# Mafia: Conspiracy 2: The Cabal Strikes Back! \[Game Over\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 9, 2008, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324 "2008-06-09T14:52:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 55
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1082 "2008-07-01T08:14:21Z")
Whoa Whoa Whoa… My thoughts on **Peds and Story Part Two:** Just some nice and Neat little quotes first, If I could post the damn things (anyone know how to quote within a quote?, It’d be helpful) [QUOTE=Conspiracy 2 rules] You are a Magician, a member of the Town. Each Night you may choose one other player as your stand-in. If you are attacked, your attacker will instead target your proxy. **You will discover the identity of your would-be attacker, and he yours.** Your trickery will protect you from multiple attackers on a single Night, but once you’ve successfully evaded attack, you may no longer protect yourself. [/QUOTE] That’s from **Omi** ’s post, I believe. So uh. That’s very helpful. Shall we go back to the Accused though? [QUOTE=pedescribe] Hello, storyteller. I was moving Sat&Sun, just got the internet back up. Anyway, yes, I am a vig. I got this: and groaned. Dangit! I know, I know, it was stupid to kill last night, but I was just too danged excited about having OHHSHINYPOWERS!!!1!!1 and I picked a target at random. Hopefully NBC is scum. If not, well, I’ll be dead tommorow morning. [/QUOTE] Damnit! What did he get? Let’s take a looksie: [QUOTE=pedescribe] **Pleonast** : pedescribe kills storyteller0910. No! You’ve been tricked! storyteller0910 is a Magician. pedescribe actually kills NaturalBlondChap. [/QUOTE] ```auto Roosh's Wonderings: 1. So uh... why target **Storyteller** again? You're a **Vig** that killed at Random? [quote= Pleo's Rules] You are a Vigilante, a member of the Town. Each Night you may choose to kill a player. The Vampire is not immune to your efforts. **However if, when the side of your victim is revealed, they are also Town, you will be required to target yourself on the next Night**. If you are prevented from killing yourself, you recover from your remorse. Please notify me of your target before the end of each Night. [/quote] ---So wait... You're a Vig... and you took the CHANCE to kill at Random, even though if you missed, and hit town you'd end up DYING? :dubious: There's ballsy moves, and gutsy moves, and then there's stupid ones... This is just silly, sir. I understand being reckless, and perhaps trying to Nightkill someone you think is REALLY scummy and staking your life on it. But just staking your life on a Random Pick? That's just unbelievable to me. 2. This one's the kicker for me: IN the above quote on Rules for the Magician, it says *You will discover the identity of your would-be attacker, and he yours.* You however didn't say that. YOU said something different, **Peds**. [QUOTE=pedescribe] **Pleonast** : pedescribe kills storyteller0910. No! You've been tricked! storyteller0910 is a Magician. pedescribe actually kills NaturalBlondChap. [/QUOTE] You actually not only found out the Role of the Magician, but then you ALSO found out WHO you got to kill as well? That's a pretty sweet deal, and a nifty power, but it's not what the Rules say. The Rules point out you get to know why your failed, and he gets to know he was targeted. The fact that you're pointing out that you ALSO got to know who you killed surprises me a little. Namely because kills in this game seem to be a valuable commodity, and information is REALLY hard to come by. So the fact that you got to know your kill failed, and you got to know WHY it failed, and then you get the extra info of knowing who **Story** picked to re-direct the kill to really surprises me. I just don't buy it, **Peds**. Nice Try, but I think you're lying. ** Vote Pedescribe** The fact that you want to play this game, but then disregarded a KEY KEY element of the Vig's ability is surprising to me (as you didn't mention it yet, so I'm also curious on that matter- any fear that you're gonna die from that? :dubious: Or are you going to state that you "forgot" about that part of the ability? And thus just played a wild and reckless card as the Vig?) I would love to hear your thoughts though on the matter- especially on your reasoning that your life is worth *staking *on a random guess.... Pun intended. :cool: Eh, eh? That was pretty good, no? But I think I'm pretty sold on my vote here, as I think you're a liar, and so- Lynch the Liars and all that jazz. ``` ---
**Author:** ![CatInASuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3be4f8/32.png) [@CatInASuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CatInASuit)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1083 "2008-07-01T08:36:20Z")
The rules state: [QUOTE=Pleonast] If you are attacked, your attacker will instead target your proxy. You will discover the identity of your would-be attacker, and he yours. [/QUOTE] The identity reveal is between the Magician and the attacker, not the attacker and the end victim. It also doesn’t mention the roles in there. My surprise was at \*\*pedescribe \*\* quoting that in his PM he said he killed **NBC**. ---
**Author:** ![Omi\_no\_Kami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Omi\_no\_Kami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omi_no_Kami)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1084 "2008-07-01T10:33:17Z")
This isn’t a smoking gun so much as a melty, somewhat inconsequential piece of trivia, but I’d like to point something out. To quote **pedescribe’s** alleged PM from **Pleonast** : [QUOTE=Original PM] Pleonast: pedescribe kills storyteller0910. No! You’ve been tricked! storyteller0910 is a Magician. pedescribe actually kills NaturalBlondChap. [/quote] Now, we know that posting styles can be intentionally changed, but every game-related PM I’ve received from **Pleo** has been reasonably well-written and decently verbose, and so I find it a little doubtful that he would’ve written such an abrupt, lifeless game message when he could’ve composed something more stylish, or at least better written. ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1085 "2008-07-01T11:09:41Z")
[QUOTE=Omi no Kami] Now, we know that posting styles can be intentionally changed, but every game-related PM I’ve received from **Pleo** has been reasonably well-written and decently verbose, and so I find it a little doubtful that he would’ve written such an abrupt, lifeless game message when he could’ve composed something more stylish, or at least better written. [/QUOTE] Not necessarily. Here’s mine: > [@Pleonast](#): > > You are attacked by pedescribe, but your trickery saves you. You lose your power. So verbose he is not necessarily. Here’s my question: has anyone ever received a game-related PM from Pleonast written in the third-person like **pedescribe** claims his was? ---
**Author:** ![Omi\_no\_Kami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Omi\_no\_Kami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omi_no_Kami)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1086 "2008-07-01T11:16:50Z")
[QUOTE=storyteller0910] Not necessarily. Here’s mine: So verbose he is not necessarily. Here’s my question: has anyone ever received a game-related PM from Pleonast written in the third-person like **pedescribe** claims his was? [/QUOTE] Hitting “Reply” didn’t pick up the quote within a quote, but it’s right above this post. But thanks for that; I’ve yet to get an in-character PM about goings on, so it helps to see a (probably 😉 ) legit example. I for one, however, have never received a Pleo PM written in the third person, but since I haven’t received _any_ that probably isn’t much help. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1087 "2008-07-01T11:41:19Z")
**Vote pedescribe** On top of what everyone else has said about the likelihood of the vig essentially random-killing, I feel compelled to point out a bit of metagaming. **storyteller** is one of those dangerous experienced players, so it would make sense for scum to want to take him out early. Because of those two facts, I think it’s much more likely that **pedescribe** is scum rather than the Vig. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1088 "2008-07-01T12:07:52Z")
First let’s get this out of the way. **Unvote Digit** **Vote pedescribe** First, as has been noted, random doesn’t seem like a logical choice for a pro town self destructing vig. Second, the post that he quotes from **pleo** doesn’t sound at all like any of the role posts. **Story** ’s seems a heck of a lot more consistent with the rest of the set up in this game. **pedescribe** ’s seems a heck of a more like a hastily contrived scum wiggle. ---
**Author:** ![CatInASuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3be4f8/32.png) [@CatInASuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CatInASuit)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1089 "2008-07-01T12:17:22Z")
Picking up where I left off yesterday. **vote pedescribe** Also, for those people expecting any investigation results from me, don’t expect anything until Night 2, I won’t have the results before then. Which corpse to examine: **NBC** , \*\*Santo Rugger \*\* or **brewha**. Decisions decisions… ---
**Author:** ![CatInASuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3be4f8/32.png) [@CatInASuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CatInASuit)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1090 "2008-07-01T12:31:04Z")
**Day 1 Final Vote Count:** Darth Sensitive(7): **Darth Sensitive** , pedescribe, peekercpa, **brewha** , Redwing, MHaye, storyteller0910 Oredigger77(4): Drain Bead, ShadowFacts, CatInASuit, **NaturalBlondChap** Nanook of the North Shore(2): One and Only Wanderers, Omi no Kami Pollux Oil(2): Oredigger77, Diomedes NaturalBlondChap(2): Hockey Monkey, fluiddruid brewha(2): Zsofia, Hal Briston storyteller0910(1): dotchan dotchan(1): RoOsh Hawkeyeop(1): cckerberos cckerberos(1): \*\*Santo Rugger \*\* Omi no Kami(1): Pollux Oil pedescribe(1): NAF1138 Santo Rugger(1): CoG888 No Outstanding Vote: Hawkeyeop, Koldanar, DiggitCamara, NanookoftheNorthShore, ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies **Town Wolf Cabal Undead Unknown** ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1091 "2008-07-01T12:56:00Z")
[QUOTE=CatInASuit] Picking up where I left off yesterday. Also, for those people expecting any investigation results from me, don’t expect anything until Night 2, I won’t have the results before then. Which corpse to examine: **NBC** , \*\*Santo Rugger \*\* or **brewha**. Decisions decisions… [/QUOTE] Interesting. Why would you consider examining **NBC’s** corpse, given what I have said and the fact that - based on your vote - you are at least tentatively accepting my story? ---
**Author:** ![Hawkeyeop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/958977/32.png) [@Hawkeyeop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hawkeyeop)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1092 "2008-07-01T13:05:19Z")
[QUOTE=pedescribe] Hello, storyteller. I was moving Sat&Sun, just got the internet back up. Anyway, yes, I am a vig. I got this: and groaned. Dangit! I know, I know, it was stupid to kill last night, but I was just too danged excited about having OHHSHINYPOWERS!!!1!!1 and I picked a target at random. Hopefully NBC is scum. If not, well, I’ll be dead tommorow morning. [/QUOTE] Ooh a bandwagon. That makes things so much easier. I mean you aren’t really trying to hard to deny it. vote pedescribe I’m going to spend the rest of the day trying to develop opinions on everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1093 "2008-07-01T13:08:30Z")
Man, you people are impatient. It so happens that I had a lot going on with work yesterday and had minimal Mafia time available. I used it on Cecilvania and Apocolypse, since they’re moving a lot slower and are easier to follow along with. I can at least semi-confirm storyteller’s…erm story. He investigated as town. And since I know at least some of you will ask why story, it’s because he’s a strong player that often lives for a while. Confirming(or not as the case might have been) seems more valuable than trying to investigate someone like NBC or brewha. It’s a good thing too, since those investigations would have been a waste in the end. Some thoughts and questions about what came up today a little later, I have a bit of work to do this morning. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1094 "2008-07-01T13:13:35Z")
Well, this seems like a no-brainer to me, which always makes me nervous. 🆒 **Vote pedescribe** I’ve got to run to a meeting, but I will be back with more thoughts later. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1095 "2008-07-01T13:15:40Z")
[QUOTE=Nanook of the North Shore] Man, you people are impatient. It so happens that I had a lot going on with work yesterday and had minimal Mafia time available. I used it on Cecilvania and Apocolypse, since they’re moving a lot slower and are easier to follow along with. I can at least semi-confirm storyteller’s…erm story. He investigated as town. And since I know at least some of you will ask why story, it’s because he’s a strong player that often lives for a while. Confirming(or not as the case might have been) seems more valuable than trying to investigate someone like NBC or brewha. It’s a good thing too, since those investigations would have been a waste in the end. Some thoughts and questions about what came up today a little later, I have a bit of work to do this morning. [/QUOTE] Information noted. I am still highly suspicious of you myself, but that dosn’t matter right now, because I think we have found scum in **pedescribe**. It doesn’t take much time to pop in and say we investigated x, they came up y. Will be interestd to see what your inv claim is (game day)tomorrow ---
**Author:** ![Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d9b06d/32.png) [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boozahol_Squid_P.I)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1096 "2008-07-01T13:16:44Z")
[QUOTE=storyteller0910] So verbose he is not necessarily. Here’s my question: has anyone ever received a game-related PM from Pleonast written in the third-person like **pedescribe** claims his was? [/QUOTE] Yes ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1097 "2008-07-01T13:24:50Z")
[QUOTE=Diomedes] Yes [/QUOTE] Doubly interesting. If you’re telling the truth - and I don’t know why you wouldn’t be - that strongly suggests that **pedescribe** did receive the PM he claimed to have received. That doesn’t tell us much about **pedescribe’s** alignment, though, because presumably he’d have gotten a PM of that sort whether he was a Vig, Vampire, Wolf, or Murderous Chia Bingo Manager. Ultimately, it comes to this: I can’t imagine a pro-Town Vig, who is not forced to kill and who _dies_ if he makes a mistake, choosing a target purely at random on the first Night. I could have been a Witch, or a second Coroner, or nearly anything at all, and I just can’t credit the idea that a Vig would take a risk like that without even _trying_ to make an informed choice (especially when no-kill was a viable option). vote pedescribe, but _please_, let’s not make this into a Day like the one where I was lynched in Cecilvania, where we all just sit around waiting for the fait accompli to be accomplied. If **pedescribe** is scum and **brewha** wasn’t lying, then we’re off to a shiny start, but we have a very long way to go. Let’s start with this: **CatinaSuit** , I’m frankly becoming increasingly concerned that as a Detective, you’re an excellent Wolf. Your survival, if you are telling the truth, is difficult to explain, because if you’re telling the truth you are now guaranteed to be able to provide some information. Killing you quickly should have been a Wolf priority. Unless Nanook is a Wolf, and the Wolves therefore thought the real Witches would be protecting you. So let’s say it this way: I think it’s exceedingly likely that either CIAS or Nanook is lying. Thoughts? ---
**Author:** ![DiggitCamara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@DiggitCamara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiggitCamara)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1098 "2008-07-01T13:25:24Z")
[QUOTE=pedescribe] Hello, storyteller. I was moving Sat&Sun, just got the internet back up. Anyway, yes, I am a vig. I got this: and groaned. Dangit! I know, I know, it was stupid to kill last night, but I was just too danged excited about having OHHSHINYPOWERS!!!1!!1 and I picked a target at random. Hopefully NBC is scum. If not, well, I’ll be dead tommorow morning. [/QUOTE] Well… honestly, if you’re really a vig and have no better idea than to pick victims at random, you’re a loose gun. And not really that helpful to town. So, let’s **vote pedescribe** for now. ---
**Author:** ![DiggitCamara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@DiggitCamara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiggitCamara)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1099 "2008-07-01T13:29:50Z")
[QUOTE=storyteller0910] (snipped) So verbose he is not necessarily. Here’s my question: has anyone ever received a game-related PM from Pleonast written in the third-person like **pedescribe** claims his was? [/QUOTE] I’d amend this to read: Has anyone received a game-related PM from \*\*Pleonast \*\*written in the third-person _in games previous to this one_? But that’s just me… ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1100 "2008-07-01T13:37:21Z")
**vote pedescribe** Seriously, wouldn’t a Vig afraid of death try and kill somebody who was looking scummy? A Vig killing **NaturalBlondChap** , yes. I thought that was what had happened originally - a Vig who felt pretty confident that NBC was scum and stepped up to take the chance. But somebody who didn’t even post much the first Day? In other words, whether the PM looks legit or not (and I do find it suspect) the fact that he would pick **storyteller** when there were good, real targets out there is at absolute best anti-town and at worst a screaming flashing red light. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324/1101 "2008-07-01T14:14:03Z")
Rules Clarification: _Exactly what information does a Magician and their attacker gain?_ The Magician will discover the role of their attacker. The attacker will discover the role of the Magician. Attackers always know who they try to attack and the success or failure of the attack, if even it’s redirected. I didn’t include that in the Magician role description, because it’s a natural power of every killing role. Also, Pleonast makes no comment about writing styles… 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324.md?page=54) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-conspiracy-2-the-cabal-strikes-back-game-over/452324.md?page=56)