# Mafia: Goontown \[Game Over\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [September 22, 2018, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754 "2018-09-22T22:54:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/241 "2018-10-03T22:06:34Z")
Oh, and newbies? Do NOT be afraid of being wrong. We’re all wrong most of the time. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/242 "2018-10-03T22:06:44Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > We’re close to end of day, so this doesn’t strike me as “early”. You’ve also stated multiple times now that you believe that **snfaulkner** is scum. Could you remind me of your logic on that? While I wait for that, I have to say that I agree with **Johnny** that it’s odd that you’re voting for **Prof P** even though you think another player is more likely to be scum. You’re opting to kill him rather than scum because you think you’re a better player? It doesn’t compute. Always kill scum when you see them. I suspect **snfaulkner** for three reasons: first, he was early on to pumping up his post count; second, he started doing some shit-stirring in [POST=21237700]Post #46[/POST]; and third, he was the first to protest that he was “vanilla town”, completely unprovoked. He’s way too eager to protest to being a townie when of course everyone is going to protest that they are a townie. It strikes me as suspicious. The **Prof** has been on my watchlist since Post #37 to #39; in fact, he was going to be my initial vote before **snfaulkner** popped up on my radar. I’m not as sure about him, but he’s definitely on the short list, and he’s been transparently inflating his post count as well. I gave him the chance to back down, and the logic behind it, so he can make choice or he can pump up his post count to try to stay ahead of me. I’m not going to compete in that way because if he does burn me, and I turn out to be town (which I know I am, although there is no particular reason you should believe me) then it’ll be obvious to the rest of town that he is likely scum. My offer still remains; I’ll unvote **Prof. Pepperwinkle** if he does, and if not, we’ll see where the cards fall. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/243 "2018-10-03T22:10:39Z")
I’ll unvote Stranger if a better candidate comes along. At least I’ve got him to summarize his case on SNF, which is helpful. ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/244 "2018-10-03T22:13:30Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > It was very fun, and also stressful being a newbie. It did get me reeled in to Mafia. I miss Idle. I wish he would at least play. > > We’re close to end of day, so this doesn’t strike me as “early”. You’ve also stated multiple times now that you believe that **snfaulkner** is scum. Could you remind me of your logic on that? While I wait for that, I have to say that I agree with **Johnny** that it’s odd that you’re voting for **Prof P** even though you think another player is more likely to be scum. You’re opting to kill him rather than scum because you think you’re a better player? It doesn’t compute. Always kill scum when you see them. > > **unvote** > > **Stranger On A Train** This strikes me as motivated reasoning. I’m going to unvote Biotop And vote Sunny Daze. Stranger, thanks for the effort on the vote summary. Didn’t really display well, but that may be my phone. Will be back later. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/245 "2018-10-03T22:14:43Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > Yes, but the theory is that (assuming Stranger is town) he is 100% certain he is town and not 100% prof is town, therefore it is a town move to save oneself. No. If I thought **Prof. Pepperwinkle** was town, I’d vote someone else on my short list who I thought had a better chance of attracting votes than **snfaulkner** because it seems pretty apparent that he isn’t going to attract move votes for Day 1, so my vote for him is futile. But **Prof** was first on my radar, and his voting me forced me to retaliate. I’ve been very transparent about my vote strategy and rationale, so either I’m actually really, really clever about concealing my true intentions, or I am with the town. Either way, I’m kind of expecting to either die at the end of Day 1 (misidentified as scum, which should provide some useful information), or I’ll be killed by scum in Night 1, because at at least one of the two people I’ve voted are very likely scum in my estimation, which again, provides useful information. I’m not really expecting to see Day 2 either way. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/246 "2018-10-03T22:15:48Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > Yes, but he has more certainty that you (snfaulkner) are scum than that Prof P is scum, so he is voting “more town” over “more scum”. I am confuzzled. His logic for voting Prof P (who he thinks is more than likely town) is that he (Stranger) is playing town better than Prof P. 1) He is voting town over scum. 2) He is privileging his survival over the win. I don’t like it. He’s either scum or not a team player. Either situation warrants the lynch. While he may be voting “more town” than his suspicions would indicate, if he doesn’t save himself then it is certain a town will die (again, assuming stranger is town). While if he left the vote on his suspicions, that vote might go to waste, so to speak (though in future Days the vote record might prove useful) ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/247 "2018-10-03T22:17:56Z")
If night starts 4 PM eastern Thursday, we have a little less than 22 hours left. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/248 "2018-10-03T22:18:33Z")
In summary, as long as self defense votes are clearly labelled as such with a primary scum candidate noted, then I find self defense votes to be non alignment indicative (NAI) ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/249 "2018-10-03T22:23:24Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > No. If I thought **Prof. Pepperwinkle** was town, I’d vote someone else on my short list who I thought had a better chance of attracting votes than **snfaulkner** because it seems pretty apparent that he isn’t going to attract move votes for Day 1, so my vote for him is futile. But **Prof** was first on my radar, and his voting me forced me to retaliate. Yes, pretty much what I was trying to say, for the most part. > [@](#): > > I’ve been very transparent about my vote strategy and rationale, so either I’m actually really, really clever about concealing my true intentions, or I am with the town. Either way, I’m kind of expecting to either die at the end of Day 1 (misidentified as scum, which should provide some useful information), or I’ll be killed by scum in Night 1, because at at least one of the two people I’ve voted are very likely scum in my estimation, which again, provides useful information. I’m not really expecting to see Day 2 either way. > > Stranger I think it would be a rookie move for scum to kill their main Daytime detractors at Night. If you do get night killed, I would imagine it would be to try and frame me or prof. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/250 "2018-10-03T22:26:30Z")
> [@snoe](#): > > This strikes me as motivated reasoning. I’m going to > unvote Biotop > And > vote Sunny Daze. I’m not sure what that gets us. That changes a single vote to a zero and a zero to a single, which will have exactly no impact on this day. It’s better to take someone out who you think might be scum (and who has enough votes to be killed) because the longer the game goes on the more likely scum win by attrition. So your vote should count, even if it ends up being wrong. (Which is another reason I switched from **snfaulkner**.) > [@snoe](#): > > Stranger, thanks for the effort on the vote summary. Didn’t really display well, but that may be my phone. No problem. Next time I’ll just post players and votes, and maybe that will be clearer. I’m not going to go back and link to the posts where votes and unvotes happened 'cause that is just too much work for very little payoff. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/251 "2018-10-03T22:32:00Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > I think it would be a rookie move for scum to kill their main Daytime detractors at Night. If you do get night killed, I would imagine it would be to try and frame me or prof. Good point…or are you just trying to lay the groundwork that to contend that you were framed because I died on Night 1? I’d like to say more but I think discussing hypotheses at this point is going to be more useful to scum than town, so we’ll see what comes as of the dawn of Day 2. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/252 "2018-10-03T22:39:24Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Good point…or are you just trying to lay the groundwork that to contend that you were framed because I died on Night 1? > > I’d like to say more but I think discussing hypotheses at this point is going to be more useful to scum than town, so we’ll see what comes as of the dawn of Day 2. > > Stranger Yeah, it’s all just wine in front of me at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/253 "2018-10-03T22:45:02Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Good point…or are you just trying to lay the groundwork that to contend that you were framed because I died on Night 1? > > I’d like to say more but I think discussing hypotheses at this point is going to be more useful to scum than town, so we’ll see what comes as of the dawn of Day 2. > > Stranger I have to disagree. Town has only the power of the Vote. We don’t have Doctors or Sheriffs or Vigilantes this go-round, so discussion of hypotheticals is one of the few things we can do to rattle the cages. Your answers, for example, have been cogent and sound, and don’t really sound as Scummy as I first thought. Ergo, **unvote Stranger On A Train** and, accordingly, **vote Johnny Bravo**. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/254 "2018-10-03T22:46:20Z")
I did mention I love shenanigans, didn’t I? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/255 "2018-10-03T23:03:36Z")
What’s your beef with Johnny B? ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/256 "2018-10-03T23:11:37Z")
Just me gut reaction. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/257 "2018-10-03T23:46:11Z")
Just over 20 hours to go. snoe: 1 (snfaulkner) Prof. Pepperwinkle: 3 (Knowed Out, Johnny Bravo, Stranger on a Train) snfaulkner: 0 Biotop: 0 Knowed Out: 0 Stranger on a Train: 2 (Mahaloth, Sunny Daze) Mahaloth: 1 ( Biotop) Sunny Daze: 1 (snoe) Johnny Bravo: 1 (Prof. Pepperwinkle) As an aside, it’s really surreal for me, to be tracking all of these votes, but making no notes at all as to why they were made. ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/258 "2018-10-03T23:52:07Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > I’m not sure what that gets us. That changes a single vote to a zero and a zero to a single… Right, but I like my vote for Sunny more than my vote for Biotop – at the moment. I have other potential votes in mind, but I’d like to keep those close to my chest for now. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/259 "2018-10-04T00:07:26Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > I did mention I love shenanigans, didn’t I? 😃 Well, shit. Now that leaves me in the position of having to unvote the **Prof** and trying to outpost him, or hit someone else with one vote and a much lower post count, since a vote on **snfaulkner** would be pointless. This isn’t ideal, but: **Unvote Prof. Pepperwinkle** **Vote Mahaloth** Stranger ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754/260 "2018-10-04T00:12:25Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Well, shit. Now that leaves me in the position of having to unvote the **Prof** and trying to outpost him, or hit someone else with one vote and a much lower post count, since a vote on **snfaulkner** would be pointless. > > This isn’t ideal, but: > > **Unvote Prof. Pepperwinkle** > > **Vote Mahaloth** > > Stranger What? You just took Prof from the lead to now a 3-way tie. Or am I missing something? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-goontown-game-over/821754.md?page=14)