# Mafia Watch-Along Thread - NO SPOILERS! \[FORBIDDEN TO LIVE PLAYERS\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [July 17, 2015, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379 "2015-07-17T01:15:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/501 "2015-10-06T19:20:31Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > I think this is a board where games operate on the clockmaker theory - the game is set in motion and then it runs on its own engine. > > Your game is being actively modified by you as it runs, since you’re slowly revealing the setup as the game goes and those revelations aren’t on a predetermined schedule. This throws our internal balance calculations off. > > It’s not an attack, but it is different than what we’re used to seeing. > > Don’t mistake discussion and questions for condemnation. You’ll know when that happens because somebody will link to the pit thread. 🙂 Thank you for that clarification JB. Honestly, that does help me to not get so bent out of shape from your guys’ questions. Thanks again. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/502 "2015-10-06T19:36:25Z")
A mod-confirmed role is essentially a mason group of one. This type of singleton mason is unlynchable without a fake counterclaim by scum. And even with a fake claim, that player is likely to remain not-lynched anyway. Fake claims by scum are inherently bad for scum. Too many mod-confirmed town roles and it becomes basically impossible for scum to have any chance at winning. At its core, mafia is a game of information versus numbers. Town has the numbers but not the information. Scum has the information, but not the numbers. Once either side gains access to the piece they don’t have, they win. Mod-confirming roles is giving Town information like candy. Usually the way the game plays out is Town has to sacrifice numbers to gain access to information. So far, Town has offered nothing by way of numbers and gained quite a bit of information _for free_. ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/503 "2015-10-06T19:51:00Z")
Ok, but how is my way different then an open game where you know how many Town roles there are what they are… Claiming to be Frank Martin in my game is not much different then claiming to be Town Commuter in an open setup. Am I wrong in this? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/504 "2015-10-07T12:29:32Z")
The fundamental difference is that open setups are usually weighted so that early claiming is less useful. In your game, claiming “Frank Martin” is safer because scum doesn’t know what the rest of town looks like. They can’t calculate whether it’s a good idea to go after him or not. Is he a doctor or a roleblocker? Can he be protected? In a completely closed setup, claiming “hey guys, I’m Frank Martin the town Roleblocker” would still engender discussion about whether that was a role that even exists. In your game, you’ve verified that there is a Frank Martin and that he’s town. Meanwhile, your flavor text also implies that there is a player named Karl who attempted to make a night kill. Town can infer that this means that scum have to choose one of them to actually make the kill. This is an important piece of data, too, because in some games scum just collectively decide who’s going to get whacked. If that’s not the case, then the flavor text is misleading and that has further implications. ANYWAY. Mosier is pinging my scumdar pretty hard. Astral is right when he says that no-lynch days are bad, and it’s pretty early in the game for anybody to be “certain” of who scum is just off of Day 1 clues. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/505 "2015-10-07T14:50:35Z")
> [@Dante\_G](#): > > Ok, but how is my way different then an open game where you know how many Town roles there are what they are… Claiming to be Frank Martin in my game is not much different then claiming to be Town Commuter in an open setup. Am I wrong in this? No. Not wrong at all. I would argue that an open set up game with many unique known-to-be-Town roles is unbalanced from the start. Open setup should have very very few unique known-to-be-town roles and many many many vanilla town. ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/506 "2015-10-07T15:14:24Z")
Ok, well thanks for that clarification everyone. I have decided to post a list of all the Night Actions that transpired in the game at the end of the game, so you guys can get an idea more of what happened and how I interpreted it into the narratives. I will say this - there are 3 scum players and 7 town. Town does have power roles, obviously, but some Town are vanilla. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/507 "2015-10-07T15:45:19Z")
I don’t see where Mosier is in any position to soft claim a power role today. He was on the lynch block yesterday. Any claiming should have happened then. I feel bad for Astral. It looks like he has to argue with a wall. If there really are three scum then I take back my comments about being unfair to scum. That’s really quite a lot of scum for a game so small. ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/508 "2015-10-07T15:57:14Z")
Well, I agree that at first it may seem like too many Scum, but then again, I have some fairly powerful Town roles. So we will see how it works out. I think I balanced it well enough. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/509 "2015-10-07T16:17:30Z")
Dante, if you are going to share information about the game state not known to players in this thread, could you use a spoiler box? ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/510 "2015-10-07T16:22:06Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Dante, if you are going to share information about the game state not known to players in this thread, could you use a spoiler box? Sorry. Will do. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/511 "2015-10-07T16:28:34Z")
Thanks. I just prefer limiting myself to the same information available to the actual players. (That way, when I’m right about something I can pretend I’m quite smart and not just lucky.) ---
**Author:** ![Sario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sario/32/18580_2.png) [@Sario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sario)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2015, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/512 "2015-10-12T20:10:24Z")
Well, that fell apart rather quickly on me. ---
**Author:** ![Dante\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@Dante\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante_G)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2015, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/513 "2015-10-12T20:26:20Z")
It was fun having you, though. Thanks for playing! ---
**Author:** ![Cygnus42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Cygnus42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cygnus42)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2015, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/514 "2015-10-12T20:27:47Z")
It did, didn’t it… This game is interesting - being able to match up the role names/character names to players adds an extra layer for deduction. Prof P put it all together pretty quickly. ---
**Author:** ![WF\_Tomba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d9b06d/32.png) [@WF\_Tomba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WF_Tomba)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/515 "2015-10-14T20:41:29Z")
Well, this game was definitely different from the other Mafia games we’ve had on this board. With **Dante** actively shaping the game as it goes along, it feels a little more like a tabletop RPG, or something like that. At this point, the only lingering question for Town is whether **AstralRejection** or **HookerChemical** is the last villain. It might come down to a coin toss. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/516 "2015-10-16T17:26:23Z")
I can post without risking spoilers! I was so relieved when Prof. posted [490](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18765990&postcount=490)! ---
**Author:** ![WF\_Tomba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d9b06d/32.png) [@WF\_Tomba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WF_Tomba)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2015, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/517 "2015-10-16T18:56:39Z")
Did you investigate him? ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2015, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/518 "2015-10-16T19:55:51Z")
No, I investigated sangfroid. By making so many town power roles, Dante made sangfroids alter ego very betraying. When starting out, I was unsure of the extent of powers beyond myself and a godfather. Then we found out about the transporter, the deputy and Mel Gibson. Sangfroids alter ego was TOWN. When names became players, it became obvious sangfroid was Hans. The reason I investigated him is because I realised last game I can’t read him. And I figured he’d capitalize on that either way. I probably should have shared it as soon as possible, but I wanted to stay hidden for a bit longer. I tried to put attention to him, and I think it worked out in that respect. ---
**Author:** ![WF\_Tomba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d9b06d/32.png) [@WF\_Tomba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WF_Tomba)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2015, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/519 "2015-10-16T20:02:43Z")
Who do you think is Karl? ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2015, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379/520 "2015-10-16T20:17:38Z")
I’m unsure, but I’m leaning HookerChemical for now. I’m hoping this day will be a bit more substantial. Jason Bourne… More than TOWN. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mafia-watch-along-thread-no-spoilers-forbidden-to-live-players/725379.md?page=27)