Lucky Strike deal so I buy that w/o a fresh cite being provided. However, Sepinwall points out that Weiner also said at the end of season 2 that he wouldn’t do a Kennedy assassination episode but yet he did exactly that the following season. People can change their mind. I guess he mentions not using real life campaigns in [this interview w/ Sepwinall](http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/mad-men-creator-matthew-weiner-talks-peggy-joan-sci-fi-and-more-about-season-5). You’ll have to dig through it though. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/167 "2015-05-19T19:10:25Z")
Was anyone else struck by the faint (color-wise) resemblance of Trudy’s pale pink traveling outfit to Jackie Kennedy’s pink Nov 22 traveling outfit? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/168 "2015-05-19T19:24:04Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > And I do think the kids are going to stay with Henry. Sally is right about that. Henry is a decent guy. He won’t prevent Don from seeing the kids. But Henry will provide the continuity they need. I don’t think Sally particularly cares about Henry one way or the other. Nor do I think he particularly cares about the boys, no matter how “decent” he is; after all, they’re not his children. As indicated above, Sally now sees herself as the family’s anchor and wants to remain _in the house_ for the sake of stability, something neither Don nor Betty (in the end) were able to provide. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/169 "2015-05-19T19:26:19Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Was anyone else struck by the faint (color-wise) resemblance of Trudy’s pale pink traveling outfit to Jackie Kennedy’s pink Nov 22 traveling outfit? Well, pink was big back then … but the outfit would have been more significant/ominous if the episode had been set closer to 1963. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/170 "2015-05-19T20:07:56Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > It was after season 1, so I’m not searching back through eight years of Internet. I didn’t say it was Internet flames. All that happened was that he was somewhat surprised by the negative reaction he received for presenting an old tag line as Don’s work and acknowledged that it wasn’t the best idea. In the future, therefore, he would use real world products but not real world campaigns. All very low-key, as is Weiner’s usual way. AFAIK, he’s stuck to that for the past six seasons. (Someone will surely pop up to tell me if I’m wrong.) Sure, he could change his mind if he thought it was good for the plot. I just feel that would be a very odd break at this point. Where were the flames coming from if not the internet? TV personalities? Magazines? I’m not trying to press you, I just recall neither any negative reaction or flaming of note nor any article or interview in which he said it was a mistake and wouldn’t appropriate campaigns anymore specifically because of view reaction. If you run across one, please post it. If he did, in fact, say he wouldn’t appropriate real world campaigns then the ambiguous ending with the Coke commercial means he just trolled everyone. I don’t think that would be the lasting memory he would want to leave for Mad Men. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/171 "2015-05-19T20:12:51Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I don’t think Sally particularly cares about Henry one way or the other. Nor do I think he particularly cares about the boys, no matter how “decent” he is; after all, they’re not his children. > > As indicated above, Sally now sees herself as the family’s anchor and wants to remain _in the house_ for the sake of stability, something neither Don nor Betty (in the end) were able to provide. Sally thought that Don was about to fly in & “rescue” them. Which is not what she or Betty wanted. Once Betty is “in the ground” (as Sally said not so long ago), more permanent plans can be made. Which do not involve Sally ending her education to be surrogate Mom. Henry truly loves Betty & will probably want to throw himself into his work after she’s gone. Perhaps he could rent the house to Don for a bit? ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/172 "2015-05-19T20:20:58Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I don’t think Sally particularly cares about Henry one way or the other. Nor do I think he particularly cares about the boys, no matter how “decent” he is; after all, they’re not his children. > > As indicated above, Sally now sees herself as the family’s anchor and wants to remain _in the house_ for the sake of stability, something neither Don nor Betty (in the end) were able to provide. The continuity Henry will provide is not Henry himself- it’s the same house, school, neighborhood, etc.Which they won’t have if Don swoops in- even if he took all three to live with him, it wouldn’t be the same house, etc. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/173 "2015-05-19T20:25:48Z")
I imagine Don returning to NYC with a clear head, and hopefully clear lungs, and a new attitude. He’s said goodbye to Dick Whitman and has fully embraced Don Draper. He wants to leave a mark on the world, and the Coke ad was his crowning glory. If I was the creator of that ad, I’d be tickled to have “Don Draper” usurp my creation. If nothing else, it’s rejuvenated interest in the ad/song, and he’ll presumably be getting a kickback of some sort. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/174 "2015-05-19T20:31:46Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > If I was the creator of that ad, I’d be tickled to have “Don Draper” usurp my creation. If nothing else, it’s rejuvenated interest in the ad/song, and he’ll presumably be getting a kickback of some sort. I posted a link upthread. The creator is in his late 80’s and is very tickled. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/175 "2015-05-19T20:32:19Z")
> [@GrandWino](#): > > Sepinwall mentions [in his review of the finale](http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/series-finale-review-mad-men-person-to-person-id-like-to-buy-the-world-a-coke) that Wiener said that he didn’t want to use real life taglines after the Lucky Strike deal so I buy that w/o a fresh cite being provided. However, Sepinwall points out that Weiner also said at the end of season 2 that he wouldn’t do a Kennedy assassination episode but yet he did exactly that the following season. People can change their mind. > > I guess he mentions not using real life campaigns in [this interview w/ Sepwinall](http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/mad-men-creator-matthew-weiner-talks-peggy-joan-sci-fi-and-more-about-season-5). You’ll have to dig through it though. The question I have is, did he change his outlook on using real campaigns because of negative viewer reaction to “It’s toasted.” In those interviews, Weiner doesn’t really mention anything about viewer reaction, so I don’t think my question is answered yet. He does say he wouldn’t use famous campaigns, though, so maybe that’s an argument for Don didn’t make it. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/176 "2015-05-19T22:08:16Z")
Henry has a very dutiful side to him and will want to do what is best for the kids. I don’t have a handle on how much of a presence he is in their lives, though, with his own busy career. The house provides continuity for the boys, but if they’ll be largely alone and raised by housekeepers, it may not work long-term. I may have forgotten something, but I don’t remember Betty’s brother being a bad guy. He didn’t get along with Betty, but who did? His wife was willing to be nursemaid for their father, as I recall; she would take in the kids. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/177 "2015-05-19T23:06:52Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Must. Resist. > > mmm And you can forget about \*Henry \*- he’ll \*coil \*up, after Rockefeller fails to be _induct_ed into higher office. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim_r.mortiss/32/142_2.png) [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/178 "2015-05-19T23:58:32Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > …Pete and family flying off to Wichita to start their lives over was actually okay with me. He’s a little rat and will simply continue to be the rodent that he is, elsewhere. But did we ever see him land safely? I can’t imagine Pete, who couldn’t even stand the suburbs of New York, being happy in Wichita. And both of his parents died in vehicular accidents at sea. I can imagine that it was an unstated off-screen implication that his plane went down (probably in a body of water) with all passengers and crew lost. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2015, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/179 "2015-05-20T00:01:47Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Just a note of thanks to **alphaboi867** for doing these threads. Agreements or disagreements, I always got more out of each episode after spending a week digging into it with like-minded watchers. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2015, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273/180 "2015-05-20T00:07:49Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > We live in different worlds, then. So in your world, people think an imaginary man wrote a real advertisement? > [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > I thought they’ve been building a PEggy-Stan romance for quite a while. He was the she kept in touch with when she went to Ted Chaough’s company, she revealed to him about her adopted baby, they spent many long hours together in personal conversation. > > While her realization did seem a bit quick, the pairing of those two didn’t seem surprising at all. It was clear to me way back when in the scene in the hotel room in their underwear. They challenged each other in a most spectacular way. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mad-men-7-14-person-to-person-series-finale-open-spoilers/720273.md?page=10)