# "Man-boy" films **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 8, 2006, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994 "2006-01-08T07:12:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/1 "2006-01-08T07:12:54Z")
I am going to use a term coined by my GF - “Man-boy” - basically meaning a full grown adult male (usually mid 20s or older) who essentially acts like a juevenile and suffers from a kind of arrested development. The most famous example of this would have to be Adam Sandler’s Billy Madison. Now, initially it seemed like this movie genre came about in the 90s. Examples would be: Billy Madison Happy Gilmore Tommy Boy A Night at the Roxberry Whipped Tomcats Dude Where’s My Car Harlold & Khumar go to White Castle What they have in common is that the characters are well above the age where they should be out of school and in the real world - usually mid 20s or older. They are often unemployed yet seem to have plenty of disposable income for partying. They are usually not in serious relationships or approach them in a juvenile manner. Now recently, there seems to be a whole slew of movies where the characters are in their 30s and even older and suffer from the same maturity issues: Big Daddy Old School Weding Crashers Anchorman The 40 Year Old Virgin So what’s the deal? Are all these movies a reflection of a Gen-X culture that never fully matured into adulthood? Or have there always been films like this, but I just haven’t seen any from before 1990? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/2 "2006-01-08T07:14:20Z")
You can find the answer in _Fight Club_. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/3 "2006-01-08T07:42:14Z")
What about one of the perennial candidates for Worst Movie Ever, [_Clifford_](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0109447/combined)? (This is a subgenre of a genre my friend Kimb calls these “stupid white boy movies” which includes most SNL-alum movies, and fratboy movies, etc. A genre I usually avoid, although I did like _Dude Where’s My Car._) ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/4 "2006-01-08T07:42:45Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > You can find the answer in _Fight Club_. Dude! Shut up! Remember rule #1? ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/5 "2006-01-08T07:46:38Z")
Oh! oh! the emperor’s new clothes flagship of this genre is _Forrest Gump!_ Or maybe it’s more like a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Those movies give grownup men “permission” to act like children. Or at least, it gives them an excuse for resenting the responsibilities of grownup life. _Forrest Gump_ is the only one that ever pretended to be a “serious” movie though. Oh and _Big_. ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/6 "2006-01-08T07:53:44Z")
I have to disagree about _Forrest Gump_. He was responsible man with a child-like mind. He holds down jobs, takes care of his ailing mother and spouse and rears his child. He’s a good friend to Lt. Dan, even when Dan tried to repel him. All in all, except for the IQ of 80, he’s a grownup. StG ---
**Author:** ![Darkhold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@Darkhold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkhold)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/7 "2006-01-08T07:57:30Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Oh! oh! the emperor’s new clothes flagship of this genre is _Forrest Gump!_ Or maybe it’s more like a wolf in sheep’s clothing. > > Those movies give grownup men “permission” to act like children. Or at least, it gives them an excuse for resenting the responsibilities of grownup life. _Forrest Gump_ is the only one that ever pretended to be a “serious” movie though. > > Oh and _Big_. Errr…what? Forest Gump is about a mentally retarded man. How is that connected to giving grownup men permission to act like children? If anything he takes on MORE responsiblity for his life then he should. Not saying it’s a great movie or anything I just don’t see any connection to the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/8 "2006-01-08T08:01:54Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > What about one of the perennial candidates for Worst Movie Ever, [_Clifford_](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0109447/combined)? > > (This is a subgenre of a genre my friend Kimb calls these “stupid white boy movies” which includes most SNL-alum movies, and fratboy movies, etc. A genre I usually avoid, although I did like _Dude Where’s My Car._) I usually hate those kinds of movies too, but I loved The 40-Year-Old Virgin because it actually had a lot of heart and a good message, when it could have been very mean-spirited. Also, it was funny as hell. And Harold and Kumar Go To White Castle surprised the hell out of me, for being funny and not lame. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/9 "2006-01-08T08:03:25Z")
While “40 Year Old Virgin” does have a main character with emotional issues, I think it is wrong to call it a movie where the characters act like juvenilles. They all have a decent jobs, and they don’t act like like the characters in Billy Madison or Tommy Boy at all. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/10 "2006-01-08T08:20:04Z")
I’ve heard _Harold and Maude_ described in this way. I suppose _Jack_ also counts? The characters in _The 40-Year-Old Virgin_ definitely have the relationship issues described by the OP, but I wouldn’t call that “arrested development” by any stretch. Aside from Andy, I saw them as guys in their late 20s to early 30s who worked jobs that bored them, made little effort at work, and had their fun with sarcasm and partying in their free time. In my limited real-life experience, that seems very normal. ---
**Author:** ![Ooner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c67d28/32.png) [@Ooner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ooner)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/11 "2006-01-08T08:24:00Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > While “40 Year Old Virgin” does have a main character with emotional issues, I think it is wrong to call it a movie where the characters act like juvenilles. They all have a decent jobs, and they don’t act like like the characters in Billy Madison or Tommy Boy at all. Billy Madison is just an extreme example, that doesn’t mean that the characters in the 40 Year Old Virgin don’t fit the theme as well. Sure they all have jobs but 90% of the movie is indeed them being very very juvenile in all of their actions and conversations, particularly about sex. I think it fits the topic of the thread perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/12 "2006-01-08T08:56:30Z")
> [@Ooner](#): > > Billy Madison is just an extreme example, that doesn’t mean that the characters in the 40 Year Old Virgin don’t fit the theme as well. Sure they all have jobs but 90% of the movie is indeed them being very very juvenile in all of their actions and conversations, particularly about sex. I think it fits the topic of the thread perfectly. Unless you think all 20 something males are juvenile 😉 (though that is something for another thread). Frankly, one of the reasons I loved the flick is because all the characters seemed real (well Carrell was a reeeal streach :D). ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/13 "2006-01-08T08:57:34Z")
Or basically what **Marley23** said :D. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/14 "2006-01-08T10:44:32Z")
> [@Darkhold](#): > > Errr…what? Forest Gump is about a mentally retarded man. How is that connected to giving grownup men permission to act like children? If anything he takes on MORE responsiblity for his life then he should. > > Not saying it’s a great movie or anything I just don’t see any connection to the OP. Forrest Gump gives you permission not to give a damn; to just passively let whatever’s gonna happen, happen. It makes a virtue out of irresponsibility. It raises passive stupidity to a level of near-holiness. To me it feels like somehow like paean to the holy state of stupid-white-man-'ness; stupid white men are beloved of god. Forrest Gump was made to appeal to the slacker in all of us; I think it indulges the worst, the most amoral impulses that are the weakest part of the American character. I just think most of these other movies are thinner, shallower glosses on the same themes. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/15 "2006-01-08T10:48:43Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Forrest Gump gives you permission not to give a damn; to just passively let whatever’s gonna happen, happen. It makes a virtue out of irresponsibility. It raises passive stupidity to a level of near-holiness. To me it feels like somehow like paean to the holy state of stupid-white-man-'ness; stupid white men are beloved of god. Forrest Gump was made to appeal to the slacker in all of us; I think it indulges the worst, the most amoral impulses that are the weakest part of the American character. I just think most of these other movies are thinner, shallower glosses on the same themes. Oh, and, Forrest Gump’s portrait of the Stupid White Man as the American Everyman is presented entirely without irony; as a \*good \*thing. While the book, presenting the same portrait, did so as a vicious, nasty satire. The movie celebrates everything the book detests. ---
**Author:** ![Darkhold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@Darkhold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkhold)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/16 "2006-01-08T11:10:12Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Forrest Gump gives you permission not to give a damn; to just passively let whatever’s gonna happen, happen. It makes a virtue out of irresponsibility. It raises passive stupidity to a level of near-holiness. To me it feels like somehow like paean to the holy state of stupid-white-man-'ness; stupid white men are beloved of god. Forrest Gump was made to appeal to the slacker in all of us; I think it indulges the worst, the most amoral impulses that are the weakest part of the American character. I just think most of these other movies are thinner, shallower glosses on the same themes. Well he started a shirmping buisiness on his own and worked hard at it until a stroke of luck helped him. He was a war hero that carried men that would have died without him. Stupid? Of course he was stupid but he wasn’t lazy or a slacker. Hell he even mowed lawns in his spare time just for the fun of it. He was far from lazy just bewildered. I also read the book and I don’t get that it was anything of the sort you claim. It was certainly satire of american life but not of Forest himself. ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/17 "2006-01-08T11:25:03Z")
The audience for these films is in the teenage bracket, yet few actors actually in that age bracket have the ability to carry such roles. Kind of like playing Hamlet; by the time you’re old enough to do it well you’re too old to be plausible as Gertrude’s son. ---
**Author:** ![brianmelendez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/65b543/32.png) [@brianmelendez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brianmelendez)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/18 "2006-01-08T12:39:43Z")
What about [_Alfie_](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0060086/) (1966)? ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/19 "2006-01-08T14:49:12Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > I have to disagree about _Forrest Gump_. He was responsible man with a child-like mind. He holds down jobs, takes care of his ailing mother and spouse and rears his child. He’s a good friend to Lt. Dan, even when Dan tried to repel him. All in all, except for the IQ of 80, he’s a grownup. Agreed. Forrest is very mature and responsible. He just has mental disabilities. There’s nothing wrong with the guys from Old School other than they can’t grow up. > [@ISiddiqui](#): > > While “40 Year Old Virgin” does have a main character with emotional issues, I think it is wrong to call it a movie where the characters act like juvenilles. They all have a decent jobs, and they don’t act like like the characters in Billy Madison or Tommy Boy at all. The three supporting characters don’t act like BM or TB because they don’t come from wealthy families. But they are the same. They are around 30 years old. They can be characterized as a stoner, a playa’ and an emotionally immature man-child. None of them take their job seriously and retail store clerk is not a serious career anyway. Their entire life consists of drinking and hooking up. > [@brianmelendez](#): > > What about Alfie (1966)? I though about that. Never saw the movie, but it’s my understanding is that Alfie is relatively sophisticated. He’s just a womanizer. Frank the Tank or those other characters are not sophisticated. It’s like their lives peaked as a frat boy senior year and they never gave up the lifestyle. > [@Mk VII](#): > > The audience for these films is in the teenage bracket, yet few actors actually in that age bracket have the ability to carry such roles. I disagree. I’m 33 and every one of my coworkers has seen 40 Year Old Virgin and/or Weding Crashers. We grew up on Sandler. An 18 year old can’t really relate to many of the jokes in Office Space or Old School the same way as a 25-35 year old can. Animal House, Road Trip and American Pie are about teenagers doing teenager stuff. Those other films are about full grown adults doing teenager stuff. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2006, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994/20 "2006-01-08T14:59:59Z")
Just to make a contrast, in movies like American Weding, High Fidelity, and older movies like Fandango or St Elmos Fire, the characters have a “coming of age”. We are introduced to them while they are in a transition state. They are forced to come to terms with the fact that the party is indeed over and they are entering an adult world where they must perform at jobs and manage adult relationships. Even the characters from Animal House went on to real jobs. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-boy-films/338994.md?page=2)