# \[Mafia game\] The Realm of Phere **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 1, 2012, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480 "2012-04-01T15:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 124
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2461 "2012-05-04T19:25:55Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > The claims by Gadarene and Astral seem to conflict. I’d ask each of them to repeat(_) to us exactly what their alignments were when they got the PM about shifting. (_ - I say “repeat” because I think they’ve already told us, but my notes are hopelessly out-of-date and it takes me huge time to search back.) I’m Lawful Good and have been Lawful Good for the duration of the game. At the beginning of the Day I received a message stating that I had been sufficiently active that I could opt to change my alignment to either Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good. The message also warned that changing my moral alignment (i.e., the good/neutral/evil component of my alignment) would change my goals in the game. Using what I know from ToeJam about his win condition and his True Neutral alignment, I interpret this to mean that if my moral alignment changes, my win condition changes in some way. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2462 "2012-05-04T19:27:13Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > Did you attack him every Day? > > I notice you didn’t mention whether or not you have attacked anyone at Night. You are Power Role hunting here. It’s extremely scummy of you. Stop it. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2463 "2012-05-04T19:29:45Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > It sounds like a key charge against **Tanaer** is that he was personal friend of **Weedy** and was chatting with her via phone. If they were Scum together, I doubt they’d have mentioned that. (I’m more worried about secrets Tanaer may have revealed when he was under Weedy’s spell … 😃 Tanaer, perhaps you should now tell us everything that Scum already knows anyway.) > > I don’t understand the case against **Visorslash** but he’s suffered some damage, so, even if we want him Dead, he may be easy to kill by our Attackers and there’s no need to waste our Lynch on him. > > I’m more worried about the Players who’ve returned from the Jaws of Hell. Are they still “Good”? If Gadarene is telling the truth, then Astral is likely to be lying. And Guiri seems to me to be lacking in the pro-Town diligence he had during his first life. > > I need to ensure I have some vote in place, so I’ll temporize with our poor handicapped Zombie: > > **Vote: Mosier** I don’t see why Astral has to be lying if I’m telling the truth, by the way. And WOW Suburban’s power role hunting was blatant there. Seriously. Combine that with what I said earlier about Suburban pursuing me even after the stated reason for that pursuit had been conclusively disproven to him via ToeJam’s PM (and Suburban keeping quiet about the fact that ToeJam’s PM to him had vindicated me), and I want to see him swing toDay. **Unvote Visorslash** **Vote Suburban Plankton** ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2464 "2012-05-04T19:31:33Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > I’m Lawful Good and have been Lawful Good for the duration of the game. At the beginning of the Day I received a message stating that I had been sufficiently active that I could opt to change my alignment to either Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good. The message also warned that changing my moral alignment (i.e., the good/neutral/evil component of my alignment) would change my goals in the game. Using what I know from ToeJam about his win condition and his True Neutral alignment, I interpret this to mean that if my moral alignment changes, my win condition changes in some way. And to add to this: I will never change my moral alignment in this game. I will consider changing the chaotic/neutral/lawful component of my alignment if and only if I judge that it will benefit Town by my doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Jan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Silver\_Jan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Jan)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2465 "2012-05-04T19:34:39Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > But this is entirely immaterial. You said you were voting Visorslash because he was being unhelpful. You made no mention of visiting people at night in either case. Being wrong about who did what had no bearing on your vote as presented to us > > **Vote Silver Jan** > > What was your rationale for voting for Visorslash? Jeez Astral, you have had a fucking bee in your bonnet about me since I voted for you, get over it. Visorslash bugs the hell out of me, I do not like the way he post capice! ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2466 "2012-05-04T19:49:47Z")
[My initial case on Silver Jan.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14997622&postcount=1872) check the PetW section and the Silver Jan sections. > [@Silver\_Jan](#): > > \*\* Astral\*\* has just pissed me off and the only reason he even has a slight case against me is 'cos he knew I was wrong when I voted for him in the first place, what a huge OMGUS vote, not happy there. Silver Jan’s unbelievably obvious mischaracterization of that case, with no rebuttal. > [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > But this is entirely immaterial. You said you were voting Visorslash because he was being unhelpful. You made no mention of visiting people at night in either case. Being wrong about who did what had no bearing on your vote as presented to us > > **Vote Silver Jan** > > What was your rationale for voting for Visorslash? My second vote for Silver Jan. > [@Silver\_Jan](#): > > Jeez Astral, you have had a fucking bee in your bonnet about me since I voted for you, get over it. > > Visorslash bugs the hell out of me, I do not like the way he post capice! Silver Jan’s second incredibly obvious mischaracterization of my votes. At the end there, she changes her stated reason for voting for Visorslash again. Am I the only one who sees this? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2467 "2012-05-04T19:56:07Z")
Astral, I’m fairly positive Silver Jan is town based on the tenor of our private conversations. Vote Suburban with me. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2468 "2012-05-04T20:31:48Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > You are Power Role hunting here. It’s extremely scummy of you. > > Stop it. No, I am Information hunting here. **Jan** volunteered that she had “only attacked Lord Phere during the Day”. That’s great as far as it goes, but it doesn’t actually say a whole lot. I asked her to fill in the rest of the information. It’s sort of like telling the ‘truth’, but not ‘the whole truth, and nothing but the truth’. If there is any direct correlation between ‘ability to attack players’ and ‘Power Roles’, I’m unaware of it. It looks top me like everyone has the ability to attack, protect, or both, regardless of whether of not they have ‘Powers’. > [@Gadarene](#): > > I don’t see why Astral has to be lying if I’m telling the truth, by the way. > > And WOW Suburban’s power role hunting was blatant there. Seriously. Combine that with what I said earlier about Suburban pursuing me even after the stated reason for that pursuit had been conclusively disproven to him via ToeJam’s PM (and Suburban keeping quiet about the fact that ToeJam’s PM to him had vindicated me), and I want to see him swing toDay. > > **Unvote Visorslash** > > **Vote Suburban Plankton** I’m not sure why you’re bringing \*\*ToeJam \*\*into this again. What he told me was simply “Hey, I’m the one that was talking to **Gadarene** , and this is what I told him”. That has absolutely nothing to do with why I voted for you. The only way in which you were ‘vindicated’ is that I knew you weren’t lying about having received information about the Third-Party WinCon. That doesn’t equate to you being town. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2469 "2012-05-04T20:38:08Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > The only way in which you were ‘vindicated’ is that I knew you weren’t lying about having received information about the Third-Party WinCon. That doesn’t equate to you being town. You voted me _because_ you accused me of lying about having received information about the Third Party Win Condition, actually. And you kept voting me after ToeJam told you that was not the case. And you NEVER acknowledged your error or volunteered the information that you were wrong about me lying. So… And do you see how “Information Hunting” like that is SPECTACULARLY anti-Town? What is the difference between “information hunting” and “power role hunting,” to you? ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2470 "2012-05-04T20:39:41Z")
It looks like we’ve all forgotten about the goodies up for grabs Today **Blue Ring: Suburban Plankton Diamond Ring: Suburban Plankton** ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2471 "2012-05-04T20:44:58Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > You voted me _because_ you accused me of lying about having received information about the Third Party Win Condition, actually. And you kept voting me after ToeJam told you that was not the case. And you NEVER acknowledged your error or volunteered the information that you were wrong about me lying. So… I did not accuse you of lying about having received information. I said: > [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > And while we’re at it > > **vote Gadarene** > > Either open up your magic bag and let us see what’s inside, or shut up. Besides, my cat assures me you’re Scum. I voted you because you dangled a little bit of information out in front of us, without giving any hint as to where it had come from. I later kept my vote on you for intimating that your information was ‘fact’ when in fact it was entirely unsubstantiated third-hand information. We went over all of this on Day 2 (or was it 3…I can’t remember, except that it seems like it was several real-life weeks ago). I’m not going to reshash it all again now. > [@](#): > > And do you see how “Information Hunting” like that is SPECTACULARLY anti-Town? What is the difference between “information hunting” and “power role hunting,” to you? I explained that in my previous post. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2472 "2012-05-04T21:06:05Z")
:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2012, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2473 "2012-05-04T21:19:00Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > :rolleyes: Well \*that’s \*a persuasive argument. I guess you win. ---
**Author:** ![LightFoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LightFoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LightFoot)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2474 "2012-05-05T01:00:25Z")
pending a reaction/ explanation (and I did vote him yesterDay) I will \*\* vote gnarly charlie \*\* and since \* I always wanted one \* \*\* diamond ring : LightFoot \*\* on preview these ad tags are annoying as hades or at least LP ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2475 "2012-05-05T01:23:44Z")
This game seems to be in a bit of a rut…and I can’t say I’m helping things right now. I have no strong leads on anyone right at the moment. Plus I keep getting horribly confused between this game and the other I’m currently playing in. I was going back trying to find the case I had made against **gnarlycharlie** , only to discover that was in the other game… :smack: I still have a problem with \*\*Believerer’s \*\*play (or mostly lack thereof). I’m about finished dealing with **Gadarene** , but I don’t know if he’s acting Scummy, or just being pig-headed. I don’t think gnarly’s ‘visit’ with \*\*Normal \*\*is necessarily Scummy either, absent any other information, though it would be nice for him to address it now. I didn’t like the quick bandwagon on \*\*Tanaer \*\*earlier, as his biggest sin seems to be having been a “Friend of Weedy”. I’m off to put some steaks on the grill, and then maybe I can come back, reread, and make a better case somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2476 "2012-05-05T01:28:05Z")
I can get behind a vote for gnarlycharlie. Gad, what are your feelings in that direction? I guess the answer to my rhetorical question regarding Silver Jan was “yes.” ---
**Author:** ![LightFoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LightFoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LightFoot)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2477 "2012-05-05T01:37:44Z")
I don’t KNOW that \*\* gnarly’s \*\* intent was BAD ( but I didn’t think he was there to rub \*\* Normal’s \*\* feet) BUT since he got quietish after I made a case and voted him yesterDay I know he was moving etc ( RL) AND he is not addressing the investigation . I’m using the bits I think I have for my vote I look forward to an official vote count since we are not known for high participation on weekends= and I have a date tonight ( \* yep it happens even at my age \*) WWSD what would scum do? I’ll think on that while I’m out. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2478 "2012-05-05T02:06:03Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > This was the only post of Jan’s I could find on that topic: > She seemed to recall Visor visiting _someone_; where did she say it was _you_? > > And as far as I recall, it was actually \*\*Visorslash \*\*that was visited (by **realitytrips** )…according to the PM that \*\*ToeJam \*\*sent **me**. > > So if that’s the case, Jan voted Visor based on a mistaken recollection of a third-hand Investigation result. > > Which might explain why she flip-flopped 😃 Looked like she was talking about gnarly visiting me, changed vote to. Gnarly when she realized it was him. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2479 "2012-05-05T02:08:29Z")
Sorry about contributing to rut. It would help me if others pulled up posts of players of interest, i just can`t do stuff like that until monday. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2012, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/2480 "2012-05-05T02:10:50Z")
> [@LightFoot](#): > > and I have a date tonight ( \* yep it happens even at my age \*) Hot sauce! I hope you and the gal have a juicy time gettin’ flimflammed at the clip joint! If any wheat goes an’ gives ya crust, why, you just tell that jellybean that you don’t hold no truck with that. Your night will go eggs in coffee after that, I tell you what. Of course, I hope your dame’s still cute as a bug’s ear and not brodie after a spot of doss! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=123) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=125)