# MAFIA: The Game - Ideal for Beginners \[Game in Progress\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [July 14, 2015, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099 "2015-07-14T00:45:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/601 "2015-07-27T14:15:10Z")
Because they aren’t playing the game. I don’t know what other conclusion to draw about it; it’s strategically useless so they’re either absent or malicious. **Johnny Bravo** , the vote in 562 is me, not **Prof. Pepperwinkle** , who was #552. Does that mean we’re now at 7? ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/602 "2015-07-27T14:15:30Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > Are you talking about **Jsexton**? I think the vote count is wrong, **Johnny Bravo** forgot the **Jimmy Chitwood** ’s vote on **TexCat**. It does strike me as a bit weird, but maybe he’s holding back a bit longer for whatever reason. I also think it’s a bit weird so few are involved in the discussion this late in the day. > > Mod: Storyteller, could we please get a vote count? We now have several conflicting ones and it’s adding to the confusion, at least for me. Corrected a mistake: he’s instead of they’re. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/603 "2015-07-27T14:21:01Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > **Johnny Bravo** , the vote in 562 is me, not **Prof. Pepperwinkle** , who was #552. Does that mean we’re now at 7? Damnit. I think I fixed it. If this one is wrong, I won’t make any other corrections and will just wait on the official count. **Texcat** (7): [del]Chronos (356/392)[/del], Chronos (437), Sangfroid (477), Plumpudding (480), Septimus (486), Prof. Pepperwinkle (552), Jimmy Chitwood (562) Thing Fish (591) **Septimus** (4): Johnny Bravo (460), [del]Texcat (461/577)[/del], DiggitCamara (490), Dante G (535), Texcat (589) jsexton (3): [del]Mahaloth (319/434)[/del], Mahaloth (446), Cygnus42 (459), Bayard (471), [del]Prof. Pepperwinkle (479/512)[/del] **Dante G** (2): [del]Mahaloth (214/319)[/del], [del]DiggitCamara (216/406)[/del], [del]Chronos (229/356))[/del], [del]Jimmy Chitwood (371/562)[/del], Biotop (476), Nonsuch (565) **Sangfroid** (1): [del]Dante G (217/308)[/del], Precambrianmollusc (411) **Thing Fish** (1): Sario (222) **Chronos** (0): [del]Thing Fish (240/398)[/del], [del]Jsexton (280/346)[/del], [del]Dante G (308/399)[/del] [del]Septimus (315/391)[/del], [del]Sario (410/494)[/del] **Precambrianmollusc** (0): [del]Plumpudding (254/400)[/del] **Sario** (0): [del]Thing Fish (443/591)[/del] **Plumpudding** (0): [del]Texcat (577/589)[/del] SELF VOTES (storyteller rulechange announcement comes at #436) !Septimus (391/449) Chronos (392/437) \*!Biotop (394/403) \*Prof. Pepperwinkle (395/429) \*!Texcat (396/452) \*!Bayard (397/441) Thing Fish (398/443) !Dante G (399/451) !Plumpudding (400/450) \*Cygnus42 (401/459) DiggitCamara (406/490) Mahaloth (434/446) \*did not have a vote in play prior to self vote !did not move vote elsewhere during un-self-voting ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/604 "2015-07-27T14:35:10Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > Are you talking about **Jsexton**? I think the vote count is wrong, **Johnny Bravo** forgot the **Jimmy Chitwood** ’s vote on **TexCat**. It does strike me as a bit weird, but maybe they’re holding back a bit longer for whatever reason. I also think it’s a bit weird so few are involved in the discussion this late in the day. > > Mod: Storyteller, could we please get a vote count? We now have several conflicting ones and it’s adding to the confusion, at least for me. Well, **Sario** voted a joke vote, which is really the same thing as no vote. ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/605 "2015-07-27T14:38:42Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > To be honest, I’m not sure myself. I believe it has, but I don’t know. I will state though, that she has become increasingly emotional in her posting, becoming more and more hysterical, while still failing to provide any kind of actual defense for herself. She isn’t becoming less suspicious in my mind, and heaping on her has prompted her to post even more posts that in my opinion is not helping her case at all. This is the sort of post I expect from scum who know that they led the mislynch on town. Suddenly he’s not sure himself. Read that as please don’t blame this on me and lynch me because of it. Then Plum says that I am hysterical and have not provided any sort of actual defense. That’s because there is no actual case. There is only Plum’s diatribe, and everytime I try to respond to his lies and mischaracterizations, he just responds with more and worse. When Biotop presented his original scheme, I thought it wouldn’t work because it gave scum the chance to identify all of the masons, and it had the potential of randomly killing our cop and doc. Then in the heat of trying to explain this, I forgot that the Alpha wolf was a godfather. I originally said and I still think it would have been a great scheme for midgame when our power roles and the masons were mostly known and there were fewer cats to herd. I think pointing out the risks in the plan was a townie thing to do, and I would do it again. It was an immediate gut and townie reaction to the plan. > [@Plumpudding](#): > > I agree. If she actually turns out to be town, I have really no idea for her motivations for playing as she has, and not necessarily the motivations some of my fellow voters either. Silent players not giving another reason than she being a lynch leader is not actually helping town here. Make your own cases, don’t just point to what other posters and say “those reasons and such”. At least try to add something. And Plum tries to shift the blame again. First onto me, then onto me everyone else. His entire case is lies and mischaracterization, what does he expect people to add? ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/606 "2015-07-27T14:39:50Z")
> [@](#): > > YOU have never pointed out why YOU believe Septimus to be scum. Well Plumpudding, you are correct, somewhat. I have never specifically said MY personal reasons for voting for Septimus, aside from me stating that I agreed with Johnny Bravo’s analysis a couple pages back. After rereading the thread, the main post that does strike me as being a scummy post is where Septimus decides to point the FOS at those who have voted for him. Pointing back at others is not a strong defense and from what I have seen, he hasn’t offered off much else to defend himself. That is my main reason for voting for him. I know that Texcat has a couple more votes compared to Septimus, but I feel that the votes for Tex are as a result of erratic posting and responses that come off as scummy. Much like the posts from myself earlier in the game that got suspicions tossed at me. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/607 "2015-07-27T14:40:01Z")
> [@Thing\_Fish](#): > > Like some others I haven’t been able to read the thread as thorougly as I would like. As I have said before, I found septimus’ behavior in the tiebreaker brouhaha quite pro-Town and Texcat’s not, so: > > \*\*unvote Sario > > vote TexCat[/B] Could you explain why? As in your reasons for switching your vote? > [@Mahaloth](#): > > My thoughts exactly. Septimus vs. Texcat may just be town v. town and the scum are loving it. That is always a possibility, and one that will always sit in the back of my mind. I still think \*reasoned \*votes **TexCat** will hold up under scrutiny, even if she’s town, as I can in no way understand how her play have been beneficial to town. Do you think she has been beneficial to town, other than to give us _a lot_ to suspect her for? And **Mahaloth** , what do you think about **Jsexton** , as far as I can tell, not having placed a vote yet? ---
**Author:** ![Cygnus42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Cygnus42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cygnus42)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/608 "2015-07-27T14:43:37Z")
My 2 cents, with a couple hours to go until end of Day. Re-reading the recent several pages, focusing on **Texcat** & **septimus** , since they are the current leaders - I don’t get a good scum feeling from **Texcat** - I think a lot of the case against her is based on her replies to some of the early self-voting schemes. While it’s useful to discuss the implications of all that - there were a few different proposed plans in the air, and trying to discuss the pluses and minuses of them was pretty reasonable. At the time, it was definitely tricky to figure out the implications of the options being proposed (I hope that makes sense…) I could be wrong, and it’s a wolf move trying to lead the town into a voting scheme that benefits the wolves more. I don’t think she has anything wolfish on the board, after the voting scheme died out though. For septimus - I get a slightly more scummy vibe. Both in being pretty defensive at being voted, and the statement in post #486 (sorry, not sure how to link, or quote properly): > [@](#): > > . Although I’m near the bottom of the player list, I feel that I’ve been more loquacious and aggressive than usual. When Scum, I’ll be the one pouting in the corner hoping nobody notices me. Saying effectively ‘I can’t be scum, I play differently as scum’ - while earlier saying that good players like **Chronos** play the same as town and scum (#315). Also, on review, kinda defending \*\* Dante G\*\* way back in post #259, while **Dante** was an early suspect - seems scummy in retrospect. So, of the two, I see **septimus** as a bit more wolfish. And…it’s taken me 40 minutes to write this. I’ll consider moving my vote over to **septimus** , but now I’m worried about causing a tie. Time to post and update the thread… ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/609 "2015-07-27T14:46:58Z")
I also do not understand **Precambrianmollusc** vote for **Sangfroid** , which absent reasoning seems just there the fill the need for a “cover-my-ass” blue post. ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/610 "2015-07-27T14:49:06Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > Could you explain why? As in your reasons for switching your vote? > That is always a possibility, and one that will always sit in the back of my mind. I still think \*reasoned \*votes **TexCat** will hold up under scrutiny, even if she’s town, as I can in no way understand how her play have been beneficial to town. Do you think she has been beneficial to town, other than to give us _a lot_ to suspect her for? > > And **Mahaloth** , what do you think about **Jsexton** , as far as I can tell, not having placed a vote yet? Oh, please, this is scummy as hell. I haven’t given town anything to suspect me for. You have. The entire case on me is hot air. You know it, and you are backpedaling and already looking for excuses for your vote. Scummy, scummy, and more scummy. \*\*unvote Septimus vote Plumpudding \*\* Voting for _ **whoever** _ I find the scummiest. I will be around before EOD and will move back to Septimus if town comes to their senses. But would prefer it if town came to their senses and voted Plum. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/611 "2015-07-27T14:54:44Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > This is the sort of post I expect from scum who know that they led the mislynch on town. Suddenly he’s not sure himself. Read that as please don’t blame this on me and lynch me because of it. No, I’m quite sure of myself, as I’m keeping my vote on you. I can’t say I _know_, because I _don’t_. > [@TexCat](#): > > Then Plum says that I am hysterical and have not provided any sort of actual defense. That’s because there is no actual case. There is only Plum’s diatribe, and everytime I try to respond to his lies and mischaracterizations, he just responds with more and worse. Could you go back and answer all my questions please? If you’re actually town, could you calm down, go back and read what I’ve said and write a level-headed response? > [@TexCat](#): > > When Biotop presented his original scheme, I thought it wouldn’t work because it gave scum the chance to identify all of the masons, and it had the potential of randomly killing our cop and doc. Then in the heat of trying to explain this, I forgot that the Alpha wolf was a godfather. I originally said and I still think it would have been a **great scheme for midgame** when our power roles and the masons were mostly known and there were fewer cats to herd. When it is a lot less beneficial to use for town. Lot’s of people repeatedly provided you with reasons for why it would be beneficial to town to use it as early as possible, why it isn’t such a big deal to reveal masons in such a scheme and why a miniscule chance for our power-roles to be randomly NK’d does not negate any of that. > [@TexCat](#): > > I think pointing out the risks in the plan was a townie thing to do, and I would do it again. It was an immediate gut and townie reaction to the plan. Pointing out risks? In the end the plan was basically a win for town, if everyone would have followed it. You even rode underneath the whole thing, which to me(I may be reading too much into this one, but I’m not discounting it.) made it look like you were trying to avoid more heat. > [@TexCat](#): > > And Plum tries to shift the blame again. First onto me, then onto me everyone else. His entire case is lies and mischaracterization, what does he expect people to add? Haha, wow. Yeah, I’m not blaming your situation on anyone other than yourself and I never have. I just like to know **WHY** people place votes, since their \*\*SILENCE \*\*makes it harder for all of us to determine what side they’re on, regardless of the vote. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/612 "2015-07-27T14:55:26Z")
Unvote Dante G. Vote septimus Time to put my money where my mouth is, I guess. I still think **Dante G** is indicated by his posts as scum. But I want my vote to matter. ---
**Author:** ![Sario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sario/32/18580_2.png) [@Sario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sario)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/613 "2015-07-27T14:58:01Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Well, **Sario** voted a joke vote, which is really the same thing as no vote. My vote history thus far:[222](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18533657&postcount=222), [296](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18536505&postcount=296), [410](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18542044&postcount=410), [494](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18547807&postcount=494) ---
**Author:** ![Cygnus42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Cygnus42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cygnus42)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/614 "2015-07-27T15:02:34Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > Voting for _ **whoever** _ I find the scummiest. I will be around before EOD and will move back to Septimus if town comes to their senses. But would prefer it if town came to their senses and voted Plum. I think it’s a bit late to get votes going on **Plum** - I’d rather see votes stay on **septimus** for today. I do still think **JSexton** is vote-worthy, but that vote is pretty meaningless right now. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/615 "2015-07-27T15:03:35Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > Oh, please, this is scummy as hell. I haven’t given town anything to suspect me for. You have. The entire case on me is hot air. You know it, and you are backpedaling and already looking for excuses for your vote. Scummy, scummy, and more scummy. > > \*\*unvote Septimus > vote Plumpudding > \*\* > > Voting for _ **whoever** _ I find the scummiest. I will be around before EOD and will move back to Septimus if town comes to their senses. But would prefer it if town came to their senses and voted Plum. A poster that early on came with very little substance, then began opposing a plan that after some work became more or less guaranteed to work, while avoiding to answer questions for several pages, then defending herself with histrionics and direct smudging, now trying to shift the blame over to her most vocal voter… that is scummy behaviour. Why would any town behave like that? ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/616 "2015-07-27T15:05:18Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Unvote Dante G. > Vote septimus > > Time to put my money where my mouth is, I guess. I still think **Dante G** is indicated by his posts as scum. But I want my vote to matter. Talk to me about this. I think we’re in the same boat - I’ve been going back and forth here, and I also don’t want to effectively waste a vote. I think not too long ago you thought **TexCat** was more likely than **septimus** to be scum, no? ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/617 "2015-07-27T15:05:54Z")
> [@Sario](#): > > My vote history thus far:[222](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18533657&postcount=222), [296](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18536505&postcount=296), [410](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18542044&postcount=410), [494](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18547807&postcount=494) Sorry about my poor post then. My apologies. I guess absent an official vote count we are going to have to do our best with the unofficial tallies. ---
**Author:** ![Sario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sario/32/18580_2.png) [@Sario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sario)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/618 "2015-07-27T15:10:54Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Sorry about my poor post then. My apologies. I guess absent an official vote count we are going to have to do our best with the unofficial tallies. No apologies needed, its good for Town to call out those that may be trying to skate by. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/619 "2015-07-27T15:18:01Z")
> [@Plumpudding](#): > > Could you go back and answer all my questions please? If you’re actually town, could you calm down, go back and read what I’ve said and write a level-headed response? Physician, heal thyself! I’m gonna be honest, **TexCat** ’s defense is starting to look more and more Towny (and this after I said a couple pages ago that the initial case is more important than the response to it, if anyone’s tracking hypocrisies) in the face of what seems to me to be pretty unreasonable doggedness on your part. I’m starting to feel like I fucked up. I just don’t have a good case against **septimus** , either. **Unvote Texcat Vote Dario G** for now. Anybody want to come with me on that one, or convince me in a different direction? ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099/620 "2015-07-27T15:20:15Z")
Er, that’s **Vote Dante G** It’s really rude of you guys to have names that I don’t remember correctly [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-game-ideal-for-beginners-game-in-progress/725099.md?page=32)