# Magical Realism vs. Urban Fantasy **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 28, 2013, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961 "2013-04-28T23:11:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/1 "2013-04-28T23:11:25Z")
I thought about putting this in “In My Humble Opinion,” but since it involves literary genres… What is the difference between Magical Realism and Urban Fantasy? I have a pretty clear idea of what the “Urban Fantasy” is: take the “Beauty and the Beast” tv series (with Vincent living in the tunnels under the city.) Or Esther Friesner’s “New York by Knight.” It’s the real world, with some sort of fantasy intrusion. But what is “Magical Realism?” What is the most pronounced distinction from UF? Could someone perhaps name a good, solid example of a book that is near the definitional heart of each? ---
**Author:** ![GovernmentMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GovernmentMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GovernmentMan)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2013, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/2 "2013-04-28T23:34:13Z")
magical realism = One Hundred Years of Solitude by GGM, or films like Midnight in Paris urban fantasy = magic stuff happening in urban environments ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/3 "2013-04-29T00:07:51Z")
By the most marvelous coincidence (or maybe not) someone just last night gave me One Hundred Years of Solitude to read. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/4 "2013-04-29T00:29:17Z")
It looks like magical realism may just be a snooty form of urban fantasy; the writers of this wikipedia refer to Kafka’s _The Metamorphosis_ as fantasy, and later as one of the major works of magical realism. So, either they’re contradicting themselves, or magical realism is contained within fantasy. They also list _Like Water for Chocolate_ as a major example. > **[Magic realism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magical_Realism)** > > Magic realism or magical realism is a style of literary fiction and art. It paints a realistic view of the world while also adding magical elements, often blurring the lines between fantasy and reality. Magic realism often refers to literature in particular, with magical or supernatural phenomena presented in an otherwise real-world or mundane setting, commonly found in novels and dramatic performances.: 1–5  Despite including certain magic elements, it is generally considered to be a diffe The t... ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/5 "2013-04-29T00:48:38Z")
The differences and similarities between genre f&sf and mainstream f&f have been hotly debated for decades. A broad definition of f&sf of course includes both magical realism and urban fantasy. That doesn’t necessarily mean that they’re the same thing. O_ne Hundred Years of Solitude_ is always cited as magical realism, as is so much of Latin American literature that deals in allegory. But I really like GovernmentMan’s mention of _Midnight in Paris_. The central character gets into a taxi that drives him into the past, so he can visit the ex-pat community in 1920’s Paris. Every aspect of the story except the magic taxi is as real as he can make it. Woody has done this before, the short story “The Kugelmass Episode,” for example. The line between creating a bridge into fantasy and having the fantasy element be dominant is hard to define. It’s very much “feel” and different people would draw the line in different places. The feel of standard fantasy, like Friesner’s, is different from magical realism. I know it when I see it, and all that. A couple of classic American works that could be defined either way are Mark Helprin’s _Winter’s Tale_ and John Crowley’s _Little, Big_. Both are long, complex, immensely well written books that are a bit hard to get into but are utterly fantastic in many senses of the word. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/6 "2013-04-29T00:49:29Z")
I was beginning to think that Urban Fantasy meant the real world was the real world, except that some small element of fantasy intrudes into it…while Magical Realism questions whether the real world is, after all, the real world we think it is. So, for instance, Fritz Leiber’s “Conjure Wife” would be the latter, because the poor (male) protagonist slowly realizes that all women are witches and have magical power. It isn’t just one witch – it’s all women. The difference in concept is key. But I’m not at all sure if I’m anywhere near the right idea. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/7 "2013-04-29T01:21:02Z")
I’m no expert by a long shot, but my understanding is that magical realism is a subgenre of [literary modernism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modernist_literature) that uses fantastic elements, whereas urban fantasy falls more under the heading of traditional narrative. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/8 "2013-04-29T01:26:05Z")
I think about it this way (though to tell the truth, before this thread I never actually thought about it). Magical realism. The fantasy element isn’t what the story is about. It’s a device usually used to deliver an allegory of some sort, but the realism of the story is the important bit and the story will usually make sense and be engaging without the magic bits. They serve as a highlighter just as any other literary device would. Urban fantasy is about the fantasy element. Take your\* Beauty and the Beast\* example. Without the fantasy there isn’t a story at all, the fantasy elements are the story. \*Midnight in Paris \*could still exist as a story without the magic taxi, it would just be a slightly different story and maybe a less interesting one, but you could still tell all the important bits of the story without it. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/9 "2013-04-29T05:28:47Z")
In urban fantasy, the magic generally has rules and explanations. In magic realism things just tend to happen. ---
**Author:** ![colander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e8c25b/32.png) [@colander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colander)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/10 "2013-04-29T06:08:22Z")
If it’s written by a Latin American, it’s probably magic realism. If it’s a supernatural romance with witches instead of vampires, it’s probably urban fantasy. Especially if it’s book one of a planned series. Anything else is probably “slipstream” ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/11 "2013-04-29T06:37:36Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > . . . Magical realism. The fantasy element isn’t what the story is about. It’s a device usually used to deliver an allegory of some sort . . . > > Urban fantasy is about the fantasy element. Take your\* Beauty and the Beast\* example. Without the fantasy there isn’t a story at all, the fantasy elements are the story. . . . > [@Alessan](#): > > In urban fantasy, the magic generally has rules and explanations. In magic realism things just tend to happen. These ideas make a lot of sense to me. I’ll go with these as my working definitions. **Thudlow Boink** : I suspect you may be right about the postmodernist content, but that would require me to comprehend postmodernism first, and that is already too deep for my fannish little brain. I actually agree with what I would call the “weak postmodernist principle,” that language and culture are filters through which we view the world, and that a truly objective perception is impossible – but I rise in indignant rejection of the “strong postmodernist principle,” which concludes, ergo, there is no objective reality. It’s like the difference between saying “Our language influences our understanding of what we discuss” and "Our language determines our understanding of what we discuss. The former seems valid; the latter, not so much. Weak ideological principles are usually closer to moderation, and moderation is usually closer to wisdom. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/12 "2013-04-29T06:50:36Z")
> [@GovernmentMan](#): > > magical realism = One Hundred Years of Solitude by GGM I’m fascinated by how you thought everyone would know who GGM was. After some amount of googling it seems to be Gabriel García Márquez, but that wasn’t what came up anywhere near the top of the search. Anyways… I think the distinction is like the difference between Art Director and Production Designer. Or Steampunk and Gaslamp Fantasy. Lots of crossover but with very minor distinctions. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/13 "2013-04-29T06:51:26Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > It looks like magical realism may just be a snooty form of urban fantasy; the writers of this wikipedia refer to Kafka’s _The Metamorphosis_ as fantasy, and later as one of the major works of magical realism. So, either they’re contradicting themselves, or magical realism is contained within fantasy. They also list _Like Water for Chocolate_ as a major example. > > [Magical realism - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magical_Realism) In any case I’d refer to urban fantasy, which is newer and more specific (for starters, it by definition takes place in urban settings, which magical realism often does not), as an offshoot or specialization within magical realism. You seem to have the relationship upside-down. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/14 "2013-04-29T07:01:58Z")
I disagree. Urban Fantasy is basically an offshoot of horror. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 8:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/15 "2013-04-29T08:45:26Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I disagree. Urban Fantasy is basically an offshoot of horror. Or “ordinary” low fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![GovernmentMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GovernmentMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GovernmentMan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/16 "2013-04-29T09:04:04Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > I’m fascinated by how you thought everyone would know who GGM was. After some amount of googling it seems to be Gabriel García Márquez, but that wasn’t what came up anywhere near the top of the search. > > Anyways… I think the distinction is like the difference between Art Director and Production Designer. Or Steampunk and Gaslamp Fantasy. Lots of crossover but with very minor distinctions. Who hasn’t heard of him? He’s one of the most famous novelists in the world. And what does it matter? I mentioned the work. If you’re familiar with One Hundred Years of Solitude then you know what GGM means. I wasn’t even going to put the name of the author there. I don’t know why I did. Did you seriously have trouble figuring what GGM meant? Why didn’t you just look up the name of the book? Or did you want to see if you could figure out what it stood for by itself, without using other keywords? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/17 "2013-04-29T09:15:44Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I disagree. Urban Fantasy is basically an offshoot of horror. Not necessarily of horror, since it often involves elves and the scariest thing is a goblin with a too-high voice; it’s just a brand of fantasy, which may or may not involve horror. But what definitely is not true is that magical realism is a snottifying of urban fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/18 "2013-04-29T10:07:01Z")
> [@GovernmentMan](#): > > Or did you want to see if you could figure out what it stood for by itself, without using other keywords? I wondered if he was so famous he was commonly referred to by only his initials. Some celebrities are. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/19 "2013-04-29T12:05:04Z")
In my brain, it goes like this: Magical Realism: Stories where magical stuff is ancillary - there’s fantastical stuff happening, but only to drive the plot forward. Not as an integral part of the plot. Urban Fantasy: What you get when classic high fantasy has a baby with noir. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2013, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961/20 "2013-04-29T12:59:57Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > I’m fascinated by how you thought everyone would know who GGM was. After some amount of googling it seems to be Gabriel García Márquez, but that wasn’t what came up anywhere near the top of the search. > > Anyways… I think the distinction is like the difference between Art Director and Production Designer. Or Steampunk and Gaslamp Fantasy. Lots of crossover but with very minor distinctions. “GGM” can pretty much just be read as “The Author of One Hundred Years of Solitude” in that post, since you know from the post that it is who the book is “by”. So if you want to know who it is, you _google the name of the book._ ETA: Moreover a single google search for “ggm” yields, as the first hit, a wikipedia disambiguation page with about five entries, only one who which is the name of an author. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magical-realism-vs-urban-fantasy/656961.md?page=2)