# Mafia: The Thrill of the Chase \[Newbie Friendly!\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 20, 2011, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526 "2011-11-20T06:04:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/381 "2011-12-02T18:33:41Z")
From earlier: > [@Trepa\_Mayfield](#): > > > [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > > > **Can we talk strategy at Night?** > > Yes. ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/382 "2011-12-02T19:09:52Z")
Well then a) raise a beer to our departed Fisha b) interesting that scum were happy to have the lynch candidate settled by a random choice by the mod My conclusion is either scum knew all 3 of the candidates were town or b scum were largely absent from the voting To be honest I don’t know if I would have switched my vote from Wevets to Fisha to save myself, although based on the somewhat flimsy reasoning that scum didn’t try and sway the vote away from a tie gives wevets a town lean from me. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/383 "2011-12-02T19:26:40Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > My conclusion is either scum knew all 3 of the candidates were town > or b scum were largely absent from the voting Or C) one of them is scum and the scum team was okay with a 1 in 3 chance and didn’t want to call attention to themselves by breaking the tie by voting for a townie. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/384 "2011-12-02T19:53:04Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Or C) one of them is scum and the scum team was okay with a 1 in 3 chance and didn’t want to call attention to themselves by breaking the tie by voting for a townie. A tie like this is really a scum advantage in any case. > [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > To be honest I don’t know if I would have switched my vote from Wevets to Fisha to save myself, although based on the somewhat flimsy reasoning that scum didn’t try and sway the vote away from a tie gives wevets a town lean from me. Perhaps. But last-minute vote swings look bad, especially to a town candidate, and there’s all kinds of other reasons they wouldn’t want to. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one in three were scum. As a scum player I definitely wouldn’t charge in with a last minute vote to save a comrade on Day One – what I would expect, and indeed have experienced (as Town), would be the town to turn on me, and lynch me. If I came up rotten, the question would be who I saved, and that means they’re going to get another scum in the next two days too. It’s not a good strategy for scum to play so heedlessly early, particularly at what is not really that bad of a risk (1 in 3 chance of losing 1 in 4?ish scum). Even if they wanted to, not everyone’s around at the end of the Day to optimize votes anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/385 "2011-12-02T20:05:29Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > But last-minute vote swings look bad, especially to a town candidate, and there’s all kinds of other reasons they wouldn’t want to. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if one in three were scum. As a scum player I definitely wouldn’t charge in with a last minute vote to save a comrade on Day One – what I would expect, and indeed have experienced (as Town), would be the town to turn on me, and lynch me. If I came up rotten, the question would be who I saved, and that means they’re going to get another scum in the next two days too. It’s not a good strategy for scum to play so heedlessly early, particularly at what is not really that bad of a risk (1 in 3 chance of losing 1 in 4?ish scum). > > Even if they wanted to, not everyone’s around at the end of the Day to optimize votes anyway. > [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > To be honest I don’t know if I would have switched my vote from Wevets to Fisha to save myself, although based on the somewhat flimsy reasoning that scum didn’t try and sway the vote away from a tie gives wevets a town lean from me. Am I not getting something? I realize that (as per **FluidDruid** ’s post quoted above) last minute votes and vote shifts may be suspicious, but if it concerns one of the people that is at risk themselves it has to be more understandable, no? Consider this: Precambrianmollusc (3): septimus, wevets, fubbleskag fisha (3): Silver Jan, MentalGuy, Inner Stickler wevets (3): Fluiddruid, Precambrianmollusc, Astral Rejection If **Precambrian** had come in, changing his vote from **wevets** to **fisha** , claiming that at least he is more sure of his own townness than of fishas, that 1) would have broken the tie; 2) would have given **Precambrian** the chance to singlehandedly vastly reduce the odds of his own demise (especially since as \*\*FluidDruid \*\*points out, there’s not that many people around to influence the vote count anyway). I was expecting him to come in before the Day was over, and the more I’m thinking about it, the more amazed I am that he did not. I’m not sure what the implications of all of this are, but it sure is puzzling. ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/386 "2011-12-02T20:30:30Z")
Svejk - i did point out several post up I could have saved myself, two reasons 1. Metagame reason - I wasn’t around, been down with a lurgy and loaded up on medication 2. If I had been I don’t think I was sure If I should definitely consign someone who I had a town lean on to death, pretty much trying to balance my known (to me status) against their unknown status or run the risk of me being lynched balanced against the possibility of wevets being lynched , who I had a slight (very very slight but what’s one to do on day one) scum read on. all of which is post event thinking as I wasn’t around to switch my vote. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/387 "2011-12-02T20:38:41Z")
So essentially risking your own death in order to potentially save **fisha** at the expense of **wevets** (or yourself). Very noble 😃 hope you feel better soon! ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/388 "2011-12-02T20:52:00Z")
Well that’s just the noble kind of guy that I am ! 😉 I will resort to drinking the rest of the night as scum are no doubt watching for any extra info in order to help them decide who to kill. What ever happened to the barman who made the theme based cocktails? ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/389 "2011-12-02T21:31:02Z")
Oh crap, sorry you guys. I misread when EOD was and didn’t get a vote in. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/390 "2011-12-02T21:37:27Z")
> [@Silver\_Jan](#): > > Ok, I have to set you right about fluff, I haven’t had a lot of time on my hands with Mr Silver Jan having cancer and all (the op was a success) and I am not a very good nurse ☹ I have been reading posts and then hit reply and think “what was I going to write?” I have also been sober this entire game lol Give me time, after a bottle of wine or 2 I will start talking crap again 🙂 > > Going to read to the end now. [oog] Glad Mr SilverJan’s operation was a success 🙂 Hope you’ll be back posting with “wine in front of you” soon;) [/oog] ---
**Author:** ![Scathach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Scathach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scathach)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/391 "2011-12-02T21:49:10Z")
> [@gnarlycharlie](#): > > i’ll let this pass since you haven’t played much and likely haven’t experienced conflicts between RL and mafia. sometimes RL gets in the way of playing. we’ve only been missing for most of a Day. we usually give each other a little slack for that. it would be different if we were gone for several Days. you should play with Captain Pinkies. you’d probably have choice words for him. In fairness, she has a point. I don’t disagree that RL can get in the way, but as a townie lynched out of a three way tie I can see how it’s irritating to have 5 people not vote. And as it happens, I would probably have voted PCM, which would have saved her. (Although the fact that he could have voted to save himself and didn’t makes me lean town on him now:smack:) Actually, the fact that the tie was left happen makes me think that all three candidates are more likely to be town. Well, all two now I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/392 "2011-12-02T22:05:31Z")
I’m inclined to also believe this. I’d like to hear (as I’ve indicated above in post 373) from the people who created the standoff: **Fubbleskag** (post #359) and **Astral Rejection** (post #364). I also wonder how come not a single poster saw fit to break the tie. I understand that many of us might have been in the same boat that I was in myself: I just did not know and did not want to risk casting the final condemning vote when I was not entirely sure. Still, others might have had more of a read on **wevets** , **fisha** , and **Precambrian**. **Special Ed** , for instance, pointed an FOS at \*\*fisha \*\*in post #301, why did he not step in? Looking back, we know that \*\*fisha \*\*got lynched anyway and that \*\*Ed \*\*was wrong to suspect her, but there was a time when we did not know that. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/393 "2011-12-02T22:27:39Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > I’d like to hear (as I’ve indicated above in post 373) from the people who created the standoff: **Fubbleskag** (post #359) and **Astral Rejection** (post #364). What would you like to hear from me? I voted for who I thought was scum, and laid out what I think is a pretty compelling case. With 10 hours left in the day, I hoped to sway someone into voting for him. It’s hard for me to play at work, so I didn’t have a chance to check in or change my vote if need be. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/394 "2011-12-02T22:38:18Z")
Big sigh. Go town! Spoiler thread? ---
**Author:** ![gnarlycharlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@gnarlycharlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnarlycharlie)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/395 "2011-12-03T02:34:54Z")
> [@Scathach](#): > > In fairness, she has a point. I don’t disagree that RL can get in the way, but as a townie lynched out of a three way tie I can see how it’s irritating to have 5 people not vote. And as it happens, I would probably have voted PCM, which would have saved her. (Although the fact that he could have voted to save himself and didn’t makes me lean town on him now:smack:) > > Actually, the fact that the tie was left happen makes me think that all three candidates are more likely to be town. Well, all two now I guess. in retrospect, it was indeed a tense situation of which i was unaware of when i logged in. i now understand the reason for the frustration. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/396 "2011-12-03T03:30:53Z")
Ave Atque Vale, **fisha**. > [@Svejk\_1](#): > > I also wonder how come not a single poster saw fit to break the tie. I understand that many of us might have been in the same boat that I was in myself: I just did not know and did not want to risk casting the final condemning vote when I was not entirely sure. Still, others might have had more of a read on **wevets** , **fisha** , and **Precambrian**. **Special Ed** , for instance, pointed an FOS at \*\*fisha \*\*in post #301, why did he not step in? Looking back, we know that \*\*fisha \*\*got lynched anyway and that \*\*Ed \*\*was wrong to suspect her, but there was a time when we did not know that. I’m basically in your shoes, **Švejk** ; firstly, I didn’t have any read on any of the three that was stronger in one way or another, although now that I think about it, maybe **fisha** pinged me _less_ because of my mild suspicions of **Inner Stickler** , which were only half-serious. And **Inner** was the last one to vote for **fisha** , so by the transitive property, if I’d really really had a strong feeling that **Inner** was scum, I’d’ve been worried that he was going after a Townie. But my thoughts weren’t strong enough for that. Plus, there was only a 33% chance that **fisha** was gonna be the lynchee. BTW, did we ever learn how ties are resolved? Lemme ask officially: **Trepa? Have you said how ties get resolved?** Anyway, to be honest, re: your comment about **special ed** – to be frank, he _always_ seems scummy to me. (If “twice” counts as “always.”) I think it’s just his posting style, though. There just aren’t enough clues either way for me yet. It’s kinda like **septimus** – my knowledge of his scummitude during the last game (he was Godfather) shade my beliefs of him in this game, because one has nothing to do with the other. It’s hard to do, though. (I’d imagine this gets easier with more games under one’s belt.) On a different topic, I have some mechanics questions if that’s okay. What exactly happens at Night, anyway? In the last game, we couldn’t talk strategy, so obviously that doesn’t apply here – we can chat away to our hearts’ content. But since scum can apparently talk/strategize during the daytime anyway, why do Nights take so long? I mean presumably they already know whom they’re going after, right? I guess if whoever’s lynched was gonna be their target, they’d have to reconsider their options, but still, for three/four days? What the heck are they doing all that time, sacrificing goats or something? And what about people with super-de-dooper powers (on either side)? Are they supposed to enact them blindly or at any particular time, or does the game mod contact them as the Night ends? Or does it differ in each game depending on the rules? ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/397 "2011-12-03T03:33:19Z")
ARGH darn this anti-editing rule. For: > [@dumbchoie](#): > > It’s kinda like septimus – my knowledge of his scummitude during the last game (he was Godfather) shade my beliefs of him in this game, because one has nothing to do with the other. Please read as: > [@slightlysmarterchoie](#): > > It’s kinda like septimus – I’m trying not to let my knowledge of his scummitude during the last game (he was Godfather) shade my beliefs of him in this game, because one has nothing to do with the other. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/398 "2011-12-03T03:56:42Z")
> [@choie](#): > > I mean presumably they already know whom they’re going after, right? I guess if whoever’s lynched was gonna be their target, they’d have to reconsider their options, but still, for three/four days? What the heck are they doing all that time, sacrificing goats or something? > > And what about people with super-de-dooper powers (on either side)? Are they supposed to enact them blindly or at any particular time, or does the game mod contact them as the Night ends? Or does it differ in each game depending on the rules? Generally the mod has decided on a role resolution order, say, roleblocks trump kills trump everything else. Then all they have to do is collect all the actions from all the players and plug them in the right slots and voila. Now the real question is how subtle do you think we think you are. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/399 "2011-12-03T04:00:20Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspaña](#): > > Was your vote on fluiddruid a me- too vote? Nope. It was a vote for who I thought was a lurker, who happened to be first on an alphabetical list **Svejk** posted. I unvoted quickly after **fluiddruid** began participation. > [@GuiriEnEspaña](#): > > Do you think Precambrian is scum? How do you reconcile your vote with your evaluation of the other votes on the same player? Not anymore, although I thought he might be. I reconcile my vote with the evaluation of the other votes for the same player because they’re for fundamentally different reasons. Others voted for **Precambrianmollusc** because of something he said. I voted for him because his vote didn’t seem to be about scum/town, but about stopping people from suggesting someone to vote for (and given what happened after **fubbleskag** tried to abstain, it looks like _everyone_ should be voting for someone.) Lynching someone with 3 votes is going to make it potentially really easy for scum to control the lynching in addition to the night kill. In retrospect, this was a silly thing to do on my part. I would have been much better off heeding **Inner Stickler’s** advice from post #152. It really does look like people get lynched on Day 1 for the flimsiest of reasons. But more on that issue in my response to **Astral Rejection** … > [@Astral Rejection](#): > > Upon rereading this thread, I’ve decided I don’t like this post. Cases 1-7 “do not appeal” to wevets. Two of these cases (4 and 6) involve voting for Precambrianmollusc. Wevets says that I voted for Precam because Precam voted for Svejk, which isn’t a very good recap of my reason, but that’s another issue. The point is, wevets attributes a reason to my vote (Because Precam voted for Svejk) and then states that my vote doesn’t appeal to him. > > Fast forward 3 paragraphs, and we see wevets vote for Precam himself, because Precam voted for Svejk. In one paragraph, wevets finds this distasteful. In another, he uses it to justify his own vote for Precambrianmollusc. Let’s look at the evidence offered in those cases: 1. **Astral Rejection** voted for **precambrianmollusc** for voting for **Svejk** (post #193) > [@Astral Rejection](#): > > I’m gonna toss out an early vote for Precambrian. > > Vote Precambrianmollusc. > > The “so he claims” doesn’t sit right with me. Švejk is a new player, and that early vote doesn’t strike me as disingenuous in any way. Precambrian seems to be tossing in an extra tiny little jab that isn’t truly warranted. So the basis for this vote seems to be that **Svejk** is new, it’s probably random, and suspicion on the phrase “so he claims.” I don’t believe anyone can effectively tell the difference between scum or town making a little comment like that. It actually seems as if a better way to explain **Astral Rejection** ’s vote is to say that **Precambrian** voted for **Svejk** because **Svejk** was daring enough to throw out an early vote, which is very similar to my reason for voting for **Precambrian** , because I thought he was trying to shut down someone making shot in the dark suggestions, which seems OK for early in the game. I think our reasons are actually pretty similar now, and you are right, **Astral Rejection** , that I mischaracterized your initial reason. Neither of us voted for **Precambrian** because he voted for **Svejk** , but because he voted for XXXX, where XXXX is someone who tried to get things started with a random vote. 6. > [@septimus](#): > > Švejk’s random vote may be odd, but the votes against him seem opportunistic. Someone agrees with me: > > I’m not sure how much weight that unnecessary “tiny little jab” really warrants, but it seems enough for an early Day 1 vote. > > Vote: Precambrianmollusc From post #214. I interpreted the “tiny little jab” as the reason, where the real reason is in the sentence before that - the vote appeared “opportunistic.” In retrospect, I’ve been skimming over posts way too fast and not pausing to read them enough. I my defense, I had no idea there would be _so many_ posts. > [@Astral Rejection](#): > > I cannot understand a town thought process that says “these votes do not appeal to me” followed by “I should still vote for this person.” As it turns out, I think we actually had very similar processes for voting for **Precambrian** , and we each expressed those processes in a way where neither of us understood the other. I think it should be fair to mention that I don’t think **Precambrian** is scum anymore… looking more carefully at the post history, **Precambrian** posted twice since my vote posts that I think represent a desire to help with scum hunting - posts #359 and 386 in particular stand out as anti-scum to me. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2011, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526/400 "2011-12-03T04:02:32Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > Others voted for **Precambrianmollusc** because of something he said. In keeping with the “no editing” rule, this **should** read: **I thought** others voted for **Precambrianmollusc** because of something he said. As it turns out, I was mistaken and should have read people’s posts more carefully. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-the-thrill-of-the-chase-newbie-friendly/603526.md?page=21)