# Manafort and Cohen both guilty
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [August 21, 2018, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009 "2018-08-21T21:39:57Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/21 "2018-08-22T02:26:52Z")
> [@running\_coach](#):
>
> If their skeletons are that serious, then they’re not quality people.
You don’t think someone could screw up 15 to 20 years ago and be a good person today?
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### Author:  [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/22 "2018-08-22T02:42:40Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> You don’t think someone could screw up 15 to 20 years ago and be a good person today?
Depends on how old they were 20 years ago and what they did. Though doing something that rises to (true) skeleton level is pretty serious.
A single mistake is one thing. People like Trump, Cohen and Manafort have certainly been rotten clear through since at least high school.
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### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/23 "2018-08-22T04:54:21Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> You don’t think someone could screw up 15 to 20 years ago and be a good person today?
What the hell does this have with either Manafort or Cohen?
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### Author:  [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/24 "2018-08-22T05:22:33Z")
I think the conversation went like this:
**UV** : Too bad these guys got caught. Now other qualified folks will not run for office, because they don’t want their skeletons to fall out of the closet.
**Others** : If their skeletons are that bad, we don’t want them.
Etc, etc, etc.
IMO, not much to do with either Manafort or Cohen, and I don’t agree with the sentiment.
[Further developments](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/cohens-claim-about-trump-may-spark-calls-for-impeachment-but-is-unlikely-to-lead-to-charges/2018/08/21/4e432aec-a167-11e8-93e3-24d1703d2a7a_story.html?utm_term=.9757eedd3e39) - as part of Cohen’s plea, he talks about his campaign finance law violations.
> [@](#):
>
> Michael Cohen, who spent a decade as a lawyer for Trump, told a judge Tuesday that he was directed by Trump to coordinate payments to two women designed to prevent them from disclosing alleged affairs with the real estate mogul before the presidential election, in violation of campaign finance law.
Cohen has now stated that Trump has broken the law. Where do we go from here? As I understand it, the current interpretation is that charges cannot be brought against a sitting president. Is that only for crimes committed in office, or is it for anything? These particular crimes were committed prior to the election. Is the only remedy from this point impeachment?
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### Author:  [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/25 "2018-08-22T05:35:48Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#):
>
> Cohen has now stated that Trump has broken the law. Where do we go from here? As I understand it, the current interpretation is that charges cannot be brought against a sitting president. Is that only for crimes committed in office, or is it for anything? These particular crimes were committed prior to the election. Is the only remedy from this point impeachment?
That’s my understanding, as well. AIUI, it’s not a matter of when the alleged crimes were committed, so much as the prevailing legal theory is that a sitting president can’t be subjected to an indictment.
While he’s president, impeachment seems to be the only remedy (and still seems incredibly unlikely, so long as the GOP controls at least the House). Once he leaves office, he could well then be indicted.
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### Author:  [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/26 "2018-08-22T06:17:27Z")
So far in Trump’s presidency, his national security adviser, personal lawyer, campaign chairman, deputy campaign manager, and a foreign policy aide have all admitted to or been convicted of crimes… so far.
Swamp drained ✔
… and converted into a cesspool…
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### Author:  [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/27 "2018-08-22T06:24:33Z")
Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
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### Author:  [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/28 "2018-08-22T06:28:46Z")
_20 dead hookers found in the concrete below Trump Tower_
So what? They’re American hookers! No collusion! Lock her up!
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### Author:  [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/29 "2018-08-22T06:30:41Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#):
>
> Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
Well, Manafort’s convictions weren’t directly connected to his work for Trump.
Cohen, on the other hand, pled guilty to making payments to two women (presumably Karen McDougal and Stormy Daniels), “in coordination with and at the direction of a candidate for federal office” (unspecified, but clearly Trump), “for the principal purpose of influencing the election.”
Source: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trumps-longtime-lawyer-michael-cohen-is-in-plea-discussions-with-federal-prosecutors-according-to-a-person-familiar-with-the-matter/2018/08/21/5fbd7f34-8510-11e8-8553-a3ce89036c78\_story.html?utm\_term=.070cf15b8d7d](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trumps-longtime-lawyer-michael-cohen-is-in-plea-discussions-with-federal-prosecutors-according-to-a-person-familiar-with-the-matter/2018/08/21/5fbd7f34-8510-11e8-8553-a3ce89036c78_story.html?utm_term=.070cf15b8d7d)
No, nothing whatsoever to do with Trump. :rolleyes:
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### Author:  [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/30 "2018-08-22T06:33:41Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#):
>
> Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
Keep reaching.
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### Author:  [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/31 "2018-08-22T07:32:53Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#):
>
> Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
Indeed. If only we had some sort of precedent for presidents being impeached because of a tangential crime that investigators discovered while looking into another matter.
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### Author:  [@The\_Librarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Librarian)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/32 "2018-08-22T08:10:51Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#):
>
> Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
What would it take to convince you that Trump et al really are crooks?
Written confessions under oath aren’t enough?
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### Author:  [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/33 "2018-08-22T11:48:02Z")
Melanoma should wear a “I’m with the unindicted co-conspirator” tshirt next time they go out.
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### Author:  [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/34 "2018-08-22T13:09:35Z")
Can we make the bad men fly now?
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### Author:  [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/35 "2018-08-22T13:15:45Z")
Re: Trump’s tweet in the OP.
Good old “What-about-ism”. The get out of jail free card for corrupt politicians.
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### Author:  [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/36 "2018-08-22T13:55:08Z")
Trump just tweeted that he has respect for Manafort as a brave man and that Cohen pled guilty to things that weren’t actually crimes. What a beautiful Wednesday morning.
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### Author:  [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/37 "2018-08-22T13:57:11Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> I disagree. There will be some quality people who would be fine upper level advisors/executives who after today will never put their hat in the ring because of potential skeletons in the closet.
The best people! They won’t be in Government! Sad!
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### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/38 "2018-08-22T14:30:14Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#):
>
> Thank Allah! These two miscreants being convicted of crimes unrelated to anything to do with Trump FINALLY prove that Trump colluded with Russia to subvert the election! The republic is saved.
What are you talking about? Cohen pleaded guilty to paying hush money to women on behalf of Trump as part of a violation of campaign finance law. How is that unrelated to Trump?
Also, while you’re explaining that, can you also explain what you meant to convey with the phrase “Thank Allah!”?
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### Author:  [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/39 "2018-08-22T14:57:04Z")
Pretty obvious, everyone out to get Trump and his cohorts is a blood-drinking moslem bent on imposing heathen theocracy on the _good_ people of the world. You know, like Barrack HUSSEIN Obama. Besides, these are just white-collar “crimes”. Technicalities. It’s not like anyone was actually harmed.
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### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 22, 2018, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manafort-and-cohen-both-guilty/820009/40 "2018-08-22T15:17:47Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#):
>
> Pretty obvious, everyone out to get Trump and his cohorts is a blood-drinking moslem bent on imposing heathen theocracy on the _good_ people of the world. You know, like Barrack HUSSEIN Obama. Besides, these are just white-collar “crimes”. Technicalities. It’s not like anyone was actually harmed.
I want to make him say it.
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