# Majority atheist world: How far away are we? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 31, 2011, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913 "2011-12-31T03:19:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![IMfez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@IMfez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IMfez)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/41 "2011-12-31T23:18:08Z")
You guys are right about the mistitle. If I could change the thread, I would have asked about a majority non-religious & non-spiritual world (to discriminate against consciously held meta-physical beliefs as a whole) ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/42 "2011-12-31T23:47:05Z")
I think the growing trend in open and hostile Atheists is going to continue and as the planet becomes more and more informed on all subjects all religions will continue to lose followers when their lies are common knowledge instead of buried out of site. it make take centuries though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_In_Black)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/43 "2012-01-01T02:27:30Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Religion is both factually wrong and highly destructive. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/44 "2012-01-01T02:36:25Z")
> [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](#): > > Cite? Religion has consistently been wrong when making claims that could be tested, and the laws of physics have no room for the mystical claims of religion - and if massive violation of the laws of physics aren’t a good enough reason for considering something wrong I can’t imagine what would be. It also tends towards internal contradiction, and since the various religions contradict each other most of them must be wrong. Religion is about as blatantly wrong as it is possible to get outside of pure mathematics. As for “destructive”, history and for that matter the news speaks for itself. Religion has caused massive amounts of suffering, death and tyranny all over the world for millennia; and it is still doing so. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/45 "2012-01-01T03:08:32Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I’m mildly curious what effect an asteroid hit that obliterates the Vatican or Mecca would have. Would the destruction of its center cause religions like Catholicism or Islam gradually dissipate? It’s been over 2000 years since the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem, and Judaism is still around…if we’re dissipating, it’s taking an awfully long time. It’s possible that the destruction of their centers would make those religions stronger, rather than weaker. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/46 "2012-01-01T03:13:49Z")
I do wonder if it would cause Catholicism to fragment. There are internal disputes within the Church, and with the leadership dead they’d have to form a new one. If they can’t agree on who to support, you might end up with, say, a “Catholic Church of America” and so forth. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/47 "2012-01-01T03:56:30Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I do wonder if it would cause Catholicism to fragment. What, _again?_ ---
**Author:** ![Theophane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@Theophane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Theophane)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/48 "2012-01-01T04:48:35Z")
> [@](#): > > Majority atheist world: How far away are we? If you want a majority atheist world, it would actually be easier to go terraform another planet. If you’re interested in seeing Planet Earth becoming majority atheist, get ready to dig a lot of mass-graves. You will have to kill an awful lot of people. Most of the human race, in fact. The grim task ahead of you will make the Stalinist purges and the Jewish Holocaust look like a church bake-sale. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/49 "2012-01-01T04:50:04Z")
Nah, more likely it’ll come about by religion fading away as something no longer needed and of dubious value, like phrenology. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/50 "2012-01-01T04:58:26Z")
Plenty of religions throughout history have died off; all that would be necessary is for the present ones to die off without replacement. You don’t need to kill people. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/51 "2012-01-01T05:44:19Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Plenty of religions throughout history have died off; all that would be necessary is for the present ones to die off without replacement. You don’t need to kill people. But where’s the fun in that? ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/52 "2012-01-01T12:44:38Z")
As an atheist, I’m not sure I’d automatically embrace an atheist majority. Atheism describes what I don’t believe, but doesn’t describe what I do believe. History has shown us some really terrible societies in which religion has, explicitly or implicitly, all but disappeared. And then there’s the issue of the “majority.” In the long run, cultural and intellectual leaders count for more than the majority . . . especially in societies that aren’t very democratic in the first place. So be careful what you wish for. It may become an example of “out of the frying pan, into the fire.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/53 "2012-01-01T13:37:41Z")
> [@Theophane](#): > > If you want a majority atheist world, it would actually be easier to go terraform another planet. If you’re interested in seeing Planet Earth becoming majority atheist, get ready to dig a lot of mass-graves. You will have to kill an awful lot of people. Most of the human race, in fact. The grim task ahead of you will make the Stalinist purges and the Jewish Holocaust look like a church bake-sale. What are you talking about? Nobody here is discussing killing off all but the atheist population. ---
**Author:** ![Theophane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@Theophane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Theophane)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/54 "2012-01-01T14:15:04Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What are you talking about? Nobody here is discussing killing off all but the atheist population. No, you’re expecting the major and minor religions to fade away without incident. Without a murmur of complaint. That’s not realistic. People are passionate about their way of life to the point of defending it with violence. With their very lives. ---
**Author:** ![Theophane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@Theophane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Theophane)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/55 "2012-01-01T14:19:11Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Nah, more likely it’ll come about by religion fading away as something no longer needed and of dubious value, like phrenology. With all due respect, Bryan, you must not understand why religion exists in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/56 "2012-01-01T14:38:34Z")
> [@Theophane](#): > > No, you’re expecting the major and minor religions to fade away without incident. Without a murmur of complaint. That’s not realistic. People are passionate about their way of life to the point of defending it with violence. With their very lives. You’ll know what I’m expecting when you read my posts telling you what I’m expecting. If you don’t mind, I’d like to post my _own_ opinions. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/57 "2012-01-01T14:39:56Z")
I love this question, it’s something I’ve been thinking about myself. I think there is a good chance that science will someday eradicate most religions. And I think that’s a good thing. Forcing that nonsense from the old testament into the young minds of children is damn near criminal. The crap in that book taught me fear, gave me untold nightmares and is what gave me my first panic attack as a young girl. The new testament isn’t much better either, IMO. We can have a fine functioning society without religion. I hope we get there, though I know it won’t be during my life. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/58 "2012-01-01T15:24:02Z")
> [@Theophane](#): > > No, you’re expecting the major and minor religions to fade away without incident. Without a murmur of complaint. That’s not realistic. People are passionate about their way of life to the point of defending it with violence. With their very lives. Which is why such changes would occur on a generational time scale. Just because the parents are passionate doesn’t mean the children or grandchildren are. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/59 "2012-01-01T15:30:48Z")
A big problem is that culture and religion intermingle a whole lot. I’ve taken courses on religion in Japan, and it’s a mess. It’s very, very difficult to discern whether or not Japanese people even qualify as religious, partially because of linguistic… difficulties in translating and asking questions. In general, Japanese people claim they’re not religious, and it’s a thing of the past, but at the same time they’re very superstitious and the culture has a mentality of “better safe than sorry” with their superstitions. On top of that, even if they don’t think they’re religious, there’s still the fact that a large number of people have Shinto and Buddhist altars in their home, because it’s culturally a semi-important thing. There have been tons of interviews done where people routinely go to Buddhist festivals and giving donations and performing the religious ceremonies not because they’re Buddhist, but “because I’m Japanese.” Does this make the person count as religious or not? On top of that, what about symbolism or teachings? If in America everybody stopped “believing in God” but every other TV show still bludgeoned you with Christ symbolism, is it really atheism, or just religion merged with culture? It still likely has the same end effect of enforcing those same cultural values. I don’t know if we can adequately define where “religious” really stops, even if you want to define atheist with it’s actual definition (not believing in any gods), I’m not sure if that would stop everybody from essentially acting as if they were religious in some way due to culture etc etc. It would take nothing short of a bloody coup followed by book burning and a dark age to scrub any remnants of religious mentality from every corner of the culture. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/60 "2012-01-01T17:27:47Z")
> [@Theophane](#): > > With all due respect, Bryan, you must not understand why religion exists in the first place. I have a hypothesis or two, the gist being that religion offers a pseudo-explanation for things that are not immediately obvious to our senses, i.e. what causes thunder and such. As our ability to explain things improves, the need for comforting stopgap “just so” stories will fade. Admittedly, the uber-big questions like “why?” will elude science, but I figure this’ll gradually reduce religion to little more than “A mysterious God started the universe running… then kinda went away, never to be seen or needed again.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913.md?page=4)