# \[Mafia game\] The Realm of Phere **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 1, 2012, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480 "2012-04-01T15:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 52
**Author:** ![LightFoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LightFoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LightFoot)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1021 "2012-04-13T03:13:10Z")
I have some spread sheet like calc on the item votes if anyone is interested ( keeping track for my own info) . don’t want to muck up the thread with information if I’m to be called out for it though. [spoiler] emerald ring Visorslash by fubbleskag Suburban by self LightFoot by self choi by septimus ToeJam by self choie by self pendant BobArrgh by self Suburban by self LightFoot by self gnarlie charlie by septimus gnarlie charlie by self BobArrgh by ToeJam sapphire ring fubbleskag by Visorslash fubbleskag by Astral Suburban by self LightFoot by self LightFoot by septimus BobArrgh by ToeJam Visorslash voted self “all items” probably not a valid PetW voted self for “Ring” probably not a valid ``` [/spoiler] ``` Couldn’t get it to format the way I wanted ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1022 "2012-04-13T03:23:40Z")
> [@LightFoot](#): > > My take is there is a triple voting player (or team). The mod posts such as instructed / or as he sees fit- - monkey wrench anyone? Oh I knew that, heh, sorry if I was unclear. I just wondered why there’s so much apparent energy spent on **Guiri**. > [@Red\_Skeezix](#): > > This is the second time in recent memory that you are bringing up previous games behavior and then immediately discount it. It’s bugging me. If I had two votes, I’d vote PetW and Weedy, but if I had 3 I’d vote for you too. I don’t get it. Am I bugging you for bringing up the behavior, or bugging you for discounting it? What am I supposed to do, claim that I know everything about [g]Guiri\*\*'s posting style after playing with him a grand total of one time before this? As far as bringing up the behavior… well, if someone constantly behaves in a certain way throughout a variety of games, a pattern can be deduced. If said person deviates from said pattern, there may (but not always) be some value in figuring out why. If there’s no value in this sort of deduction, fine. I’m just taking my cue from others, who are more experienced in these things. Jesus. I wouldn’t eat those Cheerios if I were you, son. Someone’s clearly pissed in 'em. ---
**Author:** ![BobArrgh](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobarrgh/32/2881_2.png) [@BobArrgh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobArrgh)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1023 "2012-04-13T03:29:25Z")
**Lightfoot** , I unvoted the pendant in #876. ---
**Author:** ![gnarlycharlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@gnarlycharlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnarlycharlie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1024 "2012-04-13T03:31:45Z")
> [@PetW](#): > > I didn’t think of that, I just assumed it was scum because during the night 2 townies were killed. I did think it was odd that one was by a “frenzied attacker”, maybe that is a vig. > This is my second game of mafia by the way, so I’m not well versed in the different standard roles, although I did read about vigilantes when I was preparing for my first game. okay, your post feels honest. **Unvote PetW** > [@choie](#): > > **vote emerald ring to choie** > > Only because it was my mom’s birthstone. Honestly the jewels don’t interest me without knowing what they’re for, and since the elemental stuff is so far over my head it might as well be Alpha Centauri, I’m ignoring it for now. > > What _does_ interest me is how many lurkers, or near-lurkers, we have. Here’s a list (as of this posting) of those with under ten posts (in a game with nearly 1000, that’s awfully significant). This doesn’t necessarily indicate guilt, of course, since they could just be shy or intimidated. Or busy in real life. But they could also be trying to fly under the radar: > > **Scathach** 9 - this one surprises me, because I remember **Scathach** as being more chatty in our last game. > > **realitytrip** 7 - newcomer, so silence is understandable. > > **Tanaer** 3 - three posts in the whole game?! That’s not just newbieness, that’s positively social phobia. Or guilt. > > **Bumbershoot** 2 - more understandable since he’s a substitute IIRC (for **Drain Bead** ). Still, get in and get chatting, sir (or ma’am)! > > **lilflower** 2 - though she’s new to the SDMB, she’s not new to Mafia games, as she mentioned she’s got a different screenname on the forum where she usually plays. So why only 2 posts? > > **Mahaloth** 2 - of all the silent players, this one strikes me as the oddest. He knows his way around and isn’t shy about talking. As with everyone, it could just be real life encroaching on his time, but otherwise… what the hell, dude? Are we so boring to you that you can’t join in and mix things up a little? > > **storyteller0910** 1 - I don’t know **storyteller0910** \* enough to know whether this is typical behavior. Anyone who’s played with him/her before, is this typical? > > - What, were there really 909 other **storyteller** s on the SDMB that s/he had to add the numbers at the end? Some part of me always wants to vote for anyone with screennames that are hard to type! > > **Red Skeezix** 1 - Unlike others I don’t remember **Skeezix** being a silent lurker type, but I think I’ve only played with him once, when he was Scum, and he was in the curious position of bussing Godfather ( **septimus** at the time). Then, IIRC, he was under constant attack and made an error in posting that kinda gave away his evilitude. Maybe that’s why he’s silent now… doesn’t want to screw up again. Or, as stated, real life got in the way. > > I’m _not_ saying “lynch the lurkers” – I’m just saying that y’all should speak up and participate, because a) it gives us more to work with, and more info is always better, and b) it’s more fun for you to join in, even if you’re briefly accused ( **Gadarene** ’s slow decline into hysterical madness notwithstanding). 😃 as explained by others, **story** is stuck in the middle of nowhere (actually NC) with only his mobile to get online. **mahaloth** is on a trip to another continent. it’s a very personal thing but not in a bad way. the rest… _shrugs_ > [@Gadarene](#): > > I think gnarly looks fairly scummy so far. His posts have been almost entirely lacking in substance, he seems to be coasting along, and I haven’t seen anything from him that indicates that he’s trying to figure out how to solve the game. up to now you still have a grasp on my playstyle? mostly gut and metagame. i’m a very slow starter. i’ve said that a number of times now in several games now, two of which you were in and i was town. > [@Silver\_Jan](#): > > Oh dear, I thought that in this game\*\* gnarley \*\*looked more Townie just because he was talking more. He doesn’t post much usually but when he is scum he posts even less and in this game he is posting a lot more. Yeah, I know it’s all meta gamey. i’m talking a little more than usual mainly because people keep bitching (they keep killing me only to be embarrassed about it when i flip town) and i have more time now that classes have ended. > [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > \*\*Vote: GuiriEnEspana > \*\*\*\*Vote: GuiriEnEspana > \*\ ***Vote: GuiriEnEspana** wasting votes? obviously the timing in D1 was much better. ---
**Author:** ![PetW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@PetW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PetW)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1025 "2012-04-13T03:45:20Z")
I wouldn’t count on those votes being final. Most likely they’ll be used to push a Townie to a lynch at the last minute, again. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1026 "2012-04-13T03:49:33Z")
Leaning town: Normal Phase choie The person I’ve been communicating with who as far as I know would still prefer not to be outed Weedy (but I have my eye on you) Leaning scum: gnarlycharlie PetW Leaning different-win-condition-than-Townies: fubbleskag I could probably firm up some more reads if I thought further about it, which I’ll do tonight and report back. ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1027 "2012-04-13T03:49:51Z")
\*\*[COLOR=Red]unvote GuriEnEspana unvote GuriEnEspana unvote GuriEnEspana Vote Astral Rejection Vote Astral Rejection Vote Astral Rejection\*\*[/COLOR] \*\*\* “Fear not, weaklings, for I will cure you all of this Astral Infection.”\*\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Visorslash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ee59a6/32.png) [@Visorslash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Visorslash)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1028 "2012-04-13T03:51:57Z")
> [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > \*\*[COLOR=Red]unvote GuriEnEspana > unvote GuriEnEspana > unvote GuriEnEspana > > Vote Astral Rejection > Vote Astral Rejection > Vote Astral Rejection\*\*[/COLOR] > > \*\*\* “Fear not, weaklings, for I will cure you all of this Astral Infection.”\*\*\* I raise you by one I don’t give a fuck. Gad, calm the hell down. Just because you are scum and we want you dead, doesn’t mean you have to blow up at us. ---
**Author:** ![PetW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@PetW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PetW)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1029 "2012-04-13T03:52:50Z")
> [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > \*\*[COLOR=Red]unvote GuriEnEspana > unvote GuriEnEspana > unvote GuriEnEspana > > Vote Astral Rejection > Vote Astral Rejection > Vote Astral Rejection\*\*[/COLOR] > > \*\*\* “Fear not, weaklings, for I will cure you all of this Astral Infection.”\*\*\* Can you take care of my “wee-wee disease”, while you’re at it? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1030 "2012-04-13T03:59:21Z")
Careful, PetW – Pizza usually cures that particular infection by amputation of the head. Now the demon’s just playing with us. Bad demon. ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1031 "2012-04-13T04:00:04Z")
> [@PetW](#): > > Can you take care of my “wee-wee disease”, while you’re at it? 😃 \*\*\*“So far I’ve threatened to neuter two of you, and now a third is volunteering for it. I think exterminating your species would be doing this dimension a favor.” * * * -IC- ---
**Author:** ![gnarlycharlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@gnarlycharlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnarlycharlie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1032 "2012-04-13T05:59:12Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > Leaning town: > Normal Phase > choie > The person I’ve been communicating with who as far as I know would still prefer not to be outed > Weedy (but I have my eye on you) > > Leaning scum: > gnarlycharlie > PetW > > Leaning different-win-condition-than-Townies: > fubbleskag > > I could probably firm up some more reads if I thought further about it, which I’ll do tonight and report back. i see you didn’t even bother to comment on my reply to your earlier post. oh well. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1033 "2012-04-13T06:10:36Z")
**Astral Rejection hits you with a wall of words! It’s super effective!** A couple of things I want to talk about. This is the abridged version of my enormous post, because as it gets later, I’m finding it harder to keep my thoughts organized. I’ve got until monday, so I don’t feel too bad putting off some of what I want to talk about. First off, some bookkeping, and facts I found interesting. I’ll use spoilers to try to keep the length down. **First votes only.** This tracks the first vote of all voters. All un-numbered votes are prior to post 132 – I realized too late that it might be useful info, and it’s late now and I don’t feel like going back. For my purposes, “pre-132” is good enough for me. Astral Rejection: GuiriEnEspana, Gadarene Mosier: Normal Phase, Lightfoot, Suburban Plankton (308) Septimus: Choie Normal Phase: Visorslash Choie: Astral Rejection Gadarene: NAF1138, ToeJam, Mahaloth, Inner Stickler (197), BobArrgh (307), lilflower (352) Visorslash: Weedy, Silver Jan, Mosier, Septimus (132), PetW (190) NAF1138: glee Silver Jan: gnarlycharlie (176), MHaye (321) Lightfoot: Scathach (329) Mahaloth: realitytrip (338) **Final Vote count from Pizza.** [spoiler]\*\* Mosier (8): Lightfoot, Suburban Plankton, gnarlycharlie, Normal Phase, Askthepizzaguy, Askthepizzaguy, Askthepizzaguy\*\* \*\*Gadarene (7): NAF1138, ToeJam, Inner Stickler, Visorslash, BobArrgh, lilflower \*\* \*\*Astral Rejection (5): Guiri, Gadarene, septimus, MHaye, choie * * * Visorslash (3): Silver Jan, Mosier\*\*\*, Mahaloth, PetW\*\* \*\* Lightfoot (1): Scathach\*\* \*\* Mahaloth (1): realitytrip\*\* \*\* Septimus (1): Weedy\*\* \*\* MHaye (1): Astral Rejection\*\* \*\* Abstain/Unvote/Present (1): Glee, \*\* 　 \*\*\*- Vote not bolded, therefore not legal[/spoiler] **People whose first vote was also their final vote.** Final is used here to mean their vote was on their original target at Dusk. In a few cases, voters may have had a different intervening vote, but ultimately settled back on their first target. Guiri (for Astral Rejection) Gadarene (for Astral Rejection) Lightfoot (for Mosier) Suburban Plankton (for Mosier) Normal Phase (for Mosier) NAF1138 (for Gadarene) ToeJam (for Gadarene) Inner Stickler (for Gadarene) BobArrgh (for Gadarene) Lilflower (for Gadarene) Scathach (for Lightfoot) realitytrip (for Mahaloth) Silver Jan (for Visorslash) Mosier (didn’t technically count, for Visorslash) Something I really like to do, and I find it helps me organize my thoughts, is look at the vote data in new ways. Before I collected all the data, I assumed only a few people would maintain their vote the entire day; I expected a more fluid voting scheme. Instead, we had 14 voters who maintained their original vote. I need to break this down a little further. Day 1 ended after post 368, so any votes before post 184 would be in the first half of the day (more correctly, the first half of the conversation, since posts don’t directly correspond to time. For my purposes, let’s call that half). So, that being said, let’s look at: **People who kept their votes from the first half of the Day until the end of Day.** GuiriEnEspana Gadarene Normal Phase Lightfoot NAF1138 ToeJam Silver Jan Mosier Get ready for a weird sentence: I believe that final list has a higher-than-average chance of containing a higher-than-average proportion of scum. There are 8 names on that list (7, really, since we should discount Mosier), and the 1/4th rule would suggest it contains 2 scum. I’m guessing there are 3 (or more?) on that list. My reasoning: voting is hard for scum. Building cases, staying out of the spotlight, keeping off the radar, all while staying involved in the game, is a challenging tightrope scum have to walk. Some will choose to lurk, but I’ve never seen an entire team lurk. Early votes, especially on Day 1, are easily dismissable. As the conversation continues, newer, better cases will organically emerge from the talk. Town will typically shift their voting as their opinions change; scum, their “participation” assured with a vote, generally don’t want to put themselves back into danger by moving, and having to justify, another vote. Of course, there are flaws in this theory. We have an exceptionally large group of lurkers in this game, and with so few posts, it’s almost impossible to assess their scumminess. Any number of them could potentially be scum, skewing the rest of the group (and these figures). Another interesting quirk of the voting pattern becomes obvious when we view these early, potentially scummy votes: possible partners. All of our early voters voted in pairs. Guiri & Gad voted for Astral Normal Phase & Lightfoot for Mosier NAF & ToeJam for Gadarene Silver Jan & Mosier for Visorslash Mosier, again, is innocent, so I’d recommend discounting that pair. Guiri & Gad were perhaps too obviously in lockstep (Gad’s first reason for voting for Astral: “I agree with Guiri.”), so I personally am going to discard that one, too, on the basis of “I doubt scum would so obviously collude on Day 1.” Your mileage may vary. We don’t currently have enough information to assess the other two pairings, but it’s something we should definitely revisit when one of the pair dies and we learn their alignment. However, there is another way to interpret all of this data. We have three deaths, all of which appear to be town (I noticed on a quick readthrough that there was some confusion about the “good” reveal, but I’m assuming it means town for now). We know from these reveals that all of glee’s, mosier’s, and inner stickler’s suspicions were honestly felt, and we have to decide on a case-by-case basis how we feel about all of the questions, smudges, and votes they accrued while they were alive. Helpfully, I’ve made a list: **People what mentioned and voted for, and got voted by, the town what are dead.** [spoiler]Inner, 86: doesn’t see what Guiri and Gad are getting at re: voting for astral Lightfoot, post 119: if Mosier makes a case on Visor, lightfoot will “look less sharply towards you.” Mosier voted for Visorslash Suburban, post 133: accuses Mosier of snuggling Inner, post 135: doesn’t get any of the votes for Visor Normal, post 141: has some suspicions of Mosier Inner Stickler, post 197: suspects Astral and Gad, votes Gad Inner Stickler, post 279: further suspicions of Astral for the “vote-shenanigans-prevention-action” (My term for it) Suburban Plankton, post 308: votes Mosier for snuggling. Also posits potential scumminess of glee. gnarlycharlie, post 311: looking at mosier, pinged him earlier. gnarlycharlie, post 313: votes for Mosier, but found Septimus scummier. Mosier has a “slightly better chanbce of being lynched.” Suburban Plankton, post 314: questions glee Normal Phase, post 323: “glee, you are not contributing either” Normal Phase, post 347: on mosier, calls out for self-consciousness, not addressing arguments, weak vote for visor, maybe in over his head GuiriEnEspana protected Inner Stickler (Dusk 1) [/spoiler] Odds are great I’ve missed some stuff, but this is a start. Clearly, some names keep popping up. This is the part of my analysis that is going to have to wait for later, because I need to re-read everything yet again to see how much weight I’d give each bit, to cross-reference against my vote charts, and to do a check to see what I’ve missed. * * * Enough voting stuff. While I was re-reading, a couple of posts jumped out at me. > [@realitytrip](#): > > Greetings, fellow adventurers! I see the talk is already flowing fast and furious. I am used to playing werewolf in person, its going to take me a little while to catch on to the customs here, I hope you will bear with me. > > The first day is pretty much my least favorite part of the game. No one has any past behavior to go on (outside of meta-gaming, of course) and so anything out of the ordinary comes up to great scrutiny. I find the quick judgment to vote a bit disturbing…two or three lines and you are on the chopping block? > > For my part, I don’t feel ready to vote for anyone just yet. The day is young. Hard game is hard, right? I’ve never liked posts like this, because it’s fluff disguised as pro-town helpful banter. We all know that no one has any past behavior to go on. We know it’s tough. And the part about finding “the quick judgment to vote a bit disturbing” is ludicrous. Somebody has to be the first vote, and for some reason. If you have an issue with the Astral Rejection votes, or the Visorslash votes, or what have you, lay them out. The irony of this isn’t lost on me; GuiriEnEspana called me out for my first post, saying it felt too self-conscious, and now I’m saying pretty much the same thing about realitytrip. I think it’s fundamentally different, though… my post was early on, and it was meant as a joke (YMMV). This is right in the middle of several large discussions, with nothing but a smudge on all of the voters so far. > [@lilflower](#): > > I am trying to skim through the thread to catch up. I was dumb enough to take ‘too busy to play’ literally and have been working on the logistics for starting a new job this past week. > > vote Gadarene > > This is totally meta-gamey and only based on a single game (lame, I know) but since he seems to be getting other votes as well, I may not be totally off base here. The basic issue is that in the last game we played\*, he was the talkingest townie in the game and worked very hard to get town to work together. I’m not seeing any of that here and I’m wondering if it means he is scum. > > - I’m Metallic Squink on Giraffe Boards. It’s a late vote for nebulous reasons. There have been any number of explanations given on why Gadarene was suspicious to people. Regardless of the quality of those reasons, I feel like lilflower (if she was making an honest vote) would have mentioned some of those reasons. This is also the very last vote of the Day, finally pushing Gadarene into a clear lynch leader (Choie had tied Astral Rejection and Gadarene earlier). This part honestly doesn’t look that great for me; if Gadarene and I are both town, scum lilflower has no reason to pick one over the other. If I’m scum, scum lilflower’s motive is more clear. However, the vote itself wasn’t necessary; I believe Gadarene would have been lynched regardless. Why pick Gadarene over me if lilflower is scum? It makes no sense if Gad is town, but if Gad and lilflower are both scum, and Gad is already the lynch target, lilflower could be hoping for town credit for “sealing the deal.” I think my writing is starting to get unclear, so I hope that made sense. I need to sleep on it and re-read their posts to decide which option I think is more likely. The vote itself doesn’t sit right with me, though, so I wanted to make sure to point that out. Let’s end on a joke. > [@NAF1138](#): > > Is Astral Rejection the poster formerly known as Pedescribe or does he just share a philosophical outlook on mafia playing with Pede? > > (I can’t believe I don’t know the answer to this question) I can’t believe I missed this before. NAF! We’ve played together before, man! I had no idea I was so forgettable! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Weedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/weedy/32/301_2.png) [@Weedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weedy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1034 "2012-04-13T07:36:14Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Good thing nobody’s talking about giving me one, then! OK, I think I misunderstood what you, fubbleskag and Visor are doing. > [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > I would like to see about ten more votes on the table by evening, for one thing. Please townies – don’t leave the scum with only one thing to worry about, or no things to worry about. Make them react (or hide – and certainly by tomorrow at the latest a great deal of town killing and lynching effort should be going towards those who hide) and make them fear you. > > I find it hard to care too much about possession of a bunch of objects whose uses I have no idea of, especially not when I already have one thing I don’t know how to use. I’d like all three to go to different people, that’s my only real preference there. If one goes to me that’s cool, if not, that’s cool too. Somebody who’s talking about me as town vote me something; I’ll pile on. > > I do care about information, so if people trust me to be town that’s how I’d like to see it shown. Normal sounding Townie as all get out to me. > [@septimus](#): > > \*\*Vote: Emerald Ring to choie > Vote: Blue Pendant to gnarlycharlie > Vote: Sapphire Ring to LightFoot > > Vote: Present\*\* Happy with choie, haven’t thought about Lightfoot much, have some concern about gnarlycharlie. How bout Normal Phase instead? **vote: emerald ring to choie vote: blue pendant to Normal Phase** > [@gnarlycharlie](#): > > assuming the three kills were by scum because the Demon Lord killed them all or PIS slip? let’s put more pressure. > > **Vote: PetW** Hate this. Vote on a wagon for a really thin reason. I don’t like the PIS accusation, it seems like an excuse. If this is PetW’s second game, then I bet he is Town here. > [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > As things stand, of that list I would be happy to see pot shots taken at (or more organized vig attempts used on) Tanaer, lilflower or Skeezix. They really all need to show up to do more than just place a vote and leave, too; that’ll look like they’re just trying to avoid mod-kill. I know that Tanaer is flat out IRL right now. Also, I want a chnce to try to read her 😛 > [@ToeJam](#): > > Ah, thanks- I had moved on to my coloring the other votes didn’t check to see if the color came out right. > \*\* > Vote Septimus. \*\* > > Thanks. > > And Yes, **Septimus** - how is it beneficial for us (if you’re town) to know who you find less Scummy? Your voting record should show who you find most scummy, and everyone else should be LESS scummy. > Unless you’re actively trying to defend them, there’s no need to cuddle random other players- unless you’ve got a reason to want to get on their good side. Hence the paranoia. I think finding other Townies is important in this gme so that Town can work together to distribute items, and coordinate attacks. > [@Red\_Skeezix](#): > > Also, the amount of times I’ve been scum in previous games has no bearing on whether or not I’m scum now. By your own admission, you have never played with me as town (no idea if this is true or not), so you lack a reference point. Why go down that road? > > **unvote: Petw** > **vote: Weedy** Normal had a read and it matches my limited experience. If we are going to be vigging lurkers, it makes sense to vig the player who is known to lurk as Scum, rather than someone who lacks internet access this week. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1035 "2012-04-13T07:55:11Z")
**unvote, vote Astral Rejection** I’m almost positive. All of that “analysis” and you didn’t even mention MHaye? The guy you currently have a vote on? The best you can come up with is: lilflower: Easy, easy easy target, even if she does ever turn up scum. realitytrip: Same “crime” as you got picked up on, which is fine, but you spend more time explaining why you’re not being hypocritical than you do why he is scummy. This is the same issue as with MHaye – what exactly is your audience here and what are you trying to convince them of? That realitytrip is scummy? Or that you’re being reasonable? Nothing – not one word – about MHaye, the guy you voted for yesterday while the bandwagon was getting rolling on you, and who you were quick to vote for today on the strength of your previous vote but MY case, to which you have added not so much as a sentence … Your theory about single votes – which I think IS broadly valid, by the way, but on day one the least so of any day, and at any rate: I bet you’ll find scum in this bunch of eight people, but I’m only going to rule a few out and no one in …? And you half-qualify even the conclusions you do draw to the point of uselessness. The thing about dead townies and the same names coming up over and over – you mean Gadarene and Mosier, those names? The guys who EVERYONE was discussing on day one? What on earth could you possibly even be aiming at with this, Astral, unless it’s some backhanded smudge of Gadarene? There’s no reason for it otherwise. This is not scum-hunting, Astral. You’re better than this. At this point I think you and MHaye are both scum, and you bussed him on day one thinking you might as well because you could be on the way out anyway. I may as well add at this point that PetW’s responses since my vote have me substantially less suspicious of him than I was at the time I placed it. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1036 "2012-04-13T07:55:15Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > I’ve got until monday, so I don’t feel too bad putting off some of what I want to talk about. Monday? You sure about that? I thought Day ended on Sunday. 🙂 > [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Get ready for a weird sentence: I believe that final list has a higher-than-average chance of containing a higher-than-average proportion of scum. There are 8 names on that list (7, really, since we should discount Mosier), and the 1/4th rule would suggest it contains 2 scum. I’m guessing there are 3 (or more?) on that list. The shorter than usual Day, coupled with the holiday weekend dusk, and the fact that all those early votes were on the main lynch contenders right up to Day end, would explain some of lack of movement in votes. A nitpick your choice of cut-off point, given that D1 only started in #53, half way through Day 1 would be #210, which also corresponds to the 36 hour mark. It doesn’t change much but it would include PetW’s vote on Visorslash and InnerStickler’s on Gadarene as two additional early voters who never moved their vote. You also missed Mahaloth’s early vote on Visorslash which never moved. But your analysis reminded me I want to review ToeJam. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1037 "2012-04-13T08:09:18Z")
I mean just look at this. > [@Astral Rejection](#): > > However, there is another way to interpret all of this data. We have three deaths, all of which appear to be town (I noticed on a quick readthrough that there was some confusion about the “good” reveal, but I’m assuming it means town for now). We know from these reveals that all of glee’s, mosier’s, and inner stickler’s suspicions were honestly felt, and we have to decide on a case-by-case basis how we feel about all of the questions, smudges, and votes they accrued while they were alive. Helpfully, I’ve made a list: > > People what mentioned and voted for, and got voted by, the town what are dead. > > (snip lots and lots of mentions of Gadarene and Mosier, the latter being one of the “town what are dead”) > > Odds are great I’ve missed some stuff, but this is a start. Clearly, some names keep popping up. This is the part of my analysis that is going to have to wait for later, because I need to re-read everything yet again to see how much weight I’d give each bit, to cross-reference against my vote charts, and to do a check to see what I’ve missed. And he can’t even bring himself to actually SAY – all these dead guys kept talking about Gadarene, so Gadarene should be a suspect. And yet this is not something needs to be cross-referenced and deeply analyzed, if you actually believe what you’re saying. It’s right there. This cannot be for real. And this? > [@](#): > > This part honestly doesn’t look that great for me; if Gadarene and I are both town, scum lilflower has no reason to pick one over the other. If I’m scum, scum lilflower’s motive is more clear. However, the vote itself wasn’t necessary; I believe Gadarene would have been lynched regardless. Why pick Gadarene over me if lilflower is scum? It makes no sense if Gad is town, but if Gad and lilflower are both scum, and Gad is already the lynch target, lilflower could be hoping for town credit for “sealing the deal.” This is so … something I can’t even name. You know, Astral, lilflower _could_ have chosen Gadarene over you, if scum, just because it was an easy bandwagon to chuck a vote on and hey, one townie’s as good as another. But you can’t leave it at that. You have to worry at the logic that says a scum lilflower could have been trying to save you, like you’re picking at a scab. I just don’t see a townie Astral being all that concerned about it. Certainly not to the extent of spending an entire paragraph trying to make lilflower (and Gad) scum/Astral not scum consistent with everything else you’ve said and that has occurred in the game so far. You’re far too concerned with making sure you’ve crossed all your t’s and dotted all your i’s, to come across as honest. Generally, townies just get to the point already. They don’t notice if their underpants are hanging out, because they’re not going around worried people are looking at their hind ends. You know? ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_Jan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Silver\_Jan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_Jan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1038 "2012-04-13T08:48:43Z")
**Unvote PetW** On reading that this is only his second game I think he might just have been trying to be helpful and not really trying to boss Town around. I want to have a good look at Astral, I have a FOS on him already but I want to have a more solid argument either for or against him. ---
**Author:** ![Visorslash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ee59a6/32.png) [@Visorslash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Visorslash)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1039 "2012-04-13T09:02:23Z")
Can we just kill Gadarene. Please. Then we can kill Astral. ---
**Author:** ![Weedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/weedy/32/301_2.png) [@Weedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weedy)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480/1040 "2012-04-13T11:50:50Z")
**vote MHaye** I like Normal’s case from before. With the triple vote available to Scum, I think we need strong wagons, not people voting each their own way. I’m probably the only one who hasn’t found Visorslash that controversial. I was expecting much more from the sign-up thread, made me think he might be Scum gone quiet. No one else seems to find him quiet though. I’m no longer suspicous of BobArrgh, given his explantion, and that glee flipped villager. ToeJam has been posting a lot without saying much. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=51) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-game-the-realm-of-phere/617480.md?page=53)