# \[Mafia game\] The Realm of Phere **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 1, 2012, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480 "2012-04-01T15:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/341 "2012-04-08T18:07:13Z")
(OT: Argh, I’m having problems with my wireless keyboard & mouse – haven’t recharged the spare batteries and I keep having to switch batteries from one to the other. Am I the only idiot who does this?) Anyway. I have to agree with **Mhaye** , I believe, who said those of us who heard a record scratch when **Astral** switched his votes at allegedly EOD, hadn’t backed up that suspicion with a vote. Looking back at **Gadarene** and the reason why I voted for him (the pressure he was putting on **Astral** due to the latter’s punnalicious joke), and comparing it with **Astral** ’s shenanigans… well, I’m not sure which I find scummier. At the very least they’re equally scummy in my eyes. And you know what? I know this is meta gaming and thus I suck, but I’ve yet to go broke by following **GuiriEnEspana** ’s lead. There are three hours left of this Day and I can definitely change my mind again, but right now, I _do_ find **Astral** ’s behavior scummier than **Gadarene** , regardless of whether **Gad** is top-runner or not. Like **LightFoot** , I vote for who’s scummiest (IMO anyway) rather than who’s leading the number of votes. So, a tentative: **unvote Gadarene** **vote Astral Rejection** BTW, the surprising number of votes against **Mosier** is beyond my comprehension. I don’t think **Mosier** has posted nearly enough to explain why he’s tied for third or second (sorry, if I had batteries in my mouse I’d easily scroll down to check). Can one of the **Mosier** voters account for why they find him scummiest of all so far? (Suddenly I want to write: “Mosier, Mosier on the wall, Is he scummiest of them all?”) ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/342 "2012-04-08T18:08:54Z")
NETA: BTW guys, it’s not necessary to use the Twitter/Facebook “@” here. Just referring to someone’s screenname makes it clear to whom you’re talking! ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/343 "2012-04-08T18:11:52Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > That’s a terrible reason to justify your vote. My complaint was that you were not commenting on anything that happened in the game. You’ve made a flurry of activity now, at the end of the day, but that doesn’t excuse your total radio silence in the first 2/3rds of the day. That is not pro-town behavior, and as I’ve said, I believe you were keeping your head down and letting us duke it out. > > I’m sorry I “completely ignored” your playstyle comment, but it’s immaterial to my case. I don’t remember you having _nothing at all to say_ in previous games. Then I’m afraid you need to recalibrate your memory. My being quiet in the middle of Day 1 is something that happens almost every time. I’d say that in this game my postcount has been freakishly _high_. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/344 "2012-04-08T18:20:13Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > “In the absence of any other suspicions, I will follow **guiri** who has proven the value of his intuition in the past. Hanging on the coattails of a good scumhunter isn’t wrong.” (Had I gone this way, of course, I’d be on the hot seat now, pleading for mercy. 😉 ) > [@choie](#): > > And you know what? I know this is meta gaming and thus I suck, but I’ve yet to go broke by following **GuiriEnEspana** ’s lead. Bah! ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/345 "2012-04-08T18:26:07Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Bah! Hmm, speaking of which, I’m surprised **special ed** ’s not in the game. Seriously I’m glad you posted both those quotes, because I totally missed that my _bete noire_ **septimus** is also on the **Astral** wagon. What to do, what to do, which dumbass meta instinct to follow? No. I was among the first to call out **Astral** ’s vote switch and I stand by that. Even if I didn’t trust the suddenly ovine-impersonating **Guiri** , I’d be switching to **Astral**. So “bah” all you want, but I do have justification other than your vote, I promise. ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/346 "2012-04-08T18:31:09Z")
> [@LightFoot](#): > > I have to disagree with you here. > Some mafia cultures demand you pick one of the wagons- some do not- If I don’t “ see” the case for a wagon I will not vote there. > Hell if I have to pick a wagon and that player turns out to be town I’ll get heat the rest of the game for voting a Townie off- nope not going there > I vote where I see a case. not where someone else does- all play styles are acceptable I suppose. but voting someone because there is a wagon on them is not logical - to me- although it is a great place to hide Both “vote your belief” and “vote among the lynch leaders” have been advanced as viable voting theories here. In general I tend to vote belief unless I believe that one of the vote leaders really should not be lynched because I’m convinced of their innocence (or conversely that the other really _should_ be lynched. I guess that amounts to “keep both in your toolbox and assess each situation on its merits.” > [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > @ MHaye, do you think a scummy Astral is more or less likely to confuse Day end than non-scum? I always thought your usual play style was to sit quiet during the Day and post some deeply thought out analysis in one or two posts close to deadline summarising the events of the Day with a vote, often a one off. That’s a good question. I feel it’s more _likely_ for a solo player to make that confusion. It’s not impossible for a Mafioso to make that error though. Besides, with this “communication outside game thread permitted” environment, how do we know part of the game isn’t for the Mafia to find each other? They might all be solo Today. > [@choie](#): > > So, a tentative: > > **unvote Gadarene** > **vote Astral Rejection** (Votes bleached). Goodness gracious me! A tied vote! Under certain circumstances that might be considered evidence of Mafia alignment, but there are still 2½ hours to Dusk, and that’s plenty of time for more voters to come in and break the tie. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/347 "2012-04-08T18:38:45Z")
Hey I’ve done it. 🙂 On Mosier – he’s been challenged on a couple of (admittedly minor, were this not day one) points and returned absolutely nada, those minor points being a couple of instances of admitted self-consciousness and the more serious issue of pointing to Suburban Plankton’s reasoning for justification of his weak vote on Visorslash when SP had said nothing to indicate any support whatsoever for lynching Visor. I’m significantly suspicious that he’s in over his head as newbie scum and just doesn’t know how to respond to the accusations by me, Lightfoot, and others. On Astral and his “last-minute” vote – I’m very much not in the camp of those who find such votes scummy _per se_, but it’s not helping my paranoia about him and Gadarene (because wouldn’t that be some lovely and above all CONSPICUOUS bussing, if both are scum). And I don’t think the argument that scum would know the end of day better than town would really holds much water. It’s a mistake anyone could make. On an individual basis I don’t find either Astral or Gadarene significantly scummy; taken together I’m less sure, and might vote for either one over someone I find less scummy if it comes down to that at end of day. I’m finding MHaye a bit scummy of late. I do think that Astral’s vote on him – however easy it might be if Astral is scum – had some merit. MHaye is a habitual late voter, but he usually manages to work in SOME sort of organic comments on suspects as things are happening, I think. And something about his two cases on Silver Jan and Astral just doesn’t sit right. If I have time, I’ll go over those posts in details to try to pin down out the issues specifically, but at this point it’s just instinct. My vote will be in one of those four places at the end of the day. ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/348 "2012-04-08T18:39:22Z")
> [@MHaye](#): > > Goodness gracious me! A tied vote! > > Under certain circumstances that might be considered evidence of Mafia alignment, but there are still 2½ hours to Dusk, and that’s plenty of time for more voters to come in and break the tie. Should we be expecting Astral to come in here and make a self-preservation vote to prevent “any last minute” shenanigans and to preserve the Town’s vote NOW? :dubious: This will be an interesting voting patter to analyze in the subsequent Days. I’m content to keep my vote where it is now. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/349 "2012-04-08T18:39:47Z")
I’m slow. “Hey I’ve done it” was in response to following Guiri’s lead. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/350 "2012-04-08T18:41:22Z")
Can I see a current voting tally? ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/351 "2012-04-08T18:43:06Z")
> [@MHaye](#): > > Goodness gracious me! A tied vote! > > Under certain circumstances that might be considered evidence of Mafia alignment, but there are still 2½ hours to Dusk, and that’s plenty of time for more voters to come in and break the tie. Oh crap, I didn’t even spot that. Math is apparently not my strong suit. Well, one of the tiebreakers might well be me–as I said, it’s a tentative thing; but I really _do_ find **Astral** ’s behavior scummy (perhaps the last minute vote switch and forgetting the EOD was a bluff) and I gotsta vote my conscience. BTW someone had answered one of my earlier questions re: the similarity between **Astral** ’s EOD error and one of the other two games I’ve played; the person thought I was thinking of the last-minute self-preserving behavior of, uh, someone, which turned out to save his hide. But I don’t think that was it. I definitely remember someone getting mixed up about the timing of the EOD and voting, and it wasn’t a self-preservational vote. Then the rest of us had a big hullaballoo about whether scum would be likely to forget EOD or not. (Maybe it was **Svejk** in “The Thrill of the Chase”?) ---
**Author:** ![lilflower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecccb3/32.png) [@lilflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lilflower)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/352 "2012-04-08T18:51:29Z")
I am trying to skim through the thread to catch up. I was dumb enough to take ‘too busy to play’ literally and have been working on the logistics for starting a new job this past week. \*\* vote Gadarene\*\* This is totally meta-gamey and only based on a single game (lame, I know) but since he seems to be getting other votes as well, I may not be totally off base here. The basic issue is that in the last game we played\*, he was the talkingest townie in the game and worked very hard to get town to work together. I’m not seeing any of that here and I’m wondering if it means he is scum. - I’m Metallic Squink on Giraffe Boards. ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/353 "2012-04-08T19:37:52Z")
> [@lilflower](#): > > This is totally meta-gamey and only based on a single game (lame, I know) but since he seems to be getting other votes as well, I may not be totally off base here. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/354 "2012-04-08T19:40:53Z")
Current Vote tally, maybe : Six votes. \* Gadarene : NAF1138 (91), ToeJam (120), Inner Stickler (197), Visorslash (236), BobArrgh (305), lilflower (352) Five votes. - Astral Rejection : GuiriEnEspana (57), Gadarene (83), Septimus (317), MHaye (331), choie (341) Four votes. \* Mosier : Normal Phase (65), Lightfoot (237), Suburban Plankton (308), Gnarly (313) Three votes. \* Visorslash : Silver Jan (95), Mahaloth (124), PetW (190) One vote. \* Septimus : Weedy (184) \* MHaye : Astral Rejection (186) \* Lightfoot : Scathach (329) \* Mahaloth : realitytrip (338) ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/355 "2012-04-08T19:41:17Z")
Vote count Six votes[ul][li]Gadarene : NAF (91), ToeJam (120), [del]Choie (+152, -341)[/del], Inner Stickler (197), Visorslash (236), [del]Astral Rejection (+275, -277)[/del], BobAargh (307), lilflower (352)[/ul][/li]Five votes.[ul][li]Astral Rejection : GuiriEnEspana (57), Gadarene (83), Septimus (317), Mhaye (331), Choie (341)[/ul][/li]Four votes.[ul][li]Mosier : Normal Phase (65), Lightfoot (237), Suburban Plankton (308), Gnarlycharlie (313)[/ul][/li]Three votes.[ul][li]Visorslash : [del]Weedy (+94, -184)[/del], Silver Jan (95), Mahaloth (124), [del]Septimus (+132, -317)[/del], PetW (190)[/ul][/li]One vote.[ul][li]Septimus : [del]Choie (+68, -152)[/del], Weedy 184[/li][li]MHaye : Astral Rejection ([del]+186, -275,[/del] 277)[/li][li]Lightfoot : Scathach (329)[/li][li]Mahaloth : realitytrip (338)[/ul]NB: I’ve omitted any player who has been voted and unvoted for ease of reading.[/li] My records show that there are six players who have as yet placed no votes; Drain Bead, Fubbleskag, Mosier, Red Skeezix, Storyteller and Tanaer. In addition glee has voted and unvoted without revoting. Remember, I’m fallible, so if you think I’ve misrepresented a vote - yours or someone else’s - please let me know and I’ll publish a corrected version. The above vote count is subject to correction from ATPG at any time. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/356 "2012-04-08T19:59:43Z")
OK, I’m fine with how things stand or any of the likelier changes between now and an hour from now. ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/357 "2012-04-08T20:02:54Z")
\*\*DAY ONE ENDS IN (just under) ONE HOUR. I WILL NOT BE AT MY DESK. NO VOTES OR DAY ACTIONS WILL BE ACCEPTED BEYOND THIS POINT. I will return a few hours after midnight to tally it up, post the results of the lynch, calculate the results of your day actions, and publicize the post-battle report. You may continue to speak while this is in progress, you may also send in night actions beyond this point.\*\* ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/358 "2012-04-08T20:12:24Z")
Neither Mosier nor Gadarene has posted in the last 48 hours: Mosier’s was [#131](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14940708&postcount=131) while Gadarene’s was [#156](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14941166&postcount=156). Visorslash made his self defense vote over 24 hours ago in [#236](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14942803&postcount=236). ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/359 "2012-04-08T20:15:18Z")
> [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > \*\*DAY ONE ENDS IN (just under) ONE HOUR. > > I WILL NOT BE AT MY DESK. NO VOTES OR DAY ACTIONS WILL BE ACCEPTED BEYOND THIS POINT\*\* Erm… to clarify, you mean no votes will be accepted beyond the point of EOD, right? Not beyond the point where you just posted? ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2012, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/360 "2012-04-08T20:15:35Z")
EOD. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=19)