# MAGNETIC THERAPY.......Does it work? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 29, 2003, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972 "2003-11-29T22:19:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![aleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@aleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aleon)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2015, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/61 "2015-05-18T22:03:48Z")
> [@aleon](#): > > TOA cells Sorry, not TOA, but T-helpers ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2015, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/62 "2015-05-18T23:22:00Z")
> [@aleon](#): > > it can perfectly be that it does not work out for you and you throw a lot of money trough the window. Just test it for yourself, and care for your personal relieve. This is what many woo enthusiasts suggest for anyone with a chronic health problem incompletely addressed by evidence-based medicine. People are supposed to keep trying different supplements and therapies (and tossing away their money) until they find something that seems to work. And it may seem to, for awhile. The natural history of placebo therapy typically involves a temporary easing of symptoms (which for arthritis and other conditions often come and go unpredictably), followed by disappointment as the symptoms return and the user moves on to new placebos. **aleon** probably will be posting here or on another board in the future extolling the virtues of a different wonder therapy (freon?) and chiding others for their “fanaticism” in requiring actual evidence before embracing a form of medical treatment. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/63 "2015-05-19T00:58:28Z")
> [@aleon](#): > > I just had interest in sharing my experience, because I felt important to me sharing the testing solutions despite different prejudices (I have a lot too), to be aware that in this world there is much more than things we know and therefore should always be open… No worries. Just please don’t let your mind be so open your brain falls out. > [@](#): > > For a 10 year old thread there is still a lot of attention, interesting. It is my first time in this forum, the thread had some interesting posts for me. So I will check other threads. > Best greetings and good bye. Maybe we meet on another threat. Well, the fact that it had a new post after 12 years means it was at the top of the forum, so we’re more likely to see it, and therefore to respond. I guarantee we’re not spending any time on the matter on a daily basis! But welcome! Poke around, we do discuss a ton of deeply interesting things. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/64 "2015-05-19T10:39:28Z")
The issue is not one of “you are not experiencing the relief that you claim you are experiencing”. The issue is that you are attributing that relief to the magnet therapy, without having done the work to rule out all other possibilities. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2015, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/65 "2015-05-21T21:08:20Z")
> [@aleon](#): > > I just had interest in sharing my experience Unfortunately, you didn’t limit yourself to sharing your experience, you also preached to us and admonished us for putting credence in repeatable studies performed under strict conditions and analyzed using rigorous statistical methods, rather than in personal anecdotes, and calling that “believing what we’re told rather than what we see.” > [@Smeghead](#): > > The issue is not one of “you are not experiencing the relief that you claim you are experiencing”. The issue is that you are attributing that relief to the magnet therapy, without having done the work to rule out all other possibilities. Bingo. There is a great deal of anecdotal evidence for a wide variety of things we do not believe. Anecdotal evidence can be interesting, and it can be convincing when it’s our own anecdote, but it’s not particularly good evidence. Not that the scientific consensus always has it right. It’s just the de facto position, and anyone with a counterclaim has the burden of proof. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/66 "2015-05-21T21:30:44Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > . . . Not that the scientific consensus always has it right. It’s just the de facto position, and anyone with a counterclaim has the burden of proof. Exactly. It’s like Type I and Type II errors in statistics. We work as hard as we can to minimize one of them, but that means the other is always a possibility. The Scientific Method isn’t guaranteed to be right, but it isn’t guaranteed to be a method. It’s repeatable, and openly repeatable. “My uncle was cured by cherry pits” isn’t repeatable. It isn’t a “method.” ---
**Author:** ![rayxoxo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@rayxoxo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayxoxo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/67 "2015-05-25T02:07:36Z")
I am new here and I find the majority of you to be doubting Thomases - Nature is not a restrictive thing - aleon, mentioned his method of feeling cured and they chime in that its just aplacebo - Why do we all seem to think that everything is a slight of hand parlour trick if it doesn’t work every time. You say you had a dream the other day that was marvellous - Well I don’t believe you, can you make it happen again? There are things in this world that science can not understand - but they are there anyway and they don’t need for man to understand them to work. I am rather disappointed in this group for not having a more opened mind - When you say it’s bullshit or a trick - just closes off the possibility of learning any more about that idea. You can jump on me for posting this but I just wanted to state what I saw in this thread. Jesus walking on water may have been a parlour trick or else it is a lie. Who can say. Apparently it isn’t an every day event, or could he have had a better understand of the laws of nature than most of us. You might want to check out Kirlian photography - to aid in understanding just a little of the invisible spectrum. Easy enough to look up on your browsers. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/68 "2015-05-25T02:14:39Z")
Kirlian photography is a method of photographing electrical coronal discharges. So? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/69 "2015-05-25T02:19:52Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers in 2003](#): > > And I’m firmly in the “bunk” camp. I ended up building a condo there. ---
**Author:** ![rayxoxo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@rayxoxo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayxoxo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/70 "2015-05-25T02:41:02Z")
It aids in understanding why some one who has had a limb removed still can feel their toes from just wish fulfilment . [http://www.crystalinks.com/kirlian.html](http://www.crystalinks.com/kirlian.html) There may be understandable reasons for most things but to shut yourself off from any further investigation of your universe closes the door to the adventure. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/71 "2015-05-25T02:47:24Z")
> [@rayxoxo](#): > > It aids in understanding why some one who has had a limb removed still can feel their toes from just wish fulfilment > . > [Kirlian and Aura Photography - Crystalinks](http://www.crystalinks.com/kirlian.html) > > There may be understandable reasons for most things but to shut yourself off from any further investigation of your universe closes the door to the adventure. That’s nice. What do you know about magnetic therapy? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/72 "2015-05-25T03:24:08Z")
> [@rayxoxo](#): > > I am new here and I find the majority of you to be doubting Thomases - Nature is not a restrictive thing - aleon, mentioned his method of feeling cured and they chime in that its just aplacebo - > Why do we all seem to think that everything is a slight of hand parlour trick if it doesn’t work every time. It doesn’t have to work every time. Antibiotics don’t work every time. They work in enough cases to make them worth trying. You need to provide controlled double-blind experiments that show that your new procedure – magnetic therapy, in this discussion – works often enough to warrant using. Take two large groups of people. Treat one group with magnetic therapy, and the other group with colored water. Look for a significant statistical difference. If there is, that’s great. Let’s keep on working on it, till we know what kinds of magnets, and how to apply them, and what kinds of ailments they work on. If there isn’t – and so far, that’s the case – then the idea goes in the big junk-pile, along with snake oil, Thorium water, laetrile, and other stuff that doesn’t work. > [@](#): > > . . . There are things in this world that science can not understand - but they are there anyway and they don’t need for man to understand them to work. Do they actually work? You’re right, in that we don’t need to know why something works…if it actually works. But we have very, very good procedures for determining whether or not it does work, and magnetic therapy does not pass those tests. > [@](#): > > I am rather disappointed in this group for not having a more opened mind - When you say it’s bullshit or a trick - just closes off the possibility of learning any more about that idea. The idea in question has actually been tested. It’s been tried. We aren’t rejecting it a priori. We’re rejecting it because it fails when tested. > [@](#): > > You might want to check out Kirlian photography - to aid in understanding just a little of the invisible spectrum. Most of us are quite familiar with the history of Kirlian photography, and how it was promoted, early on, with great claims of “auras” and “life energy” and how you could take photographs of missing limbs, or the missing parts of green leaves, or other wild notions. In time, the claims were tested, shown to be incorrect, and now we know that Kirlian photography is a pretty effective way to visualize certain kinds of moisture gradients. You can take a picture of your hand when it is wet, and not get much of an image, but if you wet your hand and then dry it, the picture shows big streamers of light running from your fingers. It’s moisture vapor, nothing more. No auras, no life-forces, just…moisture. Interesting in a limited sort of way, but not very useful. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/73 "2015-05-25T04:14:43Z")
> [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](#): > > I must get some of the stuff those guys are selling > > Those magnetic monopoles should be _really_ interesting. I have no doubt that magnetic therapy is quack medicine. I also recognise that this is a years-old zombie, some of the original participants are no longer with us. However, just for the sake of accuracy, I should point out that the above is a strawman, and a misunderstanding of their claims. I’ve never seen any claims to have made a magnetic monopole. They use the term **dipolar** , or \*\*bipolar \*\*when magnets alternate between North and South pole upwards. They use the term \*\*unipolar \*\*or \*\*unidirectional \*\*when the magnets all point in the same direction. Example: [http://spinalbrace.com/tectonic/strength.htm](http://spinalbrace.com/tectonic/strength.htm) [http://www.discovermagnetics.com/faq4.html#Unidirectional%20Magnets](http://www.discovermagnetics.com/faq4.html#Unidirectional%20Magnets) ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/74 "2015-05-25T05:12:54Z")
> [@rayxoxo](#): > > I am rather disappointed in this group for not having a more opened mind - When you say it’s bullshit or a trick - just closes off the possibility of learning any more about that idea. Being **open-minded** means a willingness to consider new evidence even if it challenges the current understanding. It does not mean a willingness to accept claims without evidence. And might as well cover this one while we’re here: **Skepticism** is healthy doubt when claims are not accompanied by credible evidence. **Denial** is willful doubt even in the face of overwhelming evidence. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/75 "2015-05-25T07:08:22Z")
> [@rayxoxo](#): > > It aids in understanding why some one who has had a limb removed still can feel their toes from just wish fulfilment > . > [Kirlian and Aura Photography - Crystalinks](http://www.crystalinks.com/kirlian.html) > > There may be understandable reasons for most things but to shut yourself off from any further investigation of your universe closes the door to the adventure. And ignoring the results of further investigation closes the door to knowledge. From your own link: > [@](#): > > Researchers at Drexel University, however, have claimed that they were unable to reproduce the effect when the glass used to capture the original leaf was replaced with new glass before the freshly cut leaf was photographed, leading them to conclude that the “cut leaf” phenomenon was caused by microscopic etching in the surface of the glass which occurred during preparing the images of the uncut leaf. They also reported on a number of demonstrable causes such as surface moisture and pressure which can account for much of the variations in color, shape, and size of the resulting image. I.e. there is no mystical aura around plants and people including lost parts of leaves or bodies. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/76 "2015-05-26T23:28:19Z")
> [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](#): > > **Skepticism** is healthy doubt when claims are not accompanied by credible evidence. **Denial** is willful doubt even in the face of overwhelming evidence. I’d like to take this time to quote an episode of Batman Beyond Terry- “But I guess you don’t believe in ghosts” Bruce- “Of course I do. Ghosts, magic, aliens **I’ve seen too much not to believe.** ” As a skeptic, I believe that the world is full of all kinds of wondrous things. BUT, these wondrous things are testable, repeatable etc. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2015, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/77 "2015-05-27T00:05:42Z")
> [@XT](#): > > They can put a man on the moon but they can’t make Magnetic Therapy work… Fuckin’ magnetic therapy, how does it work? ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2015, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/78 "2015-05-27T00:44:36Z")
Another Batman quote. I’ve always felt it did a great job of showing the difference between believers and skeptics [QUOTE=Batman] You saw a young man, cruelly struck down in his prime and then miraculously restored to life. I saw a rookie with a flesh wound regain consciousness. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/79 "2015-06-04T17:45:52Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Another Batman quote. I’ve always felt it did a great job of showing the difference between believers and skeptics Shot in the dark, as it were, but was he talking to Zatanna in _Brave and the Bold_ #169, December 1980? ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972/80 "2015-06-04T18:51:47Z")
I have to admit that when I saw a dead woo-focused thread bumped back up, I was not expecting it to be due to a discussion of Batman. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/magnetic-therapy-does-it-work/215972.md?page=5)