# Making of the Grand Canyon. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 19, 2008, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607 "2008-10-19T03:24:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/21 "2008-10-20T01:16:50Z")
> [@DanBlather](#): > > At that point the Devil created all the copies of the bible and planted false memories in peoples’ minds to make them think that Christianity existed all along. What was his (or her) motivation for doing this? ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/22 "2008-10-20T02:16:27Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > This wasn’t much of an actual GQ anyway. Moving to MPSIMS. > > Colibri > General Questions Moderator Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/23 "2008-10-20T04:36:34Z")
The Grand Canyon was dug in the mid-1960s by NASA as part of the moon-landing hoax. ---
**Author:** ![gravitycrash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@gravitycrash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gravitycrash)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/24 "2008-10-20T04:45:28Z")
Until people question the Koran as much as the Bible around here I really don’t know what to say. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/25 "2008-10-20T04:59:06Z")
> [@gravitycrash](#): > > Until people question the Koran as much as the Bible around here I really don’t know what to say. I’m sure that’ll happen, just as soon as Dopers are pestered by numbskull Muslims as much as they’re pestered by numbskull Christians. Since most Dopers live in the US, which is like, 90% Christian (most of whom I hope are not numbskulls) and 2% Muslim (ditto), I’m not holding my breath. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/26 "2008-10-20T06:34:33Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > What was his (or her) motivation for doing this? He wanted to create a mechanism by which people could justify doing evil things. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/27 "2008-10-20T09:03:22Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > I’m sure that’ll happen, just as soon as Dopers are pestered by numbskull Muslims as much as they’re pestered by numbskull Christians. > > Since most Dopers live in the US, which is like, 90% Christian (most of whom I hope are not numbskulls) and 2% Muslim (ditto), I’m not holding my breath. Muslims tend not to proselytise. I have lived in a very Islamic area for many, many years, and I’ve seen it a grand total of ONE time: a couple of guys standing outside a shopping centre quietly handing out leaflets to anybody interested. But the Christians are always at it. I once asked a Muslim friend if such activity was forbidden. His answer was along the lines of, “Er… not really. We can do it if we like, but we don’t see much point.” ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/28 "2008-10-20T10:33:50Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > The Grand Canyon was dug in the mid-1960s by NASA as part of the moon-landing hoax. Actually, it was built for the less known NASA Mars-landing hoax. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/29 "2008-10-20T12:23:35Z")
> [@Shawn1767](#): > > This is why creationists get laughed at: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BS5vid4GkEY](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BS5vid4GkEY) > The link is to a video titled “Why creationists get laughed at.” And it’s basically a guy pointing out the mistakes in a creationists’ allegations. The first one is the formation of the Grand Canyon. Check it out, although I don’t know how helpful it may be. I’ve seen that guy before (the creationist featured on the video) - he’s produced a series of particularly arrogant and aggressively dumb videos arguing his case - I forget his name - I’ll see if I can find some of his other stuff later. The argument that the sedimentary rocks forming the Grand Canyon were laid down by the Biblical flood, then carved away as the waters receded is one that’s so dumb it actually makes me angry. Sediments laid down underwater for a year are never going to be anything more than mud. You can’t stack up a mile of mud and expect it to stay stacked when you start carving deep holes in it. The walls would have slumped and collapsed. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/30 "2008-10-20T12:30:41Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I’ve seen that guy before (the creationist featured on the video) - he’s produced a series of particularly arrogant and aggressively dumb videos arguing his case - I forget his name - I’ll see if I can find some of his other stuff later. > > The argument that the sedimentary rocks forming the Grand Canyon were laid down by the Biblical flood, then carved away as the waters receded is one that’s so dumb it actually makes me angry. Sediments laid down underwater for a year are never going to be anything more than mud. > You can’t stack up a mile of mud and expect it to stay stacked when you start carving deep holes in it. The walls would have slumped and collapsed. Aren’t we in gnats/camels territory here? Not that I am suggesting you are voluntarily swallowing camels I’m sure, but given that these guys are trying to ram a herd of camels down your throat, it seems illogical to complain only about one of them in particular. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/31 "2008-10-20T23:10:19Z")
I may complain about others in due course - it just happens that I’ve run across this guy in my (virtual) travels - and this one is obnoxious for reasons quite distinct from the mere fact that he’s wrong. I can’t seem to find any of his stuff any more though - and I can’t remember his name. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/32 "2008-10-20T23:33:52Z")
I’m not sure I was very clear. What I was meaning was that given that this guy is proposing intervention by a god to create a flood in the first place, presumably the same god could just make the pile of mud into sandstone too. In other words any plot holes are going to get handwaved with the phrase “goddidit” anyway, so why worry? ---
**Author:** ![Charger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df788c/32.png) [@Charger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charger)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/33 "2008-10-20T23:37:05Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > Enough water at enough speed could have created the Grand Canyon during a relatively short great flood. Never mind the fact that it’d have to have been unnatural quantities of water and pressure, it really could be done if you stretch the imagination. It doesn’t explain the millions of years of strata, though. So let’s say the Great Flood did create the Grand Canyon, and this it was a 1,000,000 psi of water for 40 days which caused the canyon. What about the strata? It amazes me how frequently people think of it the wrong way and overlook the fact that the canyon _could have_ been formed rather quickly, but the strata _had_ to have taken millions of years. The shame of it is, though, that the debate is rooted in “using” the Grand Canyon as evidence of either side. Either way, the 6,000-year creationists lose. I like the fact that Genesis got the chronology correct, but that it’s been translated to a six “day” creation. The willingness of some to adhere to each phase of the formation of Earth, and its inhabitants, is downright embarrassing. > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I’m a Christian, and I believe that the Grand Canyon was created by erosion over millions of years. I believe that Darwin was right about evolution. And I believe that people who think that the world is only 6,000 years old because that’s what the bible says are really, really stupid. I am right there with you. The Earth Age/evolution debate starts at the pulpit, not at the Bible. I am of the opinion that there are plenty of things in the Bible that are not meant to be taken literally, by anyone. And, as a Christian, I am not ashamed to admit that there are a lot of sheep-like, blind followers among us who believe anything they are told by church authority. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2008, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/34 "2008-10-20T23:56:26Z")
> [@gravitycrash](#): > > Until people question the Koran as much as the Bible around here I really don’t know what to say. Where on this message board have you ever seen someone uncriticially accept the claim that the Koran is the literal word of God? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/35 "2008-10-21T00:05:02Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > I’m not sure I was very clear. What I was meaning was that given that this guy is proposing intervention by a god to create a flood in the first place, presumably the same god could just make the pile of mud into sandstone too. In other words any plot holes are going to get handwaved with the phrase “goddidit” anyway, so why worry? Yeah, except to be honest, I think that sort of argument is actually uncommon with flood apologists - they will construct all sorts of elaborate physical explanations (such as vapour canopies, or Noah’s ark with a moon pool, air conditioning and dung elevators), but actually don’t very often resort to saying god did it, unless it’s already stated that way in their text or dogma. Ad hoc ‘goddidit’ arguments aren’t really as common as all that. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/36 "2008-10-21T00:27:16Z")
> [@Napier](#): > > Is there, in your view, something specific, factual and testable that distinguishes the intellegence of people who believe the “6000 year old” element of Christian teaching from the larger group who believes any of the elements of Christian teaching? Yes, if they believe that the world is 6,000 years old, they are stupid and fall into the subgroup of Christians who are stupid. If they believe that we should treat each other with care and love, then they fall into the larger category of Christians who may not necessarily be stupid. Is that specific, factual and testable enough for you? ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/37 "2008-10-21T00:36:19Z")
With the flood bit I go with show me how the ark built to the size stated could physically contain the volume of two of every animal. Pack them in tits to asshole like cord wood, and you still can’t fit them in. Maybe it was a TARDIS with a working chameleon circuit. Those darn Time Lords always meddling in Earth’s affairs. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/38 "2008-10-21T00:50:30Z")
> [@Harmonious\_Discord](#): > > With the flood bit I go with show me how the ark built to the size stated could physically contain the volume of two of every animal. Pack them in tits to asshole like cord wood, and you still can’t fit them in. Maybe it was a TARDIS with a working chameleon circuit. Those darn Time Lords always meddling in Earth’s affairs. That’s where the ‘two of every _kind_’ thing comes in. Just don’t ask for a useful definition of ‘kind’. ---
**Author:** ![Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fish)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/39 "2008-10-21T16:57:49Z")
> [@Harmonious\_Discord](#): > > Pack them in tits to asshole like cord wood, and you still can’t fit them in. And even if you could, the boat probably wouldn’t float very well. If the Grand Canyon were carved out in a single year by the Great Flood, where is all the silt? There should be a Grand-Canyon-sized pile of rubble somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2008, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607/40 "2008-10-21T17:20:20Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I’m a Christian, and I believe that the Grand Canyon was created by erosion over millions of years. I believe that Darwin was right about evolution. And I believe that people who think that the world is only 6,000 years old because that’s what the bible says are really, really stupid. I just checked with my christian co-worker, and he says you’re not a christian. He also said that you will go to hell for these beliefs. Just thought you would like to know that, so you can get your spiritual shit together before it’s too late. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/making-of-the-grand-canyon/468607.md?page=3)