# Mail out $1 and earn $800,000 in 90 days **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 14, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269 "2005-06-14T20:36:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![velvetgrass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/47e85d/32.png) [@velvetgrass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velvetgrass)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/1 "2005-06-14T20:36:37Z")
I recieved this letter in the mail today. Is this legal? Who is actually making all the money here? Someone has to be winning, and i really doubt it is the people waiting around for their $1. Please explain to me what is happening. Also, they refer to “They are listed with BBB with no complaints” What is the BBB? Thank you. * * * Dear Friend, My name is Dick Holman, In september 1999 my car was repossed. Bill collectors were hounding like you wouldnt believe. I was laid off and unemployment insurance ran out. In october i recieved a letter telling me how i could earn $800,000 anytime i wanted to. Of course I was skeptical but because i had nothing to lose i gave it a try. In January of 2000, my family and i went on a two day cruise. In February i bought a new cadillac with cash. This program works perfectly. I have never failed to make $800,000 on each mailing. This is a legitimate business opportunity and perfect money making program. It does not require you to sell anything or come in contact with anyone. Best of all, the only time you ever leave home is to mail your letters and you can do that on the way to the grocery store. I am sure you could use 800,000 in the next 20 to 90 days. Please study this letter carefully. THIS IS NOT A CHAIN LETTER. Follow these instructions. 1. Immediately send $1 to each of the six names listed below (there are six names listed at bottom of page) and request that you be added to their mailing list. THIS IS WHAT MAKES THIS SYSTEM LEGAL. 2. Remove the name in the number one position and move the other names up a space. (Two becomes one, three becomes two, etc.) Put your name and address in the sixth position. 3. After completing the instructions, photocopy or print 200 copies of this 3 page letter. 4. Purchase a mailing list from DATALine. They are listed with BBB with no complaints. Specify that you want the names of opportunity seekers. They sell a list of 200 for only $40. (ask them about their special for first time callers) They ship next day COD, and the names come on self-adhesive tape that you can stick on the envelopes. Call 800-XXX-2922 and the company accepts mastercard, visa, debit cards. 5. While waiting for your mailing list to arrive, place each of your 200 copies in business sized envelopes and seal them. Once the list arrives, goto your local post office and get stamps and mail them. Within 20 to 90 days you should recieve $800,000. The first time i participated i kept an account of all my letters, the first response was 9.5% and the second was over 11%. Refer to title 18, Sec 1302, and 1342 of US Postal Lottery Laws, for legal information. When you send 200 copies of this letter, and each respondent sends 200 copies and sends you $1, your fortune multiplies rapidly. At a conservative rate of response, assume you get 7.5% return rate. When you send out 200 letters, 15 will send you $1= $15.00 Those 15 people mail out 200 letters, 225 people respond with $1= $225.00 Those 225 people mail out 200 letters, 3,375 people respond with $1.00= $3,375.00 Those 3,375 people mail out 200 letters, 50, 625 people send you $1.00= $50,625.00 Those 50,625 people mail out 200 letters, 759,375 people send you $1.00= $759,615.00 ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/2 "2005-06-14T20:43:44Z")
Do the words “Ponzi” or “pyramid scam” mean anything to you? ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/3 "2005-06-14T20:46:15Z")
It’s a [pyramid scheme](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_scheme), and no, it’s not legal. > [@](#): > > Someone has to be winning, and i really doubt it is the people waiting around for their $1. The guy you send money to is the winner, of course. As you seem to have figured out yourself, eventually someone isn’t going to get any responses, and that person is the loser. > [@](#): > > Also, they refer to “They are listed with BBB with no complaints” > What is the BBB? The BBB usually stands for the [Better Business Bureau](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Business_Bureau). Either this guy is lying about being registered there, or BBB stands for something else in that context, but he wants you to think he means the Better Business Bureau. ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/4 "2005-06-14T20:47:26Z")
It’s called a **pyramid scheme** and they don’t work because not many people fall for it anymore. The letter is making some pretty big assumptions assuming that for every 200 letters sent 15 people will respond with cash. And that the 200 letters that each of those 15 people send, 15 of every 200 will ‘respond with cash’. Bad assumption. Not to mention the fact that if it did work they’d be out of people to send letters to real quick. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/5 "2005-06-14T20:49:19Z")
> [@](#): > > The guy you send money to is the winner, of course. And these guys: “4. Purchase a mailing list from DATALine.” There are probably people with more teeth than the BBB who’d be interested in this. Say, the Postal Inspectors. This probably fist the definition of “mail fraud.” ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/6 "2005-06-14T20:50:45Z")
The real business here is selling you a list of 200 names & addresses for $40. ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/7 "2005-06-14T20:55:05Z")
No, it’s not legal. [US Postal Service](http://www.usps.com/websites/depart/inspect/chainlet.htm) > [@](#): > > Do not be fooled if the chain letter is used to sell inexpensive reports on credit, mail order sales, mailing lists, or other topics. The primary purpose is to take your money, not to sell information. “Selling” a product does not ensure legality. Be doubly suspicious if there’s a claim that the U.S. Postal Service or U.S. Postal Inspection Service has declared the letter legal. This is said only to mislead you. Neither the Postal Service nor Postal Inspectors give prior approval to any chain letter. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/8 "2005-06-14T20:55:32Z")
I’m sure the company DATALine is a legitimate provider of mailing lists and has no complaints against it. However, I doubt if they have anything to do with this scheme. I could just as easily tell you to call TV Guide and order one of their lists. As for legality, here’s what the Postal Service has to say… \*They’re illegal if they request money or other items of value and promise a substantial return to the participants. Chain letters are a form of gambling, and sending them through the mail (or delivering them in person or by computer, but mailing money to participate) violates Title 18, United States Code, Section 1302, the Postal Lottery Statute. \* [http://www.usps.com/postalinspectors/chainlet.htm](http://www.usps.com/postalinspectors/chainlet.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/9 "2005-06-14T20:58:48Z")
I’m sure the company DATALine is a legitimate provider of mailing lists and has no complaints against it. However, I doubt if they have anything to do with this scheme. I could just as easily tell you to call TV Guide and order one of their lists. As for legality, here’s what the Postal Service has to say… \*They’re illegal if they request money or other items of value and promise a substantial return to the participants. Chain letters are a form of gambling, and sending them through the mail (or delivering them in person or by computer, but mailing money to participate) violates Title 18, United States Code, Section 1302, the Postal Lottery Statute. \* [http://www.usps.com/postalinspectors/chainlet.htm](http://www.usps.com/postalinspectors/chainlet.htm) By the way, the next round of mailings would have to go to more than 151 _million_ people. I doubt there are enough “opportunity seekers” to fill that list. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/10 "2005-06-14T21:07:49Z")
Whenever somebody writes “THIS IS NOT A CHAIN LETTER,” remember one thing: it’s a chain letter. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/11 "2005-06-14T21:53:51Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Whenever somebody writes “THIS IS NOT A CHAIN LETTER,” remember one thing: it’s a chain letter. THIS IS NOT A CHAIN LETTER… …It’s a post on the SDMB! Sorry about that - of course you’re correct. Just as when a voice on the telephone says they’re **not** trying to sell you something. Then they immmediately try to. I had a friend who was a company director. He got a chain mail letter and was quite excited about the free money ‘with no risk’. :rolleyes: So I explained about how the money passes from the losers who come in later and goes to the crooks who start the thing. I got him to work out what happened if suckers kept sending out 200 letters. Pretty soon we effectively had the entire population of Earth receiving a demand for money, and promising they would all make a profit. **And he still couldn’t see it!** “It must work” he kept saying. “Nobody would keep doing this otherwise…” ‘Several hundred people from the Isle of Wight are thought to have lost thousands of pounds through pyramid schemes that have spread in the island in the past six months.’ [http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1298197.stm](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1298197.stm) ---
**Author:** ![velvetgrass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/47e85d/32.png) [@velvetgrass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velvetgrass)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/12 "2005-06-14T22:17:42Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > The real business here is selling you a list of 200 names & addresses for $40. Do you think its possible that DATALine mails these out to draw in money? ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/13 "2005-06-14T22:20:37Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > the next round of mailings would have to go to more than 151 million people. I doubt there are enough “opportunity seekers” to fill that list. [Albania had a near civil war](http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/2000/03/jarvis.htm) that was triggered by a large percentage of the population investing in pyramid schemes that ultimately failed. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/14 "2005-06-14T22:29:23Z")
Oh, and I have to put in a link to [what The Master has to say about work-at-home schemes](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_358.html) that work according to basically the same principle as pyramid schemes. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/15 "2005-06-14T22:32:08Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Whenever somebody writes “THIS IS NOT A CHAIN LETTER,” remember one thing: it’s a chain letter. And when someone makes a point to say, “This is perfectly legal,” it is not. Think about it. If you go into a legitimate business, do they ever have signs saying what they do it perfectly legal? It’s only scammers that have to say it. A mention of the BBB is also a sure sign of a scam. The BBB is, of course, legitimate, but they will list anyone who sends them a check, and will only make an issue if they are sent complaints that are not resolved (and to resolve them, all they require is a letter from the company that is the target of the complaint saying the problem was resolved – they don’t check it out). Legitimate businesses join the BBB (whose purpose is to advocate for local businesses, not consumers). Scammers brag about their memberships. ---
**Author:** ![MaryEFoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MaryEFoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaryEFoo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/16 "2005-06-14T22:43:51Z")
From **glee** > [@](#): > > I had a friend who was a company director. He got a chain mail letter and was quite excited about the free money ‘with no risk’. > So I explained … > **And he still couldn’t see it!** > “It must work” he kept saying. “Nobody would keep doing this otherwise…” I hope he sent in for the free money. When all else fails, that’s one way ignorance is fought. The real world comes in on our side. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/17 "2005-06-14T23:14:22Z")
> [@MaryEFoo](#): > > From **glee** > I hope he sent in for the free money. When all else fails, that’s one way ignorance is fought. The real world comes in on our side. We got him into our poker game instead. 😃 Not high stakes, but he still learnt a lesson. ‘You mean you were … bluffing?!’ ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2005, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/18 "2005-06-15T00:13:56Z")
Taking a closer look at this, I just love this part: > [@some greedy bastard](#): > > 1. Immediately send $1 to each of the six names listed below (there are six names listed at bottom of page) and request that you be added to their mailing list. THIS IS WHAT MAKES THIS SYSTEM LEGAL. Think about it. Why bother with this part? You could follow all the other instructions, mail out copies and watch the money start rolling in, and you wouldn’t even be out the original 6 bucks! Ah, but that’s what makes it legal. Brilliant. ---
**Author:** ![Alanwrench1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Alanwrench1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alanwrench1)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/19 "2010-12-20T10:07:51Z")
I don’t know why people can’t just see this as having a little fun, trying things out. You don’t want to participate then DON’T! You can’t not eat for fear of choking. So many naysayers in the world. So much negativity in this room, don’t you guys have something better to bicker about? The one’s that can’t afford to try this, are probably some of the same one’s that were told early on in their lives that they couldn’t do something… That is definitely and I’m sure at least one reason among many that they may find themselves in a position of not affording to try this. People and their negativity SUCK! I however would have fun at this, even “IF” nothing happened. Like letting off balloons with letters asking to send them back to me to see how far they traveled. If if’s and buts were candy and nuts we’d all have a Merry Christmas. I am going to do it one day, even IF I don’t send the six bucks. Knowing me and because I have a lot of love in my heart would more than likely send the darn six bucks, it might make it to someone when they needed the most. I’m going to have to look at this like making a donation and not expecting anything back. Leave it all up to my God. Thanks and have an Unbelieveable day wasting your time over so much nonsense and discouraging people! There are no guarantee’s in life! ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269/20 "2010-12-20T10:25:08Z")
> [@](#): > > I don’t know why people can’t just see this as having a little fun, trying things out. Because it’s a scam. That’s ALL it is, and the people who try it are usually the ones who really can’t afford to lose the six bucks. It’s not just having a little fun, and people are genuinely hurt by it. Only a fundamentally dishonest person would start such a pyramid scheme, and only a stupid or dishonest or incredibly naive person would participate in such a thing. It’s also the basis of a lot of spam posts. In fact, it’s so common that it’s known as “Make Money Fast” or MMF…and as a moderator and then administrator of this message board, I’ve had to remove a lot of these spam posts. They waste the time of people who have to delete the posts (or emails), and if they are NOT deleted, they can quickly overwhelm a message board/forum. I’ve seen too many message boards die because they weren’t moderated closely enough. Eventually, the posters who want to use the message board for whatever it was created for leave, either to find another board or start their own. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mail-out-1-and-earn-800-000-in-90-days/308269.md?page=2)