# Mafia - Game in progress \[Edited title\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 9, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635 "2013-01-09T16:03:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 53
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1041 "2013-02-10T19:30:02Z")
**choie** , I’m not dismissing what you say, Im trying to convince you that you are looking in the wrong place to find scum, but if it makes you feel better I’ll play along with you. Please analyze the Dusk and Dawn color posts and tell us how that helps us identify who the Scum players are… ---
**Author:** ![fubbleskag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fubbleskag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fubbleskag)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1042 "2013-02-10T19:46:51Z")
on my way out for a triple-date, hope to do some more reading when the wife and I settle down for tv-at-bedtime later, but first: it’s easy enough to write-off the defensive and self-deprecating aspects to some degree as a quirk of her personality / play-style, but I feel like there’s a constant (and growing) tone of “me vs. all of you” in **choie** ’s posts. I’m thinking there’s a good chance she’s our 3rd party. **vote choie** (I’m willing to lift this in favour of a scum-lynch, or if there’s a compelling reason not to lynch a 3rd party.) ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1043 "2013-02-10T20:25:06Z")
Ok, yesterday I said I’d go back and look at the people who voted for Diggit prior to his Mason claim if no one came around to counter claim him. As no one has, I have looked and in the spirit of multi-voting, and in spite of Silver Jan having voted him and flipping Town, I am still inclined to believe his claim and inclined to think that there is scum in those who voted for him. > [@Silver\_Jan](#): > > **DiggitCamara** , you want the Masons, if there are any, to out themselves and yet you voted **Suburban Plankton** for giving us information? This doesn’t sit well with me. You’re suspicious of people that pointed out a grammatical error when it was obvious to everyone? It looks as if you have really made an in depth analysis when really it’s all a load of rubbish. Back to grammar, is **Pleo** a spring? (That was a joke BTW) > > **Vote DiggitCamara** > [@Mahaloth](#): > > **Vote Diggit** > > Masons should not reveal themselves this early unless they have very good reason. Perhaps that exists, since the Barn notes indicate it, but we shouldn’t push for it unless they reveal themselves. I rather assume they’ll explain why if they do. > [@TexCat](#): > > I agree with almost all of this, except I don’t understand the joke. I voted Diggit yesterDay for his vote on noob Ortho. > > **vote: DiggitCamara** > [@Dizzymrslizzy](#): > > Diggit, I also disagree with you and think it’s very anti-town play to want the masons to out themselves at this point. It’s WAY too early for that. > > I also really don’t like your vote on Suburban…You would have rathered him keep that tidbit to himself? It was a pro-town play IMO to come forward with it. > > Vote DiggitCamera > [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > This is a terrible reason to vote. If the error was on purpose (and I still don’t really see the profit in that), then it was pretty good Doper bait. The barn would have to be something like “male circumcision/cat declawing is a moral mandate” or “real chili has beans” to get a better response. > > Laying suspicion on Dopers for being pedantic is like laying suspicion on fish for being wet. > > **Vote DiggitCamara** \*\* Vote Mahaloth Vote TexCat Vote DizzyLizzy Vote Johnny Bravo\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1044 "2013-02-10T20:32:29Z")
So… you think they’re _all_ scum? Could you elaborate a little further on which, in particular, you’d like to see lynched? ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1045 "2013-02-10T20:44:04Z")
@ fubbleskag, what conclusion did you come to from your review of Stanislaus’ posts? @ Stanislaus, if you plan to claim something, please do it sooner rather than later @ Anyone, I notice that Pleo was shown as “a town vigilante”, and with Ryjae’s death toDay, I suspect there may be either a second vig or a back-up vig, please consider killing choie, TexCat or mahaloth @ Meeko, do you consider the barn some sort of potato? Do you have reason to believe the message is false? @ Choie, it’s been pointed out that a cop would only have had a single result to post, will you devote Stanislaus? @ Astral, I’m thinking the “but not the alpha wolf” actually gives weight to the message, it’s a bit like the message about the SK needing to stay alive, for some reason the cop has extra info and wanted to share that. I’ll admit I don’t see why it wasn’t signed - maybe the role name was more than 2 words? ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1046 "2013-02-10T20:44:25Z")
I think they’re each more likely to be scum than anyone else on the field of play, other than Stanislaus, which is enough for some multi-votes in my book. Stanislaus would be my first choice if I have to rank them. Are we ranking multi-votes now? ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1047 "2013-02-10T20:52:51Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > @ Anyone, I notice that Pleo was shown as “a town vigilante”, and with Ryjae’s death toDay, I suspect there may be either a second vig or a back-up vig, please consider killing choie, TexCat or mahaloth Another possibility: per the rules, there could more than one serial killer. > [@storyteller0910](#): > > You may expect at least one third party role. Importantly: Any and all third party elements in this game will have exclusive win conditions – that is, while they may be able to win alongside one another (if more than one exists), if a third party _wins_, then all Town and Scum players _lose_. Also… > [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > @ Astral, I’m thinking the “but not the alpha wolf” actually gives weight to the message, it’s a bit like the message about the SK needing to stay alive, for some reason the cop has extra info and wanted to share that. I’ll admit I don’t see why it wasn’t signed - maybe the role name was more than 2 words? Sure, but would the name be more than six words? “Stanislaus wolf, not alpha - My ridiculously long role name here.” It’s inexcusable not to sign your barn message if you want us to trust it. So I won’t. > [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > I think they’re each more likely to be scum than anyone else on the field of play, other than Stanislaus, which is enough for some multi-votes in my book. Stanislaus would be my first choice if I have to rank them. Are we ranking multi-votes now? You’re responsible and accountable for all of your votes. Right now, you’re saying “just lynch any of these five, I don’t care which, based on circumstantial evidence that there might be scum on the diggit wagon, but especially Stanislaus, the guy who has nothing to do with the diggit wagon.” You can imagine why I might consider these votes a little less persuasive than a more focused case. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1048 "2013-02-10T20:54:45Z")
That wasn’t fair of me. You do actually have a reason to vote for Stanislaus in another post, I just disagree with it. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1049 "2013-02-10T21:29:29Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > You’re responsible and accountable for all of your votes. Right now, you’re saying “just lynch any of these five, I don’t care which, based on circumstantial evidence that there might be scum on the diggit wagon, but especially Stanislaus, the guy who has nothing to do with the diggit wagon.” You can imagine why I might consider these votes a little less persuasive than a more focused case. You’re implying that I’m trying not to be accountable for my votes, which is not the case. You also seem to disagree with my analysis that scum would be tempted to opportunistically jump on a wagon building on a Town Mason advocating a novel/unpopular idea. I think that logic is sound, and there are 4 players who are still alive who’s behavior fit into that equation for hunting scum. We have the ability to cast more than one vote, so I’m voting according to my analysis of that particular equation. Are you disinclined to believe Diggit? Do you think my logic as to scum motivation is invalid? ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1050 "2013-02-10T21:36:27Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > Are you disinclined to believe Diggit? Do you think my logic as to scum motivation is invalid? No, and no. What I’m contesting is how you threw out four votes without trying to figure out which of them you truly believe to be scum, as I mentioned here: > [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > So… you think they’re _all_ scum? Could you elaborate a little further on which, in particular, you’d like to see lynched? ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1051 "2013-02-10T21:37:22Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > It’s inexcusable not to sign your barn message if you want us to trust it. So I won’t. As I’ve already said, assuming there is an Alpha Wolf, I would not expect a Town Investigator to be able to see through the obfuscating nature of Godfather/Alpha-ness. But a Third Party Investigator is a different ball of wax, who would probably not be inclined to sign their note in case there is a name-investigator or something. In that case the question would be whether or not to give any credence to any information that a possibly win-stealing third party might put on the table. I’m at least inclined to consider the possibility that the holder of such a role might choose to share whatever they get as an investigation result, or lie about them, so long as it focuses attention away from them. You also seem to be risking throwing the baby out with the bathwater and I don’t see how it is helpful to put blinders on during analysis. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1052 "2013-02-10T21:42:18Z")
I think those 4 players are about equal in potential scummitude at this point, or I would have elaborated. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1053 "2013-02-10T21:50:01Z")
Also, Astral, what about my case against Stanislaus don’t you agree with? Do you think Babale is scum who was trying to sew paranoia and confusion about whether The Barn can truly be used anonymously? Do you think it is a good idea to, as a policy that Stanislaus apparently has, to stay committed to the votes you had placed from the previous Day for no other reason than because you want to stay consistent? ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1054 "2013-02-10T22:22:53Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > Also, Astral, what about my case against Stanislaus don’t you agree with? Do you think Babale is scum who was trying to sew paranoia and confusion about whether The Barn can truly be used anonymously? Do you think it is a good idea to, as a policy that Stanislaus apparently has, to stay committed to the votes you had placed from the previous Day for no other reason than because you want to stay consistent? I was more unclear than I wanted to be. I’m referring only to voting for Stanislaus on the say-so of the barn message, not your case on the whole. I was making a general point about people jumping onto the Stanislaus wagon, and threw you in because you were repeating a vote based partially on it as well. I did note I didn’t find you scummy for it, in part because you’ve been pushing Stan for a while now, but I didn’t express that at all. Related to what you’re saying, I’ve had low-grade suspicions of Babale since Day 1, but I haven’t looked into him as much as I wanted to. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1055 "2013-02-10T22:29:14Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > As I’ve already said, assuming there is an Alpha Wolf, I would not expect a Town Investigator to be able to see through the obfuscating nature of Godfather/Alpha-ness. But a Third Party Investigator is a different ball of wax, who would probably not be inclined to sign their note in case there is a name-investigator or something. In that case the question would be whether or not to give any credence to any information that a possibly win-stealing third party might put on the table. I doubt Storyteller has created a third-party role with powers beneficial to town, when all third parties are win-stealing and cannot align with town. > [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > You also seem to be risking throwing the baby out with the bathwater and I don’t see how it is helpful to put blinders on during analysis. Short of someone saying “I wrote that message, and I’m ”, my natural inclination is to distrust all such messages. I’ve outlined why I find this one in particular to be fake up-thread. I personally believe we shouldn’t act on any messages until we can verify them; hence the need for signing. If that message came from the cop, and the cop had signed it “Grand Poobah of Seein’ Stuff”, and later he is nightkilled, we can trust the message. As it is, I’d prefer discarding it entirely. > [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > I think those 4 players are about equal in potential scummitude at this point, or I would have elaborated. Fair enough. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1056 "2013-02-10T22:30:19Z")
Incidentally: “Grand Poobah of Seein’ Stuff” would be an _awesome_ role name. ---
**Author:** ![LightFoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LightFoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LightFoot)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1057 "2013-02-11T00:11:49Z")
Continuing from [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15981350#post15981350) And my previous thoughts that the barn message D1 was possibly a Scum feeling pressure Granted I was wrong about \*\* chuc \*\* but I still think there is Scum in that pool \*\* Babale \*\* was in the top listed D1 \*\* Stan \*\* did put some pressure on \*\* babale \*\* AND it didn’t appear that he was going to let up Also > [@](#): > > In fact, the endless discussions about the Barn messages are exactly the kind of thing Scum want. \*\* Stan’s \*\* comment about the barn writings when he voted \*\* choie \*\* Scum could very well have decided that that would be a perfect player to target with a message on the barn. And as I mentioned before- if – for some reason we don’t lynch \*\* Stan \*\* this Day—Scum will feel ‘ safer’ knowing that an investigator is Very Likely to investigate \*\* Stan \*\* this Night- which could also create a visit fest of watcher/tracker types to peep that way too It’s a perfect storm for Scum . ( unless I’m the only one that sees my reasoning ) I can also see where it \* could \* be a true investigation- but the last bit “ is not alpha” would be obvious to a Town investigator ( because they got the result) – so why post it? - I was going to vote in this space but I don’t want a poke and hope vote in appearance- I’ll return with a proper cases \* [sub] names I can remember how to spell are less likely to get short cutted- no offense intended [/sub] ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1058 "2013-02-11T00:29:18Z")
I’m an idiot. Ignore all of my posts about the possibility of a Third Party investigator, as they would only make sense if the note had stated ‘Stan is Town, and not the Alpha Wolf’. The addition of that information like a second piece of evidence vs an inference (that a Stan wolf could not be Alpha if a wolf result was returned at all) had me discombobulated. I’m still not prepared to dismiss the note outright though, and Stan is still my top lynch candidate, especially the longer he maintains basically radio silence. It is possible that we’re dealing with a newer player in an Tow Investigator role who may gotten lucky and excited and may not have thought things through in the seasoned pedantic detail that some of us veteran players may have used in composing the message were we in his/her position. And FOS on you all for not calling me out on my batshit crazy ramblings when I have them. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1059 "2013-02-11T00:35:56Z")
\*\*vote: Astral \*\* His insistence that the barn message cannot be trusted until the writer claims it, seems like a scum ploy to out the investigator. \*\*vote: Cookies \*\* This is mostly an OMGUS vote, but I hate the way she shotgun voted all of the Diggit voters without regard to their reasons for voting. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635/1060 "2013-02-11T00:38:03Z")
And before anyone yells at me for possibly narrowing the pool for scum to look for a newbie Investigator, a crafty veteran could be trying to disguise themselves as a newbie. Anyway, I’m still willing to consider the possibility that the result is valid. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635.md?page=52) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-in-progress-edited-title/646635.md?page=54)