# MAFIA: The Road to Canterbury - Game Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 21, 2012, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807 "2012-06-21T01:57:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![fubbleskag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fubbleskag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fubbleskag)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/321 "2012-07-02T15:51:27Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > Minor correction: If \*\*Visorslash \*\*(or anyone else) was poisoned, it will be _The Physician_ who will be notified. Actually, it appears that both the doctor and the victim will be notified: > [@The Asp's Venom Write-up](#): > > if the Doctor is alive (whether the Doctor is Town or Scum), the poisoned victim will become aware of his/her predicament at Daybreak > [@The Physician's Role PM](#): > > NOTE: Whether you choose to bring along the antivenom or not, as long as you are alive you will see the signs at Dawn if any player is poisoned in the Night. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/322 "2012-07-02T16:02:38Z")
> [@Enderw24](#): > > What I find really interesting is how on D1, everyone was telling all three investigators “for God’s sake, investigate on N1!” > Now D2 dawns and the build up seems to be “For God’s sakes investigators, don’t tell anyone about your investigations on N1!” What specifically do you find interesting about it? ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/323 "2012-07-02T16:26:47Z")
> [@Stanislaus](#): > > What specifically do you find interesting about it? Well I haven’t done an analysis of who said what when , but I think we’d find something revealing if we look at those who advocated for all investigators to investigate N1 and compare it to those who are now advocating that investigators not say anything. For instance, if you’re currently advocating that investigators not reveal themselves and on D1 your position was for investigators to not investigate (either all of them or any of them), that shows a pattern of wanting town to remain in the dark. ---
**Author:** ![gnarlycharlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@gnarlycharlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnarlycharlie)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/324 "2012-07-02T16:48:14Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > I don’t see anything in the rules that states the scum are limited to the use of one tool per night. It just says they can be used by any member of the brotherhood. If that’s correct, they’d have no reason to use poison and forego use of a knife. > > This argument doesn’t hold up. The only sensible time for scum to use the cloak would be on night one, before the investigators act. **gnarlycharlie** ’s post is odd and doesn’t address my point, but “we may never know a good time to use it” makes no sense if he is referring to the cloak.The dilemma for scum is choosing a good target for the cloak. indeed, i should have used _them_ not _it_. now, to clarify, i meant that we won’t really know when it’s a good time to investigate. we won’t know when the Cloak is in play. my belief was that scum would prefer to use the Cloak later in the game when there are less places for them to hide, especially if they think that the investigators will delay the use of their powers. but after rereading the the Cloak’s description i realize my error. it’s not a one Night thing. it stays until the bearer is killed. the Cloak will therefore be likely used on N1. i 'm guessing it will be on a scum rather than a townie. > [@Enderw24](#): > > I’m back from vacation. Huzzah. > > Interesting non-turn of events. There are three possibilities on what happened that immediately occur to me, though they’ve already been brought up by previous posters. > > What I find really interesting is how on D1, everyone was telling all three investigators “for God’s sake, investigate on N1!” > Now D2 dawns and the build up seems to be “For God’s sakes investigators, don’t tell anyone about your investigations on N1!” no, it means you don’t tell until later in the Day so there is discussion first. > [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > By my count, 8 (out of 19) people voted for **Visorslash** , so yes; it’s probable that some of them were Scum. But there’s nothing unusual about that; there’s almost always at least one or two Scum on a Day 1 lynch it seems. In any case, it’s not a rare occurrence. The question that \*\*gnarly’s \*\*comment inspires is: Is it better to hunt for Scum on the Visorslash bandwagon, or off of it? > > Excluding Visorslash himself, there are 18 players in this game. Seven of them voted to lynch him (since he also voted for himself), so that’s 39% of the Town that were on the wagon. So it seems that if there were two or more Scum on the Visorslash bandwagon, then we’d have better luck hunting for Scum there; if there was only one, then our odds are better hunting in the rest of the Town. > > I would agree that “There were probably Scum on the wagon, so we should try to find them there” is an ‘obvious’ strategy, whether right or wrong in this instance, so it’s not unlikely that a townie would suggest it. On the other hand, scum would know exactly what the chances were of an Investigator finding Scum on that bandwagon, so I could certainly see them attempting to steer the Town in that direction if it were to their advantage. > > I’m not calling out gnarly as Scum at this point, but it is something to think about. I will freely admit that I am always suspicious of anyone who attempts to direct Town powers, so I can’t claim to be entirely objective in the matter. _directing_ IMO is not the appropriate term. i don’t have any coercive power. i was just making my sentiments known. now it’s tempting to vote for **Texcat** but i see the argument why it is likelier she is town. i will **Vote Snickers** for [the same reasons as in D1](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15217777&postcount=254). ---
**Author:** ![fubbleskag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fubbleskag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fubbleskag)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/325 "2012-07-02T16:48:28Z")
ignore this, trying to clear out my quote queue well that didn’t work worth shit… ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/326 "2012-07-02T16:56:02Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > 1. I didn’t back away from anything. I pointed out that my initial vote on \*\*Visorslash \*\*was based on a relatively thin lead, that I expected at the time that I would probably reconsider later in the Day, but that his continued absence had changed my mind and left me more convinced of his guilt. Sure, I was wrong, but I backed away from nothing. If anything, I reinforced my initial feelings. > 2. Defensive? Not really. My problem with \*\*sinjin’s \*\*post was not \*that \*he pointed out the flaws in several of the arguments against Visorslash, it was _the way_ he did it. “Sorry I wasn’t around, but here’s where you guys all screwed up” just rubbed me the wrong way. In retrospect I can see where my tone was a bit harsh, but I don’t get defensive. I’ve made way too many bad votes to start worrying about them now. My intent when I posted was not to say “here’s where you guys all screwed up,” it was to point out that I thought your votes were scummy. I am surprised you took it as a personal slam and I’m sorry if that’s the way I came across. However I still find Mhaye’s vote the scummiest of the three so once again; **vote Mhaye** ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/327 "2012-07-02T17:00:48Z")
On reporting any night results, I agree it’s a good idea to hold off a bit for now. If an investigator has a positive result on scum, that could wait until a few hours before the lynch, provided the investigator can be certain they’ll be around on that day. For any other info, it’s a balance between giving scum a chance to incriminate themselves, and giving town enough time to review it properly before end of Day. It’s frustrating for everyone when there is likely to be some shiny info to share, but it’s probably the best play for town. The best result for town is if **Visorslash** is not _The Pardoner_. That would give us one confirmed (Visor) and a semi-confirmed (whoever claims _Pardoner_). The scum would have had to burn _The Momento_ in order to save him. (_The Pardoner_ would probably be the worst role for scum to be assigned, as they could only fake-claim by performing a public pro-town action, losing a tool in the process. And even then, the fake claim would be discoverable, if _The Clerk_ checks _The Momento_’s status). Second best result for us is if **Visorslash** is _The Pardoner_ (seems very likely), and _The Canon_ recharged him during the Night. That would semi-confirm _The Canon_ (see point about _The Momento_ above), and give town another use of the pardon. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/328 "2012-07-02T17:13:35Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > On reporting any night results, I agree it’s a good idea to hold off a bit for now. If an investigator has a positive result on scum, that could wait until a few hours before the lynch, provided the investigator can be certain they’ll be around on that day. Waiting until two hours before the lynch is a terrible idea. How much longer do you guys want want for potential investigator results? This Day is much shorter than yesterDay, ending Thursday between 1 and 5 pm eastern. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/329 "2012-07-02T17:54:30Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > The best result for town is if **Visorslash** is not _The Pardoner_. That would give us one confirmed (Visor) and a semi-confirmed (whoever claims _Pardoner_). The scum would have had to burn _The Momento_ in order to save him. (_The Pardoner_ would probably be the worst role for scum to be assigned, as they could only fake-claim by performing a public pro-town action, losing a tool in the process. And even then, the fake claim would be discoverable, if _The Clerk_ checks _The Momento_’s status). > > Second best result for us is if **Visorslash** is _The Pardoner_ (seems very likely), and _The Canon_ recharged him during the Night. That would semi-confirm _The Canon_ (see point about _The Momento_ above), and give town another use of the pardon. I think the chances that Scum would use the Momento in order to perform a pro-town action are so exceedingly small, I’d mark it at zero for all consideration purposes. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/330 "2012-07-02T17:59:47Z")
Also, I’m going to vote Snickers. Something pinged my radar yesterDay. That ping hasn’t been alleviated with the passage of time. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/331 "2012-07-02T18:43:15Z")
Reveals help town more than scum, so I’ll start. I am the summoner. I watched Suburban Plankton last night. He did not visit anyone and nobody visited him. The reason I chose to watch Plankton is that he managed to avoid almost any scrutiny on Day 1. I figured if scum were going to use a tool on Night 1, they’d pick the scum who had the least suspicion cast upon them to do it. I did not (and still do not) have any particular lean on Suburban Plankton one way or the other. I know it’s not much to go on, but hopefully this will help kickstart the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/332 "2012-07-02T19:05:44Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > I can’t imagine the Scum forgoing their Kill. I know it’s often talked about as a possible strategy move, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen it. I had initially agreed, but might there not be one good scum strategy to a Night One no-kill? If I’m not mistaken, this is the first game where scum have a finite number of nightkills at their disposal. If they think the game will last awhile, then they might have decided to skip killing the first Night when they’re more likely to be blocked/watched, instead opting to all lay low. Not a crazy idea, really… > [@Enderw24](#): > > What I find really interesting is how on D1, everyone was telling all three investigators “for God’s sake, investigate on N1!” > Now D2 dawns and the build up seems to be “For God’s sakes investigators, don’t tell anyone about your investigations on N1!” _Is_ anyone saying that? Or are they saying “Don’t reveal your results until later in the Day”? > [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > On reporting any night results, I agree it’s a good idea to hold off a bit for now. If an investigator has a positive result on scum, that could wait until a few hours before the lynch, provided the investigator can be certain they’ll be around on that day. I’d suggest revealing 24 hours before the Day can end, since we have people from around the world in the game. And on preview, those last two are kind of moot now… ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/333 "2012-07-02T21:16:59Z")
**Unvote Enderw24** (not sure if votes persist overnight) I’m still mildly suspicious of him, but he is getting into scumhunting more now, and he isn’t my preferred lynch. **Vote MHaye** As I said in [this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15212813&postcount=227), I find it strange **MHaye** would go from advocating the importance of the lynch to considering no-lynch. His response [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15217170&postcount=250) sidesteps my question, what changed his mind? Strikes me as possible scum forgetfulness of his earlier post. Scum are more likely than town to make this kind of mistake, as they don’t have the same investment in the arguments they are making. He makes a vote for **Visorslash** in the same post, which he says is weak. His follow-up review turns up [nothing](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15218475&postcount=265) worth voting for, and he has no observations to share. > [@sinjin](#): > > Waiting until two hours before the lynch is a terrible idea. How much longer do you guys want want for potential investigator results? This Day is much shorter than yesterDay, ending Thursday between 1 and 5 pm eastern. All we need for a positive investigation reveal is enough time to get the lynch votes down. A premature reveal of scum would kill off discussion for the Day. Two hours would be cutting it a bit fine, which is why I suggested a few. For any other info, I’m going to do a u-turn. Ideally, everyone would have a vote down before any reveals, but that’s looking unlikely to happen. As you say, we are running short of time, so my preference would be to have any results sooner rather than later. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/334 "2012-07-02T22:33:34Z")
**@Mosier** - Did you submit your action early or late in the Night (I’m aware it would make no difference to game mechanics, I have another reason for asking). > [@fubbleskag](#): > > 06-23-2012, 8:44 PM. I was in the shower, washing my face, which I do after washing my hair but before washing the rest of myself. Except my feet, I never wash those. I don’t have a “smell feet” night power, so I have no way of confirming this. **@fubbleskag** - Poorly worded on my part, I’m interested in what changed your mind. > [@Enderw24](#): > > I think the chances that Scum would use the Momento in order to perform a pro-town action are so exceedingly small, I’d mark it at zero for all consideration purposes. If _The Pardoner_ is scum, they would have to choose between fake-claiming and accepting that that player is doomed once town mass-claims. They would have to balance the pro-town aspect against the loss of a quarter of their team. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/335 "2012-07-02T23:22:55Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > **@Mosier** - Did you submit your action early or late in the Night (I’m aware it would make no difference to game mechanics, I have another reason for asking). In between. It was Friday evening. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/336 "2012-07-02T23:36:05Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > In between. It was Friday evening. Thanks for the quick response. I’m going to hold off commenting on **Mosier** ’s claim for the time being, as I’m very interested to hear what other players think of it. ---
**Author:** ![Visorslash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ee59a6/32.png) [@Visorslash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Visorslash)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/337 "2012-07-02T23:55:09Z")
**Vote: TexCat** I am not convinced she is town. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2012, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/338 "2012-07-03T00:12:46Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > Thanks for the quick response. > > I’m going to hold off commenting on **Mosier** ’s claim for the time being, as I’m very interested to hear what other players think of it. I can confirm that I did not visit anyone last Night. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/339 "2012-07-03T00:20:04Z")
> [@Visorslash](#): > > **Vote: TexCat** > > I am not convinced she is town. Would you care to expand upon that? Because “I’m not convinced [player] is Town” is something that pretty much everyone in this game could say about pretty much everyone else (with the exception of yourself) right now, I’d think… ---
**Author:** ![MentalGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/439d5e/32.png) [@MentalGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MentalGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2012, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807/340 "2012-07-03T01:16:14Z")
First, want to say good job to Visorslash for the fine play. I look forward to seeing what his thoughts are for the Day. > [@Snickers](#): > > Because it’s so wishy washy - it’s not taking any kind of stance at all. It’s barely making a case. Yes, it’s Day1, and that sucks. But that’s no reason to flip flop back and forth, all in one post. And your last line reads to me like you’re seeking other players approval for your vote. I find that scummy. > > You’re kind of doing it again. You were OK with **Visorslash** ’s lynch before, and you leaned even more in that direction with more info. But you ended up voting for me, which is fine. Yet you’d switch your vote back to \*\*Visorslash \*\*to avoid a no-lynch. Which might also be fine, but you placed your vote when it’s patently obvious that no-lynch isn’t going to happen and when the wagon’s already running away on **Visorslash**. It just looks to me like you’re trying to avoid jumping on a wagon and playing both sides while you’re at it. Apologies if you think this is mischaracterizing you; it’s just how it came across. As for not taking a stance of any kind, I voted for you. How is that not taking a stance. Yes, I was considering other possibilities and I would have been doing that whether I wrote them down here or not. I will concede a bit of a point when you say I was barely making a case. My case was fairly simple. I thought your reaction to Stanislaus was an attempt at misdirection. You ranted about the third vote principle, which was just a parenthetical remark by Stanislaus. You did not seem to pay as much attention to the rest of his case. And although I had already voted by the time you responded to me, I also thought your response tried to make me look as bad as possible so you would have some reason to vote against me. Even though my case is simple and doesn’t rely on a lot of different actions by you, I consider your actions the scummiest I have seen. > [@gnarlycharlie](#): > > we may never know a good time to use it. _shrugs_ I must say when I was catching up and read this, I had the same reaction as Texcat. I thought it had to be a scum slip. Reading on, though, I see at least three other players do not necessarily think it is. I doubt all three of gnarly’s scum buddies would be coming to his defense. So, while I thought it was a definite scum slip, I have to concede that it is apparently not as clear cut as I thought. > [@Stanislaus](#): > > And we’re off to a flyer! > > Can I suggest that if anybody does have any results from last Night that they want to share toDay, that they hold their fire until discussion is well underway? If Scum know from the beginning that that a given player has a “investigated as Town”, “investigated as Scum”, “was seen last Night” label attached, they’ll behave accordingly. If that label gets attached once they’ve already interacted with said player, the response will be much more telling. I like this suggestion. > [@Enderw24](#): > > Also, I’m going to > vote Snickers. > > Something pinged my radar yesterDay. That ping hasn’t been alleviated with the passage of time. Obviously, I find Snickers suspicious since I voted him(her?), but could you expound on what pinged you. > [@Visorslash](#): > > **Vote: TexCat** > > I am not convinced she is town. I am not really convinced anyone except you and me is Town. Is it because she was advocating the no-lynch? Anyway, I find Snickers still the most suspicious, so **Vote Snickers** I only plan on placing a single vote, but my next choice would be MHaye for the reasons sinjin gave, especially the late in the Day vote on the wagon leader. After that, it would be gnarly because I am not convinced that his statement was not a scum slip. I think Suburban would be the next on my list for the reasons given by Stanislaus. I have sat down to write this post about a half dozen times today, but have been interrupted everytime. I apologize for not showing up till a bit late in the Day. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-road-to-canterbury-game-thread/625807.md?page=18)