# Majority atheist world: How far away are we? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 31, 2011, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913 "2011-12-31T03:19:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/101 "2012-01-04T00:14:56Z")
Only when atheists come up with some decent holidays. In Europe, lots of days off are tied to religion. The Spanish government is proposing moving holidays to Mondays, to improve productivity, but since many of them are Catholic holidays they will need Vatican approval. More seriously, I’d think that a deistic majority or spiritual majority would be effectively equivalent to an atheist majority, and will happen a lot faster. I’d be very happy with a world where most people don’t think a higher power tell them or anyone else what to do and how to live, even if they like to believe in the higher power for comfort. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/102 "2012-01-04T00:55:45Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Well… maybe bold _ **italic** _. Funny, he doesn’t look italic… ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/103 "2012-01-04T00:56:09Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Only when atheists come up with some decent holidays. There’s May Day . . . ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/104 "2012-01-04T01:11:39Z")
And April Fool’s Day. /potshot ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/105 "2012-01-04T01:31:03Z")
Festivus. Your arguments are invalid. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/106 "2012-01-04T02:08:52Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > More seriously, I’d think that a deistic majority or spiritual majority would be effectively equivalent to an atheist majority, and will happen a lot faster. I’d be very happy with a world where most people don’t think a higher power tell them or anyone else what to do and how to live, even if they like to believe in the higher power for comfort. Well, then, let us all be Unitarians! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/107 "2012-01-04T03:48:04Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > You either (a) have trouble reading or (b) you believe that “the West” (in this case the U.S.) equals the world. But whatever. > > The world population grows by about ~1.1% per year. The world’s three major religions-- Islam, Hinduism and Christianity-- have growth rates which exceed world population growth (in that order). This is primarily due to (1) people converting to those religions and (2) religion spreading in areas which have high birth rates. Atheism has a growth rate of ~.3% per year. [There are the numbers for you](http://www.scribd.com/doc/22402021/Global-Statistics-for-All-Religions). > > I’m not responding to the rest of that because it has nothing to do with what I typed out. You assume that ignorance and religion will exist forever, I assume that the increased access to information will help improve education worldwide, when this happens those things will change. But I would also claim that a lot of those counted as theists are not, atheist is a poorly defined term, I include deists and some Buddhists and deists, as those who had originally coined the pejorative term would use it. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/108 "2012-01-04T09:17:53Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Only when atheists come up with some decent holidays. That’s easy - a lot of South African holidays are tied to historic/political events like Independence Day, May Day, [Human Rights Day](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Day_for_the_Elimination_of_Racial_Discrimination) and [Heritage Day](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritage_Day_%28South_Africa%29)(or Braai[barbecue] Day as it’s become known), that should be doable everywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/109 "2012-01-04T16:11:57Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > You assume that ignorance and religion will exist forever, I assume that the increased access to information will help improve education worldwide, when this happens those things will change. You articulated the problem far better than me. I revise my assessment of “bold” to “grim and pessimistic”. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/110 "2012-01-04T16:25:48Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > You assume that ignorance and religion will exist forever . . . Religion will long outlast ignorance. As it should, I guess. In the words of the Reverend Doctor Doctor Mister M.D. David Meyer III, Pope of All New York City and the Great Pacific Northwest, "You do not use your **mind** to think about your **religion!"** ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/111 "2012-01-04T17:02:05Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > You assume that ignorance and religion will exist forever, I assume that the increased access to information will help improve education worldwide, when this happens those things will change. And your assumption-- as is normal around here-- assumes a false adversarial relationship between religion and education. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/112 "2012-01-04T17:33:09Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > FYI, The rising education level of women is the primary reason birth rates decline, it also is the best way to reduce poverty. It just so happens that educated women also are better prepared to make their own choices on reproduction and this lowers the birth rate.. > > Seeing as educated people also tend to be less religious, it follows that these would the countries that are more secular too. There’s a flaw in your argument. Educated and religion generally have a positive relationship, not a negative one, at least in places where Christianity is the dominant religion. Here are some cites: Lehrer, Evelyn. _[Religiosity as a Determinant of Educational Attainment: The Case of Conservative Protestant Women in the United States](http://ideas.repec.org/a/kap/reveho/v2y2004i2p203-219.html)_. Review of Economics of the Household, Springer, vol. 2(2), pages 203-219. This paper examines the role of religiosity as a determinant of the educational attainment of women raised as conservative Protestants in the United States. A human capital model based on the demand and supply of funds for investments in education is used to develop hypotheses about various causal links between religiosity and years of schooling. The hypotheses are tested using data from the 1995 National Survey of Family Growth, a large-scale survey addressed to a representative sample of women in the United States. Among respondents raised as conservative Protestants, those who attended religious services frequently during their adolescent years are found to complete one more year of schooling than their counterparts who were less observant. The gap is smaller, but still sizeable and statistically significant, when other factors are held constant in a multivariate analysis. Iannaccone, Laurence. _[Introduction to the Economics of Religion](http://www.religionomics.com/archives/archive/37/introduction-to-the-economics-of-religion)_. Journal of Economic Literature, 1998. Religion is not the province of the poor or uninformed. In numerous analyses of cross-sectional survey data, rates of religious belief and religious activity tend not to decline with income, and most rates increase with education. Bruce Sacerdote and Edward Glaeser, _[Education and Religion](http://www.nber.org/papers/w8080)_. NBER Working Paper No. 8080 Issued in January 2001 In the United States, religious attendance rises sharply with education across individuals. Regnerus, Mark. [Religion and Positive Adolescent Outcomes: A Review of Research and Theory](Review of Religious Research Vol. 44, No. 4 (Jun., 2003), pp. 394-413). Review of Religious Research Vol. 44, No. 4 (Jun., 2003), pp. 394-413 I review recent research published in academic journals concerning religious influences on several positive outcomes during adolescence: physical and emotional health, education, volunteering and political involvement, and family well-being. Though much less research exists on these outcomes when compared with risk behaviors such as drinking, drug use, and sexual activity, the high-quality studies that do exist point to modest positive influences of religious involvement. That is, more extensive religious involvement is generally associated with positive outcomes during adolescence. > [@](#): > > This is probably the reason that groups like the Taliban or the fundamentalist Christian movement tries to limit the educational choices of women and encourages a submissive life of ignorance, it helps grow the flock. And their male children tend to be less educated too, so there is a larger flock still. The Taliban does that, but no Christian group does so. Instead Christians are actively involved in expanding educational opportunities both in the USA and worldwide. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/113 "2012-01-04T19:38:24Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > There’s a flaw in your argument. Educated and religion generally have a positive relationship, not a negative one, at least in places where Christianity is the dominant religion. Here are some cites: > > Lehrer, Evelyn. _[Religiosity as a Determinant of Educational Attainment: The Case of Conservative Protestant Women in the United States](http://ideas.repec.org/a/kap/reveho/v2y2004i2p203-219.html)_. Review of Economics of the Household, Springer, vol. 2(2), pages 203-219. > > This paper examines the role of religiosity as a determinant of the educational attainment of women raised as conservative Protestants in the United States. A human capital model based on the demand and supply of funds for investments in education is used to develop hypotheses about various causal links between religiosity and years of schooling. The hypotheses are tested using data from the 1995 National Survey of Family Growth, a large-scale survey addressed to a representative sample of women in the United States. Among respondents raised as conservative Protestants, those who attended religious services frequently during their adolescent years are found to complete one more year of schooling than their counterparts who were less observant. The gap is smaller, but still sizeable and statistically significant, when other factors are held constant in a multivariate analysis. > > Iannaccone, Laurence. _[Introduction to the Economics of Religion](http://www.religionomics.com/archives/archive/37/introduction-to-the-economics-of-religion)_. Journal of Economic Literature, 1998. > > Religion is not the province of the poor or uninformed. In numerous analyses of cross-sectional survey data, rates of religious belief and religious activity tend not to decline with income, and most rates increase with education. > > Bruce Sacerdote and Edward Glaeser, _[Education and Religion](http://www.nber.org/papers/w8080)_. NBER Working Paper No. 8080 Issued in January 2001 > > In the United States, religious attendance rises sharply with education across individuals. > > Regnerus, Mark. [Religion and Positive Adolescent Outcomes: A Review of Research and Theory](Review of Religious Research Vol. 44, No. 4 (Jun., 2003), pp. 394-413). Review of Religious Research Vol. 44, No. 4 (Jun., 2003), pp. 394-413 > > I review recent research published in academic journals concerning religious influences on several positive outcomes during adolescence: physical and emotional health, education, volunteering and political involvement, and family well-being. Though much less research exists on these outcomes when compared with risk behaviors such as drinking, drug use, and sexual activity, the high-quality studies that do exist point to modest positive influences of religious involvement. That is, more extensive religious involvement is generally associated with positive outcomes during adolescence. > > The Taliban does that, but no Christian group does so. Instead Christians are actively involved in expanding educational opportunities both in the USA and worldwide. [http://www.economics.harvard.edu/pub/hier/2001/HIER1913.pdf](http://www.economics.harvard.edu/pub/hier/2001/HIER1913.pdf) You may want to go back and read that data. It increases attendance, it does not increase Religiosity, more educated people go for the coffee and not the mythos. I am thinking on a longer multi-generational timeline, it has only become socially tenable to be an open atheist in the past few decades and for the most part it still has a very high social cost to come out as a non-believer. Once again we are developing ways to have social connections and community outside of the the church, the main reason education had an increase in attendance was the increased social interaction, not education increasing a belief in a greater power. Protestants are often very close to agnostic in this country, they do push for education, but many of their followers would probably be agnostic if they did not have the community aspect of the church as a driver, or if it were not still social and economic suicide to publicly state your non-belief. The Internet has allowed individuals to connect outside of churches and to have huge social networks outside of a religious context. Mars Hill like many other Fundamentalist churches do not, they still hold the biblical role of women as subservient as gospel, they do want less educated women…I think the term their Pastor used for men who hold their wives as equals was “Pussified” That is the segment of religion that is growing in the US, the protestants are losing members, the fundamentalists are gaining. ---
**Author:** ![mishagoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ea666f/32.png) [@mishagoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mishagoe)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/114 "2012-01-04T21:11:45Z")
Replying to the OP. There will always be beliefs of some kind, the more the merrier. They essentially involve the same structure - a higher source provides the necessary authority to impose an ethical code of behavior on individuals, such as me and you. The necessary authority is important as neither you nor I will ever have that kind of authority to enforce a specific code of ethical behavior as we woull have to be a constant unchanging source of world wide truth. While I might decide to behave one way today, just on my own authority, I can reverse myself tomorrow and do the opposite, again just on my own authority. Not very likely a person will ever succesfully fullfill that role of a supreme authority. Atheism is kind of interesting in that it is based on the assumption that the only belief worth having is a rationally verifiable one, most likely a science based theory about the nature of the world and our place in it. Unfortunatly we don’t have the full explanation yet and in any case I think to make it work requires an equally fundamental belief that we (humans) will ever get to a full scientific explanation of the world and our place in it. While it certainly looks feasible, no one can map it out and guarantee it. So those of us who are atheist (full disclosure - I am not) will have to belief that someday everything will make sense and be the source of higher authority and that the explanation will include nice things like be as kind as you can to everyone you meet. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/115 "2012-01-04T21:40:21Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > [http://www.economics.harvard.edu/pub/hier/2001/HIER1913.pdf](http://www.economics.harvard.edu/pub/hier/2001/HIER1913.pdf) > > You may want to go back and read that data. > > It increases attendance, it does not increase Religiosity, more educated people go for the coffee and not the mythos. All the data about _individual’s_ religious practices suggests a positive relationship between education and religion. “Religiosity”, of course, is not specifically defined. The only data suggesting a negative relationship of education to any religious measure are found by comparing denominations. If more educated people prefer one denomination to another, that tells us nothing about whether education causes people to become atheists. The idea that more educated people attend religious services more frequently for social reasons is offered as one hypothesis that might explain part of the data; certainly the authors don’t claim that it’s proven. In any case, that’s only one of the four papers I cited documenting positive relationships between education and some aspect of religion. I could cite others, for instance: Lehrer, Evelyn. [Religion and High School Graduation: A Comparative Analysis of Patterns for White and Black Young Women](http://www.ugr.es/~teoriahe/RePEc/gra/paoner/per06_04.pdf) Papers on Economics of Religion 06/04, Department of Economic Theory and Economic History of the University of Granada. Table 4 shows that the probability of high-school graduation is 0.93 for a typical mainline-Protestant respondent (with average characteristics for other variables); the estimates for Mormons (0.91) and Catholics (0.93) are in the same range. In contrast, the probabilities are only 0.86 and 0.84, respectively, for conservative Protestants and the unaffiliated, respectively. C. Simon Fan, _[Religious participation and children’s education: A social capital approach](http://www.ln.edu.hk/econ/staff/fansimon/Fan-religion.pdf)_. Journal of Economic Behavior & Organization, 2006 There is substantial evidence showing that religion has a significant positive impact on children’s educational attainment and future earnings.2 Also, sociologists’ extensive research indicates that youth raised in religious homes are less likely to engage in criminal activity, use drugs or alcohol, and so on.3 Indeed, many religions emphasize hard work, honesty, seriousness, and responsibility, all of which are conducive to children’s acquisition of cognitive and non-cognitive skills. William N. Evans and Robert M. Schwab _[Finishing High School and Starting College: Do Catholic Schools Make a Difference?](http://www.jstor.org/pss/2946645)_ The Quarterly Journal of Economics Vol. 110, No. 4 (Nov., 1995), pp. 941-974 In this paper, we consider two measures of the relative effectiveness of public and Catholic schools: finishing high school and starting college. These measures are potentially more important indicators of school quality than standardized test scores in light of the economic consequences of obtaining more education. Single-equation estimates suggest that for the typical student, attending a Catholic high school raises the probability of finishing high school or entering a four-year college by thirteen percentage points. So I’ve listed seven papers documenting positives ties between religion and education among individuals, and showing that this relationship holds for different age groups, genders, races, and nationalities. In contrast, the evidence for your position is: > [@rat avatar](#): > > Mars Hill like many other Fundamentalist churches do not, they still hold the biblical role of women as subservient as gospel, they do want less educated women…I think the term their Pastor used for men who hold their wives as equals was “Pussified” Looks like a single piece of anecdotal evidence with no cite. I think my evidence is stronger. > [@](#): > > I am thinking on a longer multi-generational timeline, it has only become socially tenable to be an open atheist in the past few decades and for the most part it still has a very high social cost to come out as a non-believer. > > Once again we are developing ways to have social connections and community outside of the the church, the main reason education had an increase in attendance was the increased social interaction, not education increasing a belief in a greater power. > > Protestants are often very close to agnostic in this country, they do push for education, but many of their followers would probably be agnostic if they did not have the community aspect of the church as a driver, or if it were not still social and economic suicide to publicly state your non-belief. There’s no evidence for any of this. ---
**Author:** ![IMfez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@IMfez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IMfez)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/116 "2012-01-04T22:13:26Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > Thank you for a well written, well cited post! I’m a fairly strong atheist and you’ve certainly made me rethink my assumptions about religion ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2012, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/117 "2012-01-04T23:33:07Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > All the data about _individual’s_ religious practices suggests a positive relationship between education and religion. “Religiosity”, of course, is not specifically defined. The only data suggesting a negative relationship of education to any religious measure are found by comparing denominations. If more educated people prefer one denomination to another, that tells us nothing about whether education causes people to become atheists. The idea that more educated people attend religious services more frequently for social reasons is offered as one hypothesis that might explain part of the data; certainly the authors don’t claim that it’s proven. > > In any case, that’s only one of the four papers I cited documenting positive relationships between education and some aspect of religion. I could cite others, for instance: > > Lehrer, Evelyn. [Religion and High School Graduation: A Comparative Analysis of Patterns for White and Black Young Women](http://www.ugr.es/~teoriahe/RePEc/gra/paoner/per06_04.pdf) Papers on Economics of Religion 06/04, Department of Economic Theory and Economic History of the University of Granada. > > Table 4 shows that the probability of high-school graduation is 0.93 for a typical mainline-Protestant respondent (with average characteristics for other variables); the estimates for Mormons (0.91) and Catholics (0.93) are in the same range. In contrast, the probabilities are only 0.86 and 0.84, respectively, for conservative Protestants and the unaffiliated, respectively. > > C. Simon Fan, _[Religious participation and children’s education: A social capital approach](http://www.ln.edu.hk/econ/staff/fansimon/Fan-religion.pdf)_. Journal of Economic Behavior & Organization, 2006 > > There is substantial evidence showing that religion has a significant positive impact on children’s educational attainment and future earnings.2 Also, sociologists’ extensive research indicates that youth raised in religious homes are less likely to engage in criminal activity, use drugs or alcohol, and so on.3 Indeed, many religions emphasize hard work, honesty, seriousness, and responsibility, all of which are conducive to children’s acquisition of cognitive and non-cognitive skills. > > William N. Evans and Robert M. Schwab _[Finishing High School and Starting College: Do Catholic Schools Make a Difference?](http://www.jstor.org/pss/2946645)_ The Quarterly Journal of Economics > Vol. 110, No. 4 (Nov., 1995), pp. 941-974 > > In this paper, we consider two measures of the relative effectiveness of public and Catholic schools: finishing high school and starting college. These measures are potentially more important indicators of school quality than standardized test scores in light of the economic consequences of obtaining more education. Single-equation estimates suggest that for the typical student, attending a Catholic high school raises the probability of finishing high school or entering a four-year college by thirteen percentage points. > > So I’ve listed seven papers documenting positives ties between religion and education among individuals, and showing that this relationship holds for different age groups, genders, races, and nationalities. In contrast, the evidence for your position is: > Looks like a single piece of anecdotal evidence with no cite. I think my evidence is stronger. > There’s no evidence for any of this. the first study compares the graduation rate of religous and non-religous persons, not the effect of education on religiosity, it also shows that more conservative and Catholics do worse than main line protestants. > [@](#): > > “This survey contains information on the religious affiliation in which the respondents were raised and their frequency of attendance to religious services at age 14, thus making it possible to examine how both of these dimensions of childhood religion are related to the probability of going on to successful completion of secondary schooling.” The second kind of works for my argument, saying that the advantage of attending church has a “social capitol” value > [@](#): > > “This paper links religion to education and posits that individuals participate in religious ac- > tivities not only because of their religious beliefs, but also because religion is conducive to their > children’s human capital formation.” I have already conceded that people will participate in religion in order to gain social and economic benefit, and that there is a social and economic cost to not belonging to that group in this country. The third study also just covers the likelihood of religious schools to graduate students [http://www.pitzer.edu/academics/faculty/zuckerman/Ath-Chap-under-7000.pdf](http://www.pitzer.edu/academics/faculty/zuckerman/Ath-Chap-under-7000.pdf) > [@](#): > > Concerning international poverty rates, the United Nations’ Report on the > World Social Situation (2003) found that of the 40 poorest nations on earth, all but > 20one (Vietnam) are highly religious nations with statistically minimal or > insignificant levels of atheism. Concerning illiteracy rates, the same report found > that of the 35 nations with the highest levels of youth illiteracy rates, all are > highly religious nations with statistically insignificant levels of organic atheism. I’ll follow on with more cites later but can you come back with ones that are related to the discussion? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2012, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/118 "2012-01-05T00:27:01Z")
Well, whenever it happens, it won’t be soon enough. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2012, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/119 "2012-01-05T00:50:18Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, whenever it happens, it won’t be soon enough. Because the world will be a better place, right? ---
**Author:** ![PigArcher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bcef8e/32.png) [@PigArcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PigArcher)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2012, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913/120 "2012-01-05T00:54:29Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Because the world will be a better place, right? I doubt it would have to much effect on people’s day-to-day lives, as the checks and balances built into most democratic governments prevent the religious from having too much power. But not having to waste any time or energy opposing zealots trying to force their views on everyone would be better. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/majority-atheist-world-how-far-away-are-we/607913.md?page=7)