# Mafia Reunion - Day Two **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [January 17, 2017, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425 "2017-01-17T22:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 68
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1341 "2017-01-24T19:05:18Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > You’re not blunt enough!🙂 > > You know my position on LtL, I think. I’m not against it. What I am against, is to focus solely on that. Why is your focus more or less only on lurkers? Especially at this point, where you yourself admit you don’t have a big enough data-set to separate the wheat from the chav. My focus on LtL is simply this: I have a method I have found to be 85% reliable in finding Scum in the early Days. Meta doesn’t do it. Aggressive shock voting techniques don’t do it. The early Days are a crapshoot. Voting for those who don’t participate, even if it doesn’t result in a Scum death, lets those who are participating and more vocal continue to play and possibly slip up and/or get caught in a lie. Once the game gets rolling, it’s less a factor, because then we have vote records, considerably more discussion, and better players than I can construct Walls of Words analyses that may (or may not) hunt down Scum. Now I need to address Drain Bean and post 1315. Hoo-boy. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1342 "2017-01-24T19:19:33Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > :rolleyes: > > Do you not understand how your claiming, if truthful, has helped scum to eliminate you as a potential target? You are correct that no one can take claiming away from you. That doesn’t mean you somehow get a pass when you screw it up and claim inappropriately. That doesn’t mean you somehow get a pass when you screw it up and claim inappropriately. **I reject the premise.** 1. Who gets to determine judgement on claim timing? Is it you? Why? I seriously doubt such one person exists… But hey that might explain the entire Pleonast claiming thing. No seriously. We as a group have our default claiming pattern this much ingrained into our collective psyche, that it’s on me to know the etiquette? Again, without questioning the worth and value of it? 2.Claim Inappropriately. 😕 Woah. There is just … So much wrong here, I can’t even begin to formulate a response. If your point is that vanilla town should never claim [[Which, I think it is, even if that’s an implied subtext, a few layers down.]] then appropriateness isn’t even a condition that should be on the table. **Or did you ever consider, that all claims are inappropriate? Claims of Non-vanilla town, being the most inappropriate, ESPECIALLY to vanilla town players?** I mean, if a vanilla claiming AT ANY POINT is inappropriate … Shouldn’t that make power roles claiming at all, forbidden?! It’s not my fault that people before me have claimed. If you take issue with vanilla town claiming, tell the rest of town not to claim. This cat isn’t getting back in the bag. That bell isn’t getting unrung. … And frankly, if I wasn’t already investigated by now, (There is a precedent for me being investigated ASAP) then this might be an issue. But… I kinda think I’ve been representing town for a while now. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1343 "2017-01-24T19:22:21Z")
But why don’t you consider combining several approaches to finding scum? Why does these approaches always have to be exclusive? Why can’t you look at lurkers, listen to your gut, try to analyse motivations, look at vote-records, case-making, active lurking, slips/foot-mouth and tone, and build a case from that, or some of those approaches combined? ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1344 "2017-01-24T19:23:29Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > If **ToeJam** lives through the Night, he’s probably our obvious lynch for D3. But just because there’s a potential foregone conclusion doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be doing our research on other players. I’ve already expressed my suspicion of **BillMC** earlier in this thread after doing a WoW on him, and that suspicion remains. I’ve noticed a lot of people find the esteemed Professor to be scummy, so I figured I’d do a WoW on him, since I have time and I’m at an actual computer for a bit. All added asterisks are mine, done when I want to make a point later. > > [SPOILER] > **Day/Night One** > > 3 - A list of who posted and how much during N0. > 92 - D1 votes are a dart throw. Some players attack and see how others react, but he’s not good at that, so he tends to go fluff on D1 and sees who that pisses off. But in a game of this size, that method won’t work all that well. He won’t be posting as often as usual for that reason. He favors lynch the lurker, but later in the Day, not early.\* Attacking others makes targets, which creates voting histories which will be useful later. > 160 - 7 votes out of this game is equivalent to 2 votes in a game of normal size, so he’s not concerned about the early Colby wagon. Asks mods if we’re allowed to hammer. > 167 - Fluff about Meeko’s MC Hammer reference. > 283 - Responds to DiggitCamara\*\* saying that the rules say no multivoting, and says that Pleonast (who was the multivoter in question) said in his post that he knew only the first vote would count. > 285 - Tells Angelofthenorth that there’s a role list, explains what the Patsy is in response to her(?) question.\*\*\* > 428 - Normally he’d be fluffy D1, but this game doesn’t allow for it. He just doesn’t see much to comment on, though. Colby’s slip is possible but nowhere near certain. He generally jokes through the first half of D1 and focuses on Lynch the Lurker for the second half. > 526 - Day One is a crapshoot. Since he’s taking flak for his normal game mode of posting fluff (only this time without the fluff) and being helpful, it’s time for him to go into Lynch the Lurker. Posts a list of who has posted and how much. Says DaphneBlack and WinstonSmith are slated for Modkill if they don’t post. Points out that Inner Stickler, Enderw24, Koldanar, Precambrianmollusc, and Red Skeezix have 1 post each. Quotes posts from each. Says it’s curious that two of the one-post voters picked Lakai. Attempts to vote EnderW24 (messes it up) for looking eager but then never posting again, as well as reviewing the rules but missing simple points. Explains that he uses Lynch the Lurker as a D1 strategy this is a different environment and game than the Giraffe games where he uses his Fluff strategy. Says that in general, Scum strategy in D1 is to let Town lynch Town and not take much part in leading the charge at all. Says he’ll get to Scum hunting once a full D/N cycle has passed and he has more to go on, but for now, Lynch the Lurker. > 527 - Another failed vote attempt > 528 - Gets it right this time, says he would have just edited but that would have caused offense. > 545 - Says he meant to vote Koldanar rather than EnderW24, as his reasoning applied to Koldanar’s post and not Ender’s (in response to HookerChemical asking him if that’s what he meant to do). > 606 - Quotes what appears to be Lyle Lovett lyrics? > 628 - Makes a monkey joke. > 640 - In an average 5 out of 6 games there’s at least one Scum in the bottom three posters\*\*\*\* > 641 - Corrects mod vote count in regards to his vote switch. > 658 - Tells NAF he switched in post 545. > 725 - Says he’ll catch votes for being too helpful, then gives a list of all votes and unvotes in the game to that point. > 726 - Gives a key for the shorthand he used to indicate votes and unvotes in the previous post. > 746 - Says he’s been keeping the vote tally because he finds votes to be of great significance later in the game. Didn’t comment on the list because it has no context yet. Reiterates that D1 is a crapshoot, says he’s just being a helpful townie. > 773 - There are 8-9 votes on Colby. If he’s Scum and his team wants to save him, they only have 6 votes to distribute elsewhere. In a game of this size, Town can ALMOST (emphasis his) disregard a Scum swaying of the lynch, because it would be suicidal for all of them to glom onto the same candidate to save a teammate.\*\*\*\*\* Scum are going to have to persuade rather than skew the vote by voting, and that will come into effect more around EoD. Seeing as EoD is Sunday, a lower participation day of the week, it’ll be harder for them to try to save Colby (of course, Colby may be Town and that may be a moot point). > 827 - Asks Koldanar (who he’s still currently voting for, but who has posted that he’s catching up) if he has any current suspects. > 829 - After NP asks him who HIS suspects are, he refers her to post 526, but laments that he hasn’t convinced anyone else. > 835 - Says that he focuses on LtL until there’s more solid data in the game from voting records. He says that the small base gives an 85% chance of finding Scum. Says that the problem with this is that there’s really no way of picking out which one from that pool is the Scum. Thinks that this method is still better than lynching the loud. Remember that in this game the Scum is paranoid because there are two teams of them. The best we have today is a possible clearing of septimus and maybe Idle. Closer to EoD he will likely change his vote to one of the leaders, as a one-off is scummy in its own right.\*\*\*\*\*\* > 843 - Says that Idle isn’t cleared, he just claimed VT. In response to NP suggesting that his playstyle has changed from the last game they played together, he says that was one of his first games, and he’s refined his playstyle since then. > 869 - Says that he was wrong for suggesting Idle was cleared, since he merely claimed. > 872 - NP tells him that her name was different over on Giraffe and they’d played a very recent game over there. He says that he’s dropped LtL on Giraffe, as too many people hate it, he knows enough about the players to use Meta knowledge of them there as a D1 strategy, and that “When I first started using it, I had hoped it would be more effective. It doesn’t actually work any better than any other system, but it does work in its own limited way. The real problem is getting others to implement it, 'cause it doesn’t work if only I vote that way.”\*\*\*\*\*\*\* > 891 - Joke post > 908 - Unvotes Koldanar now that he’s joined the game. Says he’ll switch vote to one of the lynch leaders closer to EoD, since LtL has failed to gain traction. > 915 - D1 is still a crapshoot. He doesn’t see anything that sets any player apart from any other player, which is why he was going with LtL. Everyone is potential scum, minus him. He’ll now be analyzing the major lynch contenders and voting for whoever seems the scummiest to him.\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\* > 916 - Says he’ll be using analysis to determine who to switch to, but that successful Town lynches on D1 are nothing but luck.\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\* > 922 - He is not a good player who excels at provoking useful statements from others. Nonetheless, he’ll go over N0 and D1 and hopefully place a useful vote. > 997 - Says he’s Town and not 3rd Party. Needs to compare his vote list to Septimus’s, and get down to his reread. > 1007 - Says he claimed Town and not 3rd party in response to Chronos requesting it, although Guiri has suspected it’s a 3rd party trick. > 1015 - Agrees with Lightfoot’s take on Colby and his posts, that he seems more frustrated and angry that he’s getting lynched early in lots of games. > 1057 - Votes ToeJam. Says that the best case is Hooker’s post 536. Says that Colby just seems burned out from too many early deaths, and that most of the arguments against Lakai are centered around confusion which is a null tell, and Angel may or may not be Scum but her saying she loved him gets her a pass until D2. > 1062 - Says it was BillMC and not Guiri who suspected a 3rd party trick. > 1066 - Gives current vote leader count as 9 for Colby, 8 for Lakai, 7 for ToeJam, and 5 for Angel. > 1099 - Tells Suburban Plankton that he voted ToeJam in 1057, because SP posted a list of votes and has him as not voting. > 1103 - Gives another vote leader count, this time with 12 Lakai, 7 Colby, 7 ToeJam, and 5 Angel. > 1106 - Guesses that ToeJam will claim that RL made him not post since 133, when he had 2 votes to Colby’s 5. > 1136 - Corrects moderator vote count showing that brewha voted twice. Notes that only 41 votes are cast at this point out of 54. Thinks tomorrow (not sure if that means D2 or the last calendar day of D1) should be interesting. > 1163 - It’s Sunday morning and lots of people said they’d be absent for EoD. Sunset won’t be well attended, but Dawn should be. > 1181 - 20% of the posters putting up half the posts on D1 isn’t unusual, but if it’s still the case on D3, there’s a problem. > 1186 - Cheese pun about Colby. > 1207 - Vote count puts Lakai 2 ahead of Colby, notes flurry of last minute activity. > 1212 - Points out that it’s technically EoD. > 1215 - Wonders about the odds of three dead. > 1219 - Gives D1 vote/unvote count > 1226 - Interprets the mod poem for those of us who were confused by the Tapatalk error that left Lakai out of it completely. > 1245 - Joke in response to another joke. > 1249 - Tells me that there won’t be a separate Night thread. > 1251 - Corrects the post number that the announcement about no separate night thread was in. > 1254 - Points out that as bad as D1 was, with the potential NKs it’s going to get worse. > 1401 - Support for LightFoot’s husband. > 1437 - Joke about how we’re all dead as of the morning of D2. > 1445 - Thanks the mods for giving a timeframe of when to expect the Dawn post. > > \*Seems to be making excuses for his poor play. Also, I think that in general, posting fluff annoys Town more than it does Scum, because Town needs information and Scum does not. So if he’s using it to find people he thinks are Town, it’s probably a decent method, but it seems from this post like he’s using it to try to find Scum. I’m not sure how effective that is. I’m pulling this theory out of my ass, but I think it has merit. > \*\*Is DiggitCamara still in this game? I swear, I don’t remember much of anything from him in this game at all. > \*\*\*He gets the role slightly wrong. Patsy can only kill someone if mislynched, not if NKed. If our remaining investigative types (We still have a Seer, and possibly an Understudy Homicide Detective or Journalist) get a Scum result on Prof., for this reason I’d guess it’d be legit. If he were the Patsy he’d know the role. > \*\*\*\*Someone smarter than I am will have to do the math on that. 🙂 > \*\*\*\*\*Then why care about the voting record at all? If this is correct, he shouldn’t be looking at vote tallies, he should be looking at who tries to argue persuasively against voting for someone Scummy, especially around EoD. > \*\*\*\*\*\*I’m not even sure if that number comes from any sort of place other than his ass. (Not meaning to be insulting here–my ass is the source of many of my theories.) Also, he seems overly concerned with appearing scummy. > \*\*\*\*\*\*\*My theory works, but then again it doesn’t work, but it works in its own limited way. I have no idea what to make of this, seeing as he’s been arguing for LtL for a good portion of the Day. > \*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*So no player stands out from any other, but he’s going to look at their posts and see if one suddenly does? This seems really suspect to me. He’s excusing his actions thus far in the game (which is a trend that started with his first post) and giving a future excuse for potentially bandwagon jumping later. > \*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*The “being right on D1 is nothing but luck” seems like yet another excuse for a potential mislynch. > > My take from this is that he’s trying very hard to be a helpful Townie, but is overly concerned with looking like it, which is a bit Scummy. He also seems to be making lots of excuses in advance for potential poor play. I think knowing what ToeJam is will be almost essential in finishing this analysis, but D2 may also help shine some light as well. So let’s get on with it, shall I? > > **Day/Night Two** > > 2 - Mad that we’re down 5 town, 3 of whom were power roles. > 9 - Thinks it’s a reasonable assumption that Colby got vigged. > 14 - Tells Mahaloth that NAF already announced the subs. > 15 - Points out 47 votes cast out of 51 players, FOS on anyone who didn’t vote or posted fewer than 10 times. > 24 - Average number of posts per poster in D1 was 20. Lakai’s was 18. Colby was at 9. We’re guessing he was vigged. Of the other three dead Townies, who were likely killed by Scum, NP was the 2nd highest volume poster, at 81, SP was the 6th, at 62, and septimus was 15th, at 38, but had claimed. Says that we shouldn’t lynch the loud. Gives a full post count from D1. > 25 - Says don’t lynch the loud YET. > 46 - Votes for Sario, despite still being okay with a ToeJam lynch, because Sario only posted 5 times D1 and didn’t vote. > 50 - Points to post 568 by HookerChemical as the best case against ToeJam on D1. > 52 - Gives a link to the post. > 76 - Welcomes paul to the game, says he (Prof, not Paul) pings a lot of people. Tells paul to look at post 46 and his vote for Sario despite being okay with ToeJam. > 79 - In response to jsgoddess FOSing him for saying lynch the lurker while also saying he’d be posting less and fluffy, he says that he said he wouldn’t post as much as usual, but was still in the top 10 posters D1, and only some of it was fluff. > 163 - Only 41 people posted in N1 and D2 so far, which makes 9 possible players to go at Dusk. > 185 - Agrees with bufftabby, who said that while Colby’s game was similar to the Dante game in which he was Scum, his reactions in Dante’s game were more “Oh, this D1 crap again?” > 256 - What are the odds that Brewha is a 3rd party who wins if he’s NKed? > 317 - Agrees with Meeko, who says that those with switches won’t care about our advice about how to use them. (I think. I can never really parse Meeko. Y’all might want to check this one.) > 515 - Tries to convince people to vote for Sario because he’s basically not playing at all. > 667 - Gives an unofficial vote count. Says he doesn’t have a problem moving his vote to brewha or crys if needed for a second lynch. > 669 - Fixes mistake in unofficial count. > 671 - After another mistake is pointed out, makes joke. > 794 - Unvotes Sario and votes brewha without any additional comment. > 989 - Won’t be on much today and will miss EoD. > 1081 - Welcomes cygnus to the game. > 1116 - Gives final post count for D2, says that we should be using this as the basis of our votes. Needs to catch up with what happened at EoD. > 1161 - Offers the one he did for D1, agrees with me that it might be useful for finding patterns. Says he’ll start off D3 voting for Sario again.\* > 1188 - In response to paul saying that he’s not really making cases, says he made a case on Sario for only posting fluff and not voting either Day. That’s anti-Town, and might be Scum, because he’s seen him play differently in other games. > 1196 - Says his low posting D2 was due to RL events. Plans on posting more D3 but will still vote Sario. > 1286 - Looking for patterns with only two days of data points is bad, but Angel, as a notoriously high poster, is suspect for posting less this game. Idle’s low posting rate is suspect also. > 1289 - Singled out Angel because she is one of the top three posters in nearly every game he’s played with her, so her drop in post count is noticeable. Reiterates that he’s still playing LtL. It’s easier for Scum to hide by not posting than it is for them to post a lot and potentially slip. > 1292 - Says that he does LtL because we’ve lynched Town twice, and this isn’t an unusual occurrence. He’s trying to improve chances of hitting Scum, because all they have to do in this game is lay low. > > \*Had he caught up with his reading at that point? Because if so, he’d have seen the late rush on ToeJam, who he was perfectly okay still voting for in post 46, and who I think almost everyone at this point agrees needs killing so we can make sense of the votes the past two Days. Instead, he comes out and says he’ll be voting Sario again. > > Okay. Participation (and level of meaningful and useful information in actual posts) went WAY down on D2. He’s playing LtL, then went into relative lurk mode, while still trying to look helpful by giving the occasional vote count or post tally. Was gone when the ToeJam run really picked up steam, so kept his vote on brewha, but announced his absence ahead of time, so…not really sure what to think of that one. > > [SPOILER] > > All in all, I’m leaning Scum on this, but not necessarily for who he was voting for. It’s more for trying to look helpful while doing absolutely nothing that helps find Scum. I spoilered the bulk of the above just for purposes of not overwhelming the page. First off, hurray! My first WoW and I get a Nine-Star Rating! I wish to heaven I was ten years younger. My brain was a lot sharper back then, and I had the energy to examine every nook and cranny in an argument. I have seen a number of these over the last year-and-a-half and they never fail to impress me. They also don’t really work that well as far as finding scum. I mean to say, after all that analysis, anyone is expecting a scum reading at the end. If my PM didn’t remind me I was Town, I’d probably agree with you. As to the larger points: yes, I really did do the analysis that came up with the 85% figure for lurkers being in the bottom-most of the posters on D1, D2 and D3. I stopped using it over there because: 1. LightFoot voted for me everytime I mentioned it. 2. TexCat voted for me everytime I mentioned it. 3. I had acquired enough Meta knowledge of the others to play without it. None of which means it doesn’t work. The real reason it doesn’t work is that many, many, many players apparently feel that the whole process is mechanical, and, as such, isn’t really playing Mafia. They also object to mass claims and any stratagem that requires all or most of the players to vote in one particular way. I understand that. That isn’t the game they signed up for, and it doesn’t give them the psychological satisfaction of finding a rat bastard Scum and lynching him the good old fashioned way. Regarding fluff: I like it. It doesn’t help Town any, I do realize that. But I’ve been happiest at play when I tell a joke and someone tells me I’ve really cheered up their day. Which has happened a lot, actually. I think it’s good for morale. Especially on the early Days when there isn’t just plain any Data to work with. I am making excuses for my poor play because I feel I am a poor player. Once in a while I get a gut feeling that pays off, but otherwise… meh. So I work at being helpful, posting voting tallies and Who Posted, &c., and that gives the better players easy access to information that they can use. So, thank you for your hard work. I’m still Town, but now I can see better why I am coming off scummy in nearly every game I play. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1345 "2017-01-24T19:24:08Z")
@Meeko So, no, you don’t understand. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1346 "2017-01-24T19:24:29Z")
…and the spoilering didn’t work. Pfui. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1347 "2017-01-24T19:26:21Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > But why don’t you consider combining several approaches to finding scum? Why does these approaches always have to be exclusive? Why can’t you look at lurkers, listen to your gut, try to analyse motivations, look at vote-records, case-making, active lurking, slips/foot-mouth and tone, and build a case from that, or some of those approaches combined? Ah. I DO do that, later in the game. If I live that long. One problem is that now that I am so associated with LtL, if I don’t promote it people pick up on it right away and vote for me because I’m playing out of character. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1348 "2017-01-24T19:29:55Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > Ah. I DO do that, later in the game. If I live that long. > > One problem is that now that I am so associated with LtL, if I don’t promote it people pick up on it right away and vote for me because I’m playing out of character. In response to that second paragraph: You can always change meta/playstyle. It may take a few games, but nothing is set in stone. It’s one of the beautiful things about this game. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1349 "2017-01-24T19:31:35Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > In response to that second paragraph: You can always change meta/playstyle. It may take a few games, but nothing is set in stone. It’s one of the beautiful things about this game. Yeah, over on Giraffe I’ve managed to make that change. Here I figured, hey, it’s Old School, I’ll dust off the LtL again. Not my best idea, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1350 "2017-01-24T19:31:56Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > @Meeko > > So, no, you don’t understand. I’m sorry, why does your opinion here matter more than mine? That’s the problem with Mafia, you can do everything and nothing, and it doesn’t make a bit of difference. The synergy never happens. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1351 "2017-01-24T19:33:57Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > In response to that second paragraph: You can always change meta/playstyle. It may take a few games, but nothing is set in stone. It’s one of the beautiful things about this game. No, then you just get lynched day one, as scum, for not living up to post count. Just Me? 😃 . I’m not sure anything could change my meta or playstyle.☹ ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1352 "2017-01-24T19:35:59Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > No, then you just get lynched day one, as scum, for not living up to post count. > > Just Me? 😃 > > . > I’m not sure anything could change my meta or playstyle.☹ > [@Plumpudding](#): > > In response to that second paragraph: You can always change meta/playstyle. **It may take a few games** , but nothing is set in stone. It’s one of the beautiful things about this game. Bolded for emphasis:) ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1353 "2017-01-24T19:47:29Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > :rolleyes: > > Do you not understand how your claiming, if truthful, has helped scum to eliminate you as a potential target? You are correct that no one can take claiming away from you. That doesn’t mean you somehow get a pass when you screw it up and claim inappropriately. **You are too busy looking at my answer, that you aren’t looking at the question.** You have to shoehorn in “inappropriately”. I think this is a microcosm of why our games don’t work. **Mafia. Not Claimia.** I believe we should play Mafia in such a way, that this isn’t an issue. YES. I understand the point you are making. But again, I reject the premise. This is not the question you, or anyone else, should be asking. It shouldn’t even be a question. --Before you attempt to unload the next clip onto me, ponder why we making claiming such a big deal in the first place. The climate of our games should be no where near “OMG ITS A MAFIA GAME, I’ll claim Night -1! It’s ok, I always do that, so its kosher… Ha ha… Unless anyone else does it.” Seriously. We are so comfortable with _ **THE** _ game breaking element of Mafia, we don’t only allow it, we in fact demand it from certain players… But lose our shit if someone else does it. Someone who is vanilla town shouldn’t be afraid of claiming, at any point in time. Our game play as a group, should avoid this fourth rail\* at all costs. \*Fourth Rail. Like Third Rail, except not. The Third rail should also be avoided … But discussing Setup / J Sexton is … ((The Third Rail)) probably a fight I’ll lose. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1354 "2017-01-24T19:54:22Z")
Hey Prof. since you like being helpful, you wanna help me out? I want an overview of who, of the voters on brewha, ToeJam and Crys75 made any alternative cases, FOS’s or similar after brewha claimed his switch, how many they did and how elaborate they were. You’re allowed to say no, if so I’ll do it myself when I have time for it. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1355 "2017-01-24T19:54:52Z")
About six minutes to D3. > [@](#): > > The grey-eyed morn smiles on the frowning night, > Chequering the eastern clouds with streaks of light, > And flecked darkness like a drunkard reels > From forth day’s path and Titan’s fiery wheels: > Now, ere the sun advance his burning eye, > The day to cheer and night’s dank dew to dry, ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1356 "2017-01-24T19:57:19Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > Hey Prof. since you like being helpful, you wanna help me out? I want an overview of who, of the voters on brewha, ToeJam and Crys75 made any alternative cases, FOS’s or similar after brewha claimed his switch, how many they did and how elaborate they were. You’re allowed to say no, if so I’ll do it myself when I have time for it. That actually sounds like a plan. Here’s my deal: in the next half-hour or so I have company coming, and that will be the end of my participation here for Tuesday. If I get any time tomorrow, I’ll get on that. If you want it any sooner, you’ll need to do it yourself. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1357 "2017-01-24T19:57:25Z")
So instead of idle doing HUGE font claims, we have meeko doing HUGE fonts against claims. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1358 "2017-01-24T19:58:49Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > So instead of idle doing HUGE font claims, we have meeko doing HUGE fonts against claims. Great. I thought I borked the tags. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Crys75](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3da27b/32.png) [@Crys75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crys75)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1359 "2017-01-24T20:05:31Z")
> [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > Pardon me if I don’t entirely trust Crys’ posting of her own PM. > > I doubt the scum will do it for us. Hopefully the vig will, but that’s all complicated by Crys having the Vig switch (and god knows who else has the other vig switch.) I like the idea of using the second lynch for a day on them, rather than shooting blindly into the pool of players. I don’t have the vig switch…I have the bodyguard switch which is a scum power role Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Crys75](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3da27b/32.png) [@Crys75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crys75)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425/1360 "2017-01-24T20:07:24Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Brewha had the vig switch. Captain Klutz and Crys each claimed a switch that controls a [redacted] power. CKs was controlling a scum power role. I don’t know if Crys ever specified the alignment of the power they controlled. I did more than. Once lol Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425.md?page=67) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-reunion-day-two/777425.md?page=69)