# \[Mafia game\] The Realm of Phere **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 1, 2012, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480 "2012-04-01T15:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/461 "2012-04-09T17:53:04Z")
Also, I’ve shared information about my role with Normal without asking for anything in return, because she is a decently strong Town lean of mine as things stand. If anyone else would like to _exchange_ limited role information with me via PM, either PM me or let me know in-thread, and I’m sure we can figure something out. (I’m not sure how this is going to go, but I’ve thought it through a little bit and don’t think it’s an anti-town play.) ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/462 "2012-04-09T17:54:14Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Choie, you’ve twice now outed yourself as not “vanilla” town, this quoted section being the most recent. > > In the interest of preventing further outings (and because scum have likely already noticed), I’ve decided to speak up. “Vanilla” town soldiers can attack or defend as their day action. An attack (in my case) does 25 HP. A defend cuts that in half and redirects that damage to the defender. I don’t know if other soldiers can do more or less damage. Mages, I would guess, do the higher amount of damage we’ve seen. > > Why out you? Scum likely have cover roles, and one of them is likely to be a “vanilla” town role. I’m guessing they know (or have figured out) what’s going on, and therefore I deemed it beneficial to get town on the same footing. > > I also think this helps townies who might not have been in the know a better shot at interpreting the dusk reveals. > > A couple of caveats: scum might also have “vanilla” roles that duplicate a town soldier or Mage, in that they can attack or defend. Choie might be scum if I was wrong about them having a vanilla cover role. So take that into consideration when assessing what happened at Dusk. How do you figure \*\*choie \*\*outed herself in her most recent post? All she did there was look at the damage received by the various players, and note that 8 attacks did 50+ damage, and one attack did only 13. Anyone with a basic understanding of math can see the discrepancy…so how does this imply anything about choie (other than her mad math skillz)? Also, what was the other time that choie outed herself as “non-Vanilla”? I must have missed it. I will note here that \*\*Pizza \*\*did say at some point that even “Vanilla” Town have some sort of actions in this game, so in one sense at least there’s no such thing as “Vanilla”. Not sure if it really makes a difference, but it should probably be kept in mind. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/463 "2012-04-09T17:58:43Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > How do you figure \*\*choie \*\*outed herself in her most recent post? All she did there was look at the damage received by the various players, and note that 8 attacks did 50+ damage, and one attack did only 13. Anyone with a basic understanding of math can see the discrepancy…so how does this imply anything about choie (other than her mad math skillz)? People with vanilla town PMs know what’s going on. I suppose Choie might be a Mage, but her total confusion seems to belie that. > [@](#): > > Also, what was the other time that choie outed herself as “non-Vanilla”? I must have missed it. I’ll find it and post it as a follow-up post. This is hard on my phone! 😃 > [@](#): > > I will note here that \*\*Pizza \*\*did say at some point that even “Vanilla” Town have some sort of actions in this game Yep. I just told you what they were. We have at least 9 of them, some of which may be scum. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/464 "2012-04-09T18:01:03Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > I have the benefit of knowing that the extra votes on Mosier were not done by scum to save fellow scum Gadarene. 🙂 From that standpoint, I’m inclined to believe that the extra votes were: > > (a) intended as noise and/or misdirection by scum (although I can’t imagine that the power can be used that many times, and why set things up to lynch me today if they could have just lynched me yesterday without using the power?); > > (b) intended to save Astral by scum (I don’t really buy it – they would have had no reason to think he was in danger, unless the action for the extra votes had to be submitted X hours before end of day, at the point where Astral could easily have been the lynch – but in that case, why not just put them on me?) > > (c) intended to save me by a Townie who (correctly) believed that I was not scum (if this is the case, I’m very grateful) > > (d) some random mechanism instituted by Pizza (seems very unlikely) > > (e) something I haven’t thought of > > So I know what it _wasn’t_, but figuring out what it _was_ is a harder task. Right now I’m leaning towards the votes being placed by a townie to save me because they thought I was townie (or they thought my wagon was very sketchy, which amounts to the same thing). At this point I’m leaning ever so slightly towards (e), with the great big caveat that I haven’t got a clue what’s going on at this point.. You really think it was done in an effort to save you specifically? I find that highly unlikely, unless someone has some specific information about you that has not been made public? Why would any Townie decide to unilaterally put a random person on the block (which we would have to assume this was, since \*\*Mosier \*\*was a Good Soldier) in order to save another random person (you), on Day 1? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/465 "2012-04-09T18:01:12Z")
I’m uncomfortable with this speculation about whether people are vanilla or not vanilla, and I’m uncomfortable with Astral disclosing that he is vanilla. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/466 "2012-04-09T18:06:52Z")
Here you go. > [@choie](#): > > Are the lost hit points definitely related to the “I’ll protect you!” cries? I was gonna let that one go, since it was fairly innocuous, but it still says “I’m not a vanilla!” to anyone who knows otherwise. I didn’t want anyone else compromising themselves to address Choie. I’m no great loss, because scum probably already knew I didn’t have a great role, since I didn’t claim anything when it got down to the wire and I might have been lynched ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/467 "2012-04-09T18:07:56Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > You really think it was done in an effort to save you specifically? I find that highly unlikely, unless someone has some specific information about you that has not been made public? Why would any Townie decide to unilaterally put a random person on the block (which we would have to assume this was, since \*\*Mosier \*\*was a Good Soldier) in order to save another random person (you), on Day 1? If someone either (a) thought my wagon was likely to be scum-driven; (b) thought I was more likely to be Townie than Mosier was; or (c) flat-out thought that I personally was not a good choice for a d1 lynch based on the reasons provided, then I could see them doing it in order to save me specifically. For (completely hypothetical) example, if Weedy is Town and didn’t think the case on me was that great, I could see her doing that specifically to save me because we’ve played a TON together and she knows that I’m very experienced and can be a net asset to Town if I live beyond day one (and maybe she thinks that my scum game is pretty transparent and she’ll be able to figure out if I’m scum and build a case on me on a later day once I’ve posted more). Not to compare myself to Guiri, but if Guiri was being wagoned on d1 for fairly flimsy reasons and I had a chance to save him over a random, less experienced player, I probably would. As town, I don’t like killing strong players on day one (or letting them die) if I can help it. Beyond that, I have no idea, except that I know those three Mosier votes were cast and I know I’m not scum, so I’m trying to figure out what other explanations best fit the facts as I’m aware of them. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/468 "2012-04-09T18:08:52Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > I’m uncomfortable with this speculation about whether people are vanilla or not vanilla, and I’m uncomfortable with Astral disclosing that he is vanilla. I claimed specifically to forestall anybody else accidentally revealing themselves. I’d be happy if the conversation ends here. I just wanted to make sure town has the same information scum likely has. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/469 "2012-04-09T18:12:20Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > I claimed specifically to forestall anybody else accidentally revealing themselves. I’d be happy if the conversation ends here. I just wanted to make sure town has the same information scum likely has. Fair enough. I’m obviously not vanilla, and the scum would do well to kill me sooner rather than later. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/470 "2012-04-09T18:17:08Z")
A couple notes from the recap of the Day’s fighting… > [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > A few brave souls decided to attack. One of their weapons makes contact. > > **Lord Phere takes 80hp damage.** \* > > The great **Demon Lord** barely flinches. The blow doesn’t even faze the massive beast, but another plucky Adventurer approaches, and takes another swing. > > \ ***Lord Phere takes 80hp damage.** We can assume that one of these attacks was by **Visorslash** (see Post 75), correct? And the other is by an unknown assailant? > [@](#): > > “I’ll protect you, **Visorslash**!” \*shouts Inner Stickler. \*“Woah! What the hell is that?” \*he says, diving out of the path of danger. A \*\*magical orb \*\*hits Visorslash directly in the chest. > > \ ***Visorslash takes 100hp damage.** Here it appears that \*\*Inner \*\*starts to protect Visorslash, but either changes his mind, fails, or is somehow prevented. the color makes it seem that he changed his mind, but I don’t know how much we should read into color. Certainly it is significant, based on other games Pizza had modded, but I don’t know how detailed we can expect it to be here. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/471 "2012-04-09T18:25:55Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Here you go. > > > [@choie](#): > > > > Are the lost hit points definitely related to the “I’ll protect you!” cries? > > I was gonna let that one go, since it was fairly innocuous, but it still says “I’m not a vanilla!” to anyone who knows otherwise. I didn’t want anyone else compromising themselves to address Choie. I’m no great loss, because scum probably already knew I didn’t have a great role, since I didn’t claim anything when it got down to the wire and I might have been lynched OK. If you say so. I guess I’m just not as observant as some people. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/472 "2012-04-09T18:29:51Z")
“Magical damage and physical damage are different- some forms of protection can stop one kind of damage, but not the other.” Inner’s protection probably had no effect on the “magical” orb. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/473 "2012-04-09T18:34:21Z")
We haven’t heard from Inner yet, right? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/474 "2012-04-09T18:35:21Z")
Guiri, what are your thoughts on the damage you sustained? ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/475 "2012-04-09T18:40:35Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > Guiri, what are your thoughts on the damage you sustained? Ouch! ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/476 "2012-04-09T18:44:27Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Yep. I just told you what they were. We have at least 9 of them, some of which may be scum. Without giving more info from the vanilla role pm in your possession, why do you say there are at least 9 of them? Because there were 9 attacks? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/477 "2012-04-09T18:46:49Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Ouch! Guiri, what are your thoughts on my speculation regarding the damage you sustained? ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/478 "2012-04-09T18:53:10Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Without giving more info from the vanilla role pm in your possession, why do you say there are at least 9 of them? Because there were 9 attacks? That’s my guess. Some may well be something else, but I’m also willing to bet some of our vanillas forgot to submit an action. 9 seems like a good starting place, though. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/479 "2012-04-09T18:54:10Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Ouch! That made me laugh quietly to myself. Got a questioning look from a coworker for it, too! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/480 "2012-04-09T19:11:28Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > Guiri, what are your thoughts on my speculation regarding the damage you sustained? I think you’ve posited: 1. I was attacked by either scum or third party OR 2. I was hurt protecting Inner OR 3. I was attacked by a townie who is unfamiliar with me For the sake of completeness, add in: 4. I was hurt attacking someone 5. I was hurt protecting someone else 6 I was bitch slapped One of these is almost certainly true. 2 and 5 would indicate I was busy protecting yesterDay. 4 would indicate I was busy attacking. 1 would seem to be a test of my protection, why else bother with a non-fatal attack if they wan me dead? 3 would be unfortunate. For 4, I was accused of being smug and over-confident, so possibly it was intended as a bitch slap. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=25)