# Mafia: Not-so-simple-Simpletown **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 6, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592 "2009-03-06T22:58:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 39
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/761 "2009-04-01T22:11:20Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > …more specifically, why did it qualify as your final “reason” for voting meI have: > > a) not voted on you. > b) defended your posting style earlier this game ([url=[http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10938803&postcount=253](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10938803&postcount=253)] > You still have not directly addressed C. Instead, you have built an ever evolving case against me that has now spread to other games and the actions other people have taken against you. Interfuckingestering. Don’t you see this is what I was talking bout early on. Teammates in one game and adversaries in another. How does it play out? And do we metagame to leverage. There was and is no intent to cross pollinate. But shoot even with only females more dinosaurs emerge. This is truly fascinating from a Sociological viewpoint. ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/762 "2009-04-01T22:11:34Z")
Convince? Are you waiting on the most compelling argument from someone else before casting your vote? ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/763 "2009-04-01T22:12:39Z")
The above was in response to **Ed**. > [@special\_ed](#): > > Please elaborate, especially if you want to convince us. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/764 "2009-04-01T22:16:06Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > Convince? Are you waiting on the most compelling argument from someone else before casting your vote? No, actually, right now, I’m compiling an analysis of mental guy’s posts, but I did want him to give support to his accusations. You see, if he has actual reasons, he should be able to support them. If he doesn’t…then we should all wonder why he gave reasons but cannot support them. and, to be honest, if the support is logical and compelling, he should be able to convince us. And, if he’s Town and has genuine suspicions, he should be trying to convince us. ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/765 "2009-04-01T22:19:29Z")
Fair enough. It felt odd to me since you have not cast a vote at all today. ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/766 "2009-04-01T22:31:00Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > Teammates in one game and adversaries in another. How does it play out? And do we metagame to leverage. [metagame] For what it is worth, I felt a little bad playing you like I did last game. I think your style is unusual, but it adds another element (sometimes frustrating, sometimes humorous) and makes these mafia games more interesting. I sincerely mean it when I say I enjoy your presence here and look forward to playing more games with you in the future. [/metagame] ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/767 "2009-04-01T23:09:02Z")
With only a small amount of further ado, **MentalGuy** ’s post and my comments. (Sarcastic, interesting, game-related and otherwise) Here’s the ado: I’m skipping some posts that occurred before the role PMs were actually sent out. as well as his confirming role. (in total, that amounts to just 2 of his 26 posts.) [Post 134](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10933970&postcount=134): States that he has no clue what roles might be in the game in response to **kitten** ’s question. [Post 151](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10934282&postcount=151): INforms us that this is his first game. [Post 196](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936464&postcount=196): Tells us again that this is his first game, and asks if we have masons. He follows that up with asking if it’s a good idea for the Masons to out themselves immediately to take them out of our hunt for Scum. _Actually, he used the word “assassin” not Scum._ > [@mental guy](#): > > As I said earlier, this is my first game, so I have several questions. My apologies if some of these things should be obvious and I am just overlooking it. > > I have been thinking about Masons (if there are not any in the game, then I have really been wasting my time). First question, is it possible that their could be an assassin masquerading as a Mason? > > I realize that Masons might have special reasons for keeping themselves secret, such as an exclusive win condition or having the ability to communicate with each other. If, though, the only thing special about them is they know who each other are, is there any reason they should not publicly declare and confirm each other. That would at least remove a small group of players from the lynching pool, making the odds of lynching an assassin better. Like I said, I am a newbie and there is probably something I am overlooking. [Post 197](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936504&postcount=197): > [@mental guy](#): > > After I posted the above, I realized some problems with the Masons declaring. I had just not thought through far enough. I do still have the question about the possibility of assassins disguised as Masons. This occurs 30 minutes after the previous post. He said he realized the problems with the masons declaring, but doesn’t say what the realizations are. T_o me, at this point in my review, it looks suspiciously like he had gotten some advice to back off. He also uses the assassin term again._ [Post 205](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936853&postcount=205): Asks what a WiFoM is, also says he’s asking question here bcause he assumes the moderator will be non-committal. [Post 212](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936996&postcount=212): tells straggler his idea is bad, uses the term “wolves” for the first time, not assassins like he did earlier. Says he’s holding off on voting straggler. [Post 225](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10937342&postcount=225): Defends his use of the ‘wolves’ says he assumed the Scum were called assassins, though it hasn’t been specifically stated. Admits that he hasn’t read other games. _Why is he assuming assassins when he hasn’t read other games including simpletown?_ Also \*\*mentalguy \*\*states that he assumed Scum Day-talk, though now he sees it wasn’t explicitly stated. [Post 255](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939020&postcount=255): Defends his assumption of Scum Day Talk, votes for \*\*Almost Human \*\*, and says: > [@mental guy](#): > > I realize that this makes it look like [Undecided] Adrian and I are working together, but that is okay, since I think we are working together, just on the town side. [Post 280](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10944309&postcount=280): Defends what has been called his ‘snuggle’ with **Adrian** , says he trusts \*\*Adrian \*\*more than others because he stood up against the bad idea brought against **mentalguy** [Post 281](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939412&postcount=281): Points out that \*\*Adrian \*\*has made the same argument that he has. [Post 285](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939467&postcount=285): More on the Adrian stuff. States that he’s more likely to work with Adrian than the people who are trying to bandwagon him. [Post 288](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939524&postcount=288): Expresses gratitude to \*\*peeker \*\*for unvoting. Asks \*\*peeker \*\*to explain a mostly out of game peekerism [Post 353](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10943399&postcount=353): A long post summarizig and defending: 1) the wolves comment 2) The Scum Day Talk comments, and 3) the working with \*\*Adrian \*\*comments [Post 359](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10943683&postcount=359): Expresses gratitude to pedescribe for the unvote. Notes that he still has 3 votes and others miht be afraid to cause a tie. Encourages everyone to vote for whomever they find scummiest. [Post 366](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10944309&postcount=366) > [@mental guy](#): > > I do not want this to look like a case of “You voted for me, so I will vote for you”, but my vote against Almost Human was because I perceived her trying to start a pile-on (and I still have my suspicions). Since the pile-on has stopped, I will for the time being > > Unvote Almost Human > > I too will decide who to recast my vote for later in the day. [Post 431](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10946759&postcount=431) > [@mental guy](#): > > I am having a hard time deciding who to vote for. Batman is absent until the seventh page, then shows up to vote for someone not in the game. willthekittensurvive? seems like he is trying to avoid confrontation, which seems like something a relatively inexperienced scum would do. special ed and paulwhoisaghost seem a bit too coordinated in their arguments, but also a bit too obvious. I am suspicious of the three who originally voted against me(ok11, Almost Human, and pedescribe) because it seemed if someone was trying to get a pile-on started. Two of them have since rescinded their votes, but they may have just realized their argument against me wasn’t gaining much traction. > > I am tempted to vote for Batman for his absence and his weirdness, but I honestly don’t know what they imply. So while I don’t have a great deal of commitment behind it I will > > Vote willthekittensurvive? > > because he (she?) does seem to me the most likely to be scum. _I assume this vote is for the “trying to avoid confromntation” but he does admit there isn’t much commitment behind it_ [Post 457](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10948890&postcount=457): replies to straggler’s comment that any votes on a “town-aligned kitten” would earn straggler’s wrath to all who ‘piled-on’ her. _In the end, both straggler and kitten were scum and were on the same faction. To me, it sounds like straggler trying to intimidate._ Her is mental guy’s response: > [@mental guy](#): > > Straggler, I feel this may be partially directed at me since I may have appeared to be arguing against pile-ons earlier in the thread. First, I don’t know if the situation with kitten is an actual pile-on or simply people coming to their own conclusions based on their own reasoning and past experience . But I was not trying to argue that pile-ons are never justified, I just thought one was trying to get started against me for unjustified reasons. If my comment had been a more explicit PIS then a pile-on against me would have been entirely justified. > > I do not have much experience, but in the one game I have observed, someone that was acting somewhat like kitten turned out to be newbie scum and it was that more than anything that I based my vote on. > > I forgot to list you, Straggler, in my list of people I find suspicious. A lot of your posts and ideas seem to be anti-town, but they often also seem like an overconfident newbie. I do wonder if you might be trying to display confidence and a bit of bluster to keep people from thinking you are scum. _He changes his stance on pile-ons, (I keep wanting to say pylons), but this is to be expected a bit, since this one isn’t on him_ [Post 546](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10960065&postcount=546): pondering on what a cabalist is. More ponderings on how a werewolf ended up killed. “With a werewolf being NK’ed, can we assume something went wrong for the scum? Might they have tried to night-kill a player with a special power that backfired on them?” [Post 608](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10966075&postcount=608): Agrees with \*\*Sitnam \*\*that straggler’s failure to claim indicates that the cabalists are anti-town. Proposes and idea that can be loosely trasnlated as ‘perhaps the werewolves are a mad-bomber type role’ Votes for \*\*kitten \*\*stating, “All that being said, I still do not have a lot to go on. I will keep my vote as it was before.” [Post 681](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10985221&postcount=681) announces his return from his unannounced absence. Mentions what has already been stated about remaining masons claiming. Votes \*\*Almost Human \*\* in part for all the stuff with him on Day 1, as well as reasoning that a cabalist would not want to bus 2 teammates, and \*\*AH \*\*voted for Sitnam both days, as well as a mild defense of kitten in post 197 [Post 714](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994393&postcount=714) > [@mental guy](#): > > > [@Almost Human](#): > > > > So you’re voting for me because I “seemed to want people to casually accept that my “scum can day-talk” assumption should be an automatic vote against me.” and that I sort of defended kitten. > > No, I am voting for you because I thought “What did the scum need to achieve?”, “How would scum do that?”, and “Who seems to be doing those things?”. The stuff mentioned in the quote above is just sort of extra evidence for me and places you a bit ahead of Natlaw and ok11 on my list of suspicion. > > I slipped up and said wolves in the response to straggler and got unlucky that there are actually wolves in the game. I don’t really have any way to defend myself if you see that as a PIS, so if you don’t believe me then I can certainly understand you voting for me. If you go back and look at 681, I think Almost summarized the reasons mental guy gave for his vote. This time mental guy gave slightly different reasons, or at least a slightly different way of arriving at those reasons, it seems. He also puts suspicion on \*\*Natlaw \*\*and **ok11** , without giving any reasons. [Post 738](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994393&postcount=738): _I’ll admit, this pinged me big time. He basically states that he wants people to vote in case he needs to change his vote. Why would he need to change his vote? To save a fellow Scum? Maybe he innocently meant to avoid a tie, but this looks creepy to me. Town shouldn’t need to change their votes based on who is leading or not. Scum might._ > [@mental guy](#): > > We do not have votes yet from Ichini Sanshigo, pedescribe, Mr. Svinlesha, special ed, paulwhoisaghost, or Batman Jenkems (who has withdrawn). I would like to see these before the end of the day in case I need to switch my vote. [Post 740](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994641&postcount=740): after an hour and 20 minutesHe cleans up his request a bit > [@mental guy](#): > > Well, the end of the Day is Thursday at 4 EDT. I meant I would like to see votes by the end of the real-life day, just to give time for people to see everyone’s vote and switch if they feel it necessary. Obviously, this is just a request from me. If you want to place your vote at 3:58 tomorrow, I can’t stop you. Post 754: [Quote=mental guy] > [@ok11](#): > > MentalGuy, I understand why you’re suspicious of me, but I think post 714 is the first time you’ve mentioned being suspicious of Natlaw. Is he on your list based on Oredigger77’s case, or for something else? I had him as suspicious before Oredigger made the case against him, but Oredigger’s case did raise my suspicion level a bit. My suspicion of all three of you is based mainly on voting patterns, with thread comments and actions adding a bit too it. [/quote] _This pings me too. I don’t see much reasoning here. I’ve asked him to clarify his thinking, and maybe he will._ **@Natlaw** I’m finding mental guy suspicious for a lack of support for his reasons for voting, as well as knowing about assassins early and then seeming to forget. Also, twice he cleaned up ideas he threw out without stating why he was cleaning them up. To me, it just pings a little bit of getting advice in another thread to change his tune. I’m going to look at a couple of other things, but if nothing sticks out at me, I think this is where my vote will fall. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/768 "2009-04-01T23:22:30Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > Convince? Are you waiting on the most compelling argument from someone else before casting your vote? Actually I’ve got my vote on you. Skim much? Oopsie Doopsie. Now it stands. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/769 "2009-04-01T23:31:40Z")
Otie dotie. **Hero** is either a liar or full of shit. I already voted him. C’mon in **hero** ’s universe skimming = scum. Right? Obviously he he/she ist to keeping up. Care to make a counter case. Oh, someone else posts and is it incongruent. Crucify, but for me, [hero], ahhhh that would be bad. Kind of funky how you change the rules. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/770 "2009-04-01T23:40:37Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > …more specifically, why did it qualify as your final “reason” for voting meI have: > > a) not voted on you. > b) defended your posting style earlier this game ([In response to **Seeker** FOSing you for your style](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10938803&postcount=253)) > c) questioned you for not actually voting on oredigger > > You still have not directly addressed C. Instead, you have built an ever evolving case against me that has now spread to other games and the actions other people have taken against you. > > So far not a single one of the reasons you claim to be voting on me are true. I think you are either not paying very close attention to this game or have untold reasons for parking your vote on me. You are so full of shit. If you really think that the word “vote” is the determination then we can not connect. Otie dotie. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2009, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/771 "2009-04-01T23:59:03Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > [metagame] > For what it is worth, I felt a little bad playing you like I did last game. I think your style is unusual, but it adds another element (sometimes frustrating, sometimes humorous) and makes these mafia games more interesting. I sincerely mean it when I say I enjoy your presence here and look forward to playing more games with you in the future. > [/metagame] Mother of OG, where be Santo. I sure as hell you are T.O. Inclined 'cause I much more of a Romo. Marge looks fucking hot. Seriously, kudos who can figure that fucker out. But you know what, it is there. Peekslanation on the wire. ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/772 "2009-04-02T00:48:55Z")
I got nothing to say to all that. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/773 "2009-04-02T01:19:03Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > With only a small amount of further ado, **MentalGuy** ’s post and my comments. (Sarcastic, interesting, game-related and otherwise) > Here’s the ado: I’m skipping some posts that occurred before the role PMs were actually sent out. as well as his confirming role. (in total, that amounts to just 2 of his 26 posts.) > > [Post 134](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10933970&postcount=134): States that he has no clue what roles might be in the game in response to **kitten** ’s question. > > [Post 151](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10934282&postcount=151): INforms us that this is his first game. > > [Post 196](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936464&postcount=196): Tells us again that this is his first game, and asks if we have masons. He follows that up with asking if it’s a good idea for the Masons to out themselves immediately to take them out of our hunt for Scum. _Actually, he used the word “assassin” not Scum._ > [Post 197](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936504&postcount=197): > This occurs 30 minutes after the previous post. He said he realized the problems with the masons declaring, but doesn’t say what the realizations are. T_o me, at this point in my review, it looks suspiciously like he had gotten some advice to back off. He also uses the assassin term again._ > > [Post 205](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936853&postcount=205): Asks what a WiFoM is, also says he’s asking question here bcause he assumes the moderator will be non-committal. > > [Post 212](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10936996&postcount=212): tells straggler his idea is bad, uses the term “wolves” for the first time, not assassins like he did earlier. Says he’s holding off on voting straggler. > > [Post 225](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10937342&postcount=225): Defends his use of the ‘wolves’ says he assumed the Scum were called assassins, though it hasn’t been specifically stated. Admits that he hasn’t read other games. _Why is he assuming assassins when he hasn’t read other games including simpletown?_ Also \*\*mentalguy \*\*states that he assumed Scum Day-talk, though now he sees it wasn’t explicitly stated. > > [Post 255](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939020&postcount=255): Defends his assumption of Scum Day Talk, votes for \*\*Almost Human \*\*, and says: > > [Post 280](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10944309&postcount=280): Defends what has been called his ‘snuggle’ with **Adrian** , says he trusts \*\*Adrian \*\*more than others because he stood up against the bad idea brought against **mentalguy** > [Post 281](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939412&postcount=281): Points out that \*\*Adrian \*\*has made the same argument that he has. > > [Post 285](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939467&postcount=285): More on the Adrian stuff. States that he’s more likely to work with Adrian than the people who are trying to bandwagon him. > > [Post 288](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10939524&postcount=288): Expresses gratitude to \*\*peeker \*\*for unvoting. Asks \*\*peeker \*\*to explain a mostly out of game peekerism > > [Post 353](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10943399&postcount=353): A long post summarizig and defending: 1) the wolves comment 2) The Scum Day Talk comments, and 3) the working with \*\*Adrian \*\*comments > > [Post 359](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10943683&postcount=359): Expresses gratitude to pedescribe for the unvote. Notes that he still has 3 votes and others miht be afraid to cause a tie. Encourages everyone to vote for whomever they find scummiest. > > [Post 366](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10944309&postcount=366) > > [Post 431](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10946759&postcount=431) > > _I assume this vote is for the “trying to avoid confromntation” but he does admit there isn’t much commitment behind it_ > [Post 457](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10948890&postcount=457): replies to straggler’s comment that any votes on a “town-aligned kitten” would earn straggler’s wrath to all who ‘piled-on’ her. _In the end, both straggler and kitten were scum and were on the same faction. To me, it sounds like straggler trying to intimidate._ Her is mental guy’s response: > > _He changes his stance on pile-ons, (I keep wanting to say pylons), but this is to be expected a bit, since this one isn’t on him_ > > [Post 546](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10960065&postcount=546): pondering on what a cabalist is. More ponderings on how a werewolf ended up killed. “With a werewolf being NK’ed, can we assume something went wrong for the scum? Might they have tried to night-kill a player with a special power that backfired on them?” > > [Post 608](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10966075&postcount=608): Agrees with \*\*Sitnam \*\*that straggler’s failure to claim indicates that the cabalists are anti-town. Proposes and idea that can be loosely trasnlated as ‘perhaps the werewolves are a mad-bomber type role’ Votes for \*\*kitten \*\*stating, “All that being said, I still do not have a lot to go on. I will keep my vote as it was before.” > > [Post 681](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10985221&postcount=681) announces his return from his unannounced absence. Mentions what has already been stated about remaining masons claiming. Votes \*\*Almost Human \*\* in part for all the stuff with him on Day 1, as well as reasoning that a cabalist would not want to bus 2 teammates, and \*\*AH \*\*voted for Sitnam both days, as well as a mild defense of kitten in post 197 > > [Post 714](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994393&postcount=714) > > If you go back and look at 681, I think Almost summarized the reasons mental guy gave for his vote. This time mental guy gave slightly different reasons, or at least a slightly different way of arriving at those reasons, it seems. He also puts suspicion on \*\*Natlaw \*\*and **ok11** , without giving any reasons. > > [Post 738](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994393&postcount=738): _I’ll admit, this pinged me big time. He basically states that he wants people to vote in case he needs to change his vote. Why would he need to change his vote? To save a fellow Scum? Maybe he innocently meant to avoid a tie, but this looks creepy to me. Town shouldn’t need to change their votes based on who is leading or not. Scum might._ > [Post 740](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10994641&postcount=740): after an hour and 20 minutesHe cleans up his request a bit > > Post 754: > _This pings me too. I don’t see much reasoning here. I’ve asked him to clarify his thinking, and maybe he will._ > > **@Natlaw** I’m finding mental guy suspicious for a lack of support for his reasons for voting, as well as knowing about assassins early and then seeming to forget. Also, twice he cleaned up ideas he threw out without stating why he was cleaning them up. To me, it just pings a little bit of getting advice in another thread to change his tune. > I’m going to look at a couple of other things, but if nothing sticks out at me, I think this is where my vote will fall. This is an interesting, well thought out case. If I may add a few things? -The opening color mentions assassains. However, it does not mention wolves. This makes the assumption about assassains understandable, but the switch to wolves doubly weird. -Why did he shift to wolves as the default to wolves as a mad-bomber type? It’s a highly unusual shift. -He is implicitly defending Sitnam in his case on AH. I’m convinced. **Vote MentalGuy** And sorry about the low participation, I’ve had a lot of RL stuff on my plate. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/774 "2009-04-02T01:48:32Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > This is an interesting, well thought out case. If I may add a few things? > -The opening color mentions assassains. However, it does not mention wolves. This makes the assumption about assassains understandable, but the switch to wolves doubly weird. > -Why did he shift to wolves as the default to wolves as a mad-bomber type? It’s a highly unusual shift. > -He is implicitly defending Sitnam in his case on AH. > I’m convinced. > **Vote MentalGuy** > > And sorry about the low participation, I’ve had a lot of RL stuff on my plate. Your quote of my quote left out my quotes within the quotes. I just want to be sure that people read my original post for continuity sake. Many of my comments don’t make sense when the quote I was commenting on is missing. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d9b06d/32.png) [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ichini_Sanshigo)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/775 "2009-04-02T02:36:38Z")
> [@BillMC](#): > > What makes you think there are more than three factions? What makes you think there aren’t? It’s highly unlikely (I believe), as that would make the game extra-complicated, but I hate to discount any possibility. > [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > I understand replacing into a game can be hard work, but you sat on me all yesterDay for reasons that I demonstrated to be false. Admitting you were mistaken is o.k. and would go a long way in resolving my issues with you. I think the actions of other people today have been pretty scummy but want to figure out where you are coming from before I move my vote. I felt like admitting I was mistaken wasn’t going to help matters. Yes, my interpretation left something to be desired. But at the very least, I figured I’d be called out for being “anti-town”, or else you’d say, “That’s just what scum would do, retract when the heat is on”, so lose-lose, ya know. > [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > You have posted on The Dope several times since the beginning of toDay. Why did you wait to post here until just now? Were you not reading the thread? If you were reading the thread, why did you not think it was important enough to post and defend yourself when you were leading the lynch vote? “I like string cheese” really doesn’t require the same level of analysis as a mafia thread, no? I can skim other threads and make a 30 second post in those topics. But if I miss one word here: > [@ok11](#): > > **Ichini** , I’ve never said that I’m no longer suspicious of **Sitnam** , or that voting twice for Cabalists somehow exempts him from being scum. Okay, so I should have said “not _as_ suspicious of **Sitnam** ”. In my correction. Where I missed a whole predicate. The slightest semantic mistake, and people are all over that, so I’d rather save meaningful posts for when I’m not multi-tasking. I know I’ve been lurkerific, and that’s more a function of getting a case of [Archive Panic](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArchivePanic) when I look at all the posts I have to catch up on. There’s a reason I didn’t vote for you ToDay. ---
**Author:** ![Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d9b06d/32.png) [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ichini_Sanshigo)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/776 "2009-04-02T02:42:27Z")
> [@Natlaw](#): > > **Ichini** , are you familiar with the mafia term ‘[bussing](http://wiki.flyingcowofdoom.com/mafiaWiki/Bussing)’? Is the clever bit that **Hero** is bussing you? No, I hadn’t heard of bussing. I chose bus stop because I was trying to think of something that people lean on and I lean on signs/buildings/ shelters at the bus stop. Jiminy H. Cricket, even my awful jokes (puns? gags?) are scummy. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/777 "2009-04-02T02:46:11Z")
> [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](#): > > No, I hadn’t heard of bussing. I chose bus stop because I was trying to think of something that people lean on and I lean on signs/buildings/ shelters at the bus stop. Jiminy H. Cricket, even my awful jokes (puns? gags?) are scummy. Lean on me when you’re not strong and I’ll be your friend I’ll help you carry on For it won’t be long Til I’m gunna need Somebody to lean on oh, and **vote mental guy** for various and sundry reasons ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/778 "2009-04-02T02:47:48Z")
> [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](#): > > What makes you think there aren’t? It’s highly unlikely (I believe), as that would make the game extra-complicated, but I hate to discount any possibility. > > I felt like admitting I was mistaken wasn’t going to help matters. Yes, my interpretation left something to be desired. But at the very least, I figured I’d be called out for being “anti-town”, or else you’d say, “That’s just what scum would do, retract when the heat is on”, so lose-lose, ya know. > > “I like string cheese” really doesn’t require the same level of analysis as a mafia thread, no? I can skim other threads and make a 30 second post in those topics. But if I miss one word here: > > Okay, so I should have said “not _as_ suspicious of **Sitnam** ”. In my correction. Where I missed a whole predicate. The slightest semantic mistake, and people are all over that, so I’d rather save meaningful posts for when I’m not multi-tasking. > > I know I’ve been lurkerific, and that’s more a function of getting a case of [Archive Panic](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArchivePanic) when I look at all the posts I have to catch up on. There’s a reason I didn’t vote for you ToDay. Gaah! Warn us before you link to TVTropes! That website got me killed in the other game! ---
**Author:** ![Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d9b06d/32.png) [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ichini_Sanshigo)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/779 "2009-04-02T02:57:37Z")
[quote=“ok11, post:750, topic:488592”] **Ichini** , I’ve never said that I’m no longer suspicious of **Sitnam** , or that voting twice for Cabalists somehow exempts him from being scum. Please reread [posts 624](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10969044&postcount=624) and [638](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10972833&postcount=638), where I said it’s possible that **Sitnam** is a werewolf, or a Cabalist who bussed his team member. You also didn’t answer my question from post 638. [quote] > [@ok11](#): > > Didn’t you look at the vote counts? We had 9 of them on Day 1, and in the first 6, Hero is the only one voting for Seeker. And yet you noticed pedescribe’s vote, which came only a few posts before Hero’s (on the same page), but wasn’t on any of the vote counts. Yeah, I saw the post counts, but I wasn’t really relying on them. I worked out from **pedescribe’s** post. Yeah, I did some skimming. Bad idea jeans. > [@](#): > > Please also take a look at [post 610](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10966102&postcount=610) where I FOSed **Sitnam**. As you can see, my Day 2 vote was partially based on his assumptions about night kills. Those assumptions would indicate extra knowledge only if he belonged to the Cabalist faction. Even if you think **Sitnam** bussed his teammates both Days, do you really think **straggler** would have created a tie between his teammates ( **kitten** and **Sitnam** ) on Day 1? I don’t, which is why I don’t think anymore that those assumptions were scummy. That’s why I have a reason to be _less_ suspicious of **Sitnam**. Now that he’s not at the top of my list, you are. I don’t think **Sitnam** bussed him teammates on both days. Remember - 2 anti-town (probably) factions. **Sitnam** probably isn’t a bus-happy cabalist, but that doesn’t mean he’s not a wolf. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2009, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592/780 "2009-04-02T03:08:10Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > I got nothing to say to all that. Santo was even more random than I. Just kind of x rated. T.O. Is terrel and romo be romo. Romo is honking on J. Simpson. Marge is a simpson married to homer. See the connection. That is how my brain works. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592.md?page=38) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-not-so-simple-simpletown/488592.md?page=40)