# Man dies from "splenectomy" where they removed his LIVER instead! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 6, 2024, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842 "2024-09-06T02:06:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![teelabrown](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/teelabrown/32/8412_2.png) [@teelabrown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teelabrown)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2024, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/101 "2024-09-15T10:32:46Z")
> [@Seanette](#): > > but did no other “medical professional” in that room have working eyes and a functioning brain? That’s what I was thinking. Did every surgeon’s assistant and nurse just go along with the head surgeon’s delusion? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2024, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/102 "2024-09-15T14:39:52Z")
That’s interesting. The wiki even designates [Osteopathic Medicine in the US](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_medicine_in_the_United_States) as a different category from [Osteopathy.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathy) I’ve worked with DOs here in the US, and seen them as doctors a couple of times. No difference between them and MDs here, though I’ve noticed some defensiveness on their part about the different designation. I assume that’s because people may think they’re chiropractors or something else and they get tired of explaining it. So we may find this poor guy was under the impression this was an actual medical doctor and not some kind of quack. And while this does not appear to be an intentional homicide I’d say it falls under the category of ‘depraved indifference to human life’. Maybe not in France, and difficult to convict here in the US I suppose, but if it came before a jury here I could see a unanimous guilty verdict resulting. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2024, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/103 "2024-09-15T15:04:11Z")
The doctor in this case _was_ a DO and presumably was licensed etc or he wouldn’t have had hospital privileges. “Depraved indifference” has a meaning that usually doesn’t include negligence. It typically involves intentional behavior without a specific intent to harm or kill anyone , such as firing a gun into a crowd. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2024, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/104 "2024-09-15T16:02:48Z")
> [@teelabrown](#): > > > [@Seanette](#): > > > > but did no other “medical professional” in that room have working eyes and a functioning brain? > > That’s what I was thinking. Did every surgeon’s assistant and nurse just go along with the head surgeon’s delusion? Many surgeons have a well deserved reputation for arrogance to the point of attacking and destroying the careers of other medical professionals who question them on even the smallest details. Not that this excuses the gross neglect and indifference to harm in not identifying the error and speaking up, but it is a pervasive problem in surgical medicine. As others have noted, there is no way a competent physician or even a surgical nurse could ever have confused the spleen and liver. Not only do they look nothing alike and are on opposite sides of the body, the spleen has a dedicated blood supply (the splenic artery and vein) which would have to be tied off and which look nothing like that going to the liver. While there are conditions where the spleen can expand and grossly deform, the explanation the surgeon gave that the spleen had “migrated” to the location of the liver is totally nonsensical. > [@LSLGuy](#): > > I wonder how much of these kind of events are related to the trend to minimally invasive procedures? Resection of an entire organ, especially the liver, is the opposite thing from minimally invasive. And any medical student (much less licensed surgeon) who has gone through gross anatomy should be able to distinguish between the spleen and liver. There is really no excuse for this other than that the surgeon was intoxicated, mentally impaired through stroke or senility, or just so utterly incompetent that he should never have been granted license to practice any form of medicine much less internal surgery. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2024, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/105 "2024-09-16T22:54:20Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > And any medical student (much less licensed surgeon) who has gone through gross anatomy should be able to distinguish between the spleen and liver. I mean, I’m pretty sure that I could recognize a liver. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2024, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/106 "2024-09-16T23:24:03Z")
Aren’t they usually covered with bacon and onions? That should have been the give away. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2024, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/107 "2024-09-16T23:38:13Z")
Nah, it looks like this. [![](https://www.seriouseats.com/thmb/aDBNztVRsnLX99LGbmSZrnwbmMw=/750x0/filters:no_upscale():max_bytes(150000):strip_icc():format(webp)/ __opt__ aboutcom __coeus__ resources __content_migration__ serious_eats __seriouseats.com__ 2018 __10__ 20181023-chopped-liver-vicky-wasik-19-1500x1125-3544fed895024c8d9ec7c87b15bb562b.jpg) ](https://www.seriouseats.com/thmb/aDBNztVRsnLX99LGbmSZrnwbmMw=/750x0/filters:no_upscale():max_bytes(150000):strip_icc():format(webp)/ __opt__ aboutcom __coeus__ resources __content_migration__ serious_eats __seriouseats.com__ 2018 __10__ 20181023-chopped-liver-vicky-wasik-19-1500x1125-3544fed895024c8d9ec7c87b15bb562b.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2024, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/108 "2024-09-17T00:24:44Z")
Except from DoorDash; they deliver food. ---
**Author:** ![Pazu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pazu/32/15522_2.png) [@Pazu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pazu)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2024, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/109 "2024-10-06T20:35:08Z")
More details on the unfortunate event. Based on the reporting here, it sounds like the pathologist didn’t mince words. > **[Witnesses in OR Give Harrowing Account of Spleen Surgery Gone Wrong](https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/features/112209)** > > Florida health department issued an emergency license suspension for Thomas Shaknovsky, DO ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2024, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/110 "2024-10-06T20:50:12Z")
> [@Pazu](#): > > More details on the unfortunate event. Based on the reporting here, it sounds like the pathologist didn’t mince words. > > [https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/features/112209](https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/features/112209) - Technically, it was liver surgery. An emergency license suspension took over a month? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2024, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/111 "2024-10-06T21:52:40Z")
From the linked article: > The family hasn’t filed a lawsuit yet because medical malpractice lawsuits in Florida must first go through a pre-suit process, which can take 6 to 9 months, Zarzaur said previously. The Walton County Sheriff’s Office also previously said that it was reviewing the facts of the case to determine “if anything criminal took place.” > > Despite the emergency suspension of his license in Florida, Shaknovsky maintains an active license in Alabama, and as of press time it was not impacted by the Florida discipline. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2024, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/112 "2024-10-06T21:57:39Z")
I hope that the hospital suspended his privileges _immediately_. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/113 "2024-10-07T00:20:59Z")
Or at least stop him from doing more spleen operations. Who knows what he’d go after next time. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/114 "2024-10-07T01:03:16Z")
Probably the funny bone, or maybe the spare ribs. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/115 "2024-10-07T02:01:08Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > …or maybe the spare ribs. It’s an easy $100. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/116 "2024-10-07T02:06:40Z")
And I hope Alabama does the same thing with his license when word reaches/reached them. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/117 "2024-10-07T02:24:27Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I’ve worked with DOs here in the US, and seen them as doctors a couple of times. No difference between them and MDs here, though I’ve noticed some defensiveness on their part about the different designation. I assume that’s because people may think they’re chiropractors or something else and they get tired of explaining it. They might wish to reject [this bit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_Osteopathic_Medicine) if they’re all that tired of it (the link goes to Wiki): > One notable difference between DO and MD training is that DOs spend an additional 300–500 hours to study pseudoscientific hands-on manipulation of the human musculoskeletal system ([osteopathic manipulative technique](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_manipulative_technique)) alongside conventional [evidence-based medicine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidence-based_medicine) and surgery like their MD peers. > [@gnoitall](#): > > Who knows what he’d go after next time. [Here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_(game)#Play_pieces)’s a whole list of ~~targets~~ things to practice removing. ---
**Author:** ![Seanette](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/seanette/32/9139_2.png) [@Seanette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seanette)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/118 "2024-10-07T02:24:42Z")
Requires creating an account. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/119 "2024-10-07T02:46:31Z")
I just checked the site and it did not require me to make an account. ---
**Author:** ![Seanette](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/seanette/32/9139_2.png) [@Seanette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seanette)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2024, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842/120 "2024-10-07T02:48:08Z")
Maybe you already had one? It wouldn’t allow me to read the article without creating an account. I’m using Chrome. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/man-dies-from-splenectomy-where-they-removed-his-liver-instead/1006842.md?page=7)