# Mandatory Voting.
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [November 7, 2012, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189 "2012-11-07T09:09:22Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/21 "2012-11-07T14:16:21Z")
Yes jury duty is mandatory, have you seen people called for jury duty?
Turn it around, what problem are you trying to solve? In Ohio, yeah yeah I know, the Secretary of State’s website lists a population of 11,545,202 and a registered voter total of 7,985,428. Not bad, especially if you subtract children and those not otherwise eligible to vote. Now look at the number of votes cast in yesterday’s election, 5,364,303. That is well over 50% of the registered voters and darn near close to half of the actual population. At the moment, the difference between the two major candidates is two full percentage points exactly. I think we have a good statistical representation here.
But more importantly, voting is a civic duty. While I would like that it be made easier for national elections, I don’t want it to be compulsory. If you choose to not be part of the process, then that is part of the freedom this country is supposed to be based on.
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### Author:  [@solosam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solosam)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/22 "2012-11-07T14:23:03Z")
This undermines the very concept of freedom.
Moreover, if a person is so apathetic that they do not want to participate at all, how can they be relied upon to make an informed decision?
Many years I choose not to vote as my way of demonstrating my contempt for both of the candidates I have been offered. I wish there was a box I could check that says, “You both suck.” I would show up every year if they let me do that.
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### Author:  [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/23 "2012-11-07T14:23:32Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#):
>
> Nobody is fringing on anything. If you want to be indifferent, then do so. Check the I don’t give a shit box and move on.
Even if there _is_ an ‘I don’t give a shit’ box, many, perhaps most of the people you will be forcing into the system _will_ check some candidate at random, or just check all the candidates on a randomly chosen party line, rather than check the ‘I don’t give a shit’ box. It merely introduces a random element that may well swing a close election to the guy the majority who _are_ informed didn’t want. This does _not_ improve the system in any way.
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### Author:  [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/24 "2012-11-07T14:26:38Z")
> [@solosam](#):
>
> Many years I choose not to vote as my way of demonstrating my contempt for both of the candidates I have been offered. I wish there was a box I could check that says, “You both suck.” I would show up every year if they let me do that.
That just makes you look too lazy or disinterested to vote. If you want to differentiate yourself from that, show up and vote third party or mickey mouse write in - at least it conveys the message you wish to convey.
FWIW, Nevada has a “none of the above” entry and I like it. I used it in the senate race this year, which was full of shitbags.
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### Author:  [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/25 "2012-11-07T14:30:42Z")
> [@kambuckta](#):
>
> What makes you think your Walmart compatriots are not also voters? :dubious:
Oh, I’m sure some of them are. I’m also sure it was a rhetorical device that most readers understood not to be entirely literal. Let’s try this one, instead: “The masses are asses.”
> [@](#):
>
> Anyways, the advantage is what **don’t ask** said in his post.
don’t ask didn’t list any advantages
> [@](#):
>
> But regardless of those seats, making voting compulsory really gives citizens a reason to get an understanding of the political process, and an incentive to become informed about their candidates and policies.
But if you’re allowing a “I don’t give a shit” vote, then it doesn’t do this at all. Not any more than a mandatory semester of US Civics and the endless onslaught of political ads and paid time off work to go vote does. Some people just don’t care. Force them into a voting booth, and they’ll still not care, but they may make some random and damaging doodles with their voting pens.
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### Author:  [@bahimes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bahimes)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/26 "2012-11-07T14:41:09Z")
Yes the draft is compulsory (for 18 year old males). This is not a highjack, see OP.
We haven’t had a draft call up since Viet Nam. The “all volunteer” services’ demographics have changed because of that IMHO.
Imagine the flight to Canada if voting was made compulsory.:rolleyes:
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### Author:  [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/27 "2012-11-07T15:08:53Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#):
>
> That just makes you look too lazy or disinterested to vote. If you want to differentiate yourself from that, show up and vote third party or mickey mouse write in - at least it conveys the message you wish to convey.
>
> FWIW, Nevada has a “none of the above” entry and I like it. I used it in the senate race this year, which was full of shitbags.
This is the eternal problem with democratic elections. Frankly, I would support a poll test, but that has been ruled unconstitutional. So if there is no requirement to know about anything to vote, then we might as well require everyone to vote and at least record everyone.
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/28 "2012-11-07T15:20:18Z")
I think (and hope) the SCOTUS would overturn such a law. Refraining from voting can be and is a form of protest. Even if you offer a choice of “no vote”, you still force people to participate in the system they may want to protest.
Additionally, we don’t run elections nationally in the US. The states do. This is not a federal matter.
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### Author:  [@I\_Made\_French\_Toast\_For\_You](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Made_French_Toast_For_You)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/29 "2012-11-07T17:26:29Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#):
>
> Voting should be mandatory, and we need only simply include a box for “I choose to abstain from voting” …
I hope I’m not being “whooshed” but: voting to abstain from voting is both hilarious and disturbing. Mostly disturbing.
An awful idea. The government needs to earn its legitimacy through noncompulsory voting.
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### Author:  [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/30 "2012-11-07T17:32:01Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#):
>
> Accuracy in full representation of the public. Even if it changes nothing in the demographics and 30-40 % still choose to abstain they will have been on record as doing so, rather than simply unrecorded because they couldn’t show up for some reason. It eliminates laziness, apathy, and other minor problems that prevent people from casting a vote. This way the number of non-participants should be both lower and more accurately noted so that we might find out why over a quarter of our population regularly doesn’t give a shit about how it is governed.
Why does having me “on record” as saying “I vote for no one” have value, while me not showing up and voting for no one does not?
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### Author:  [@Bertal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bertal)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/31 "2012-11-07T18:44:53Z")
Those who don’t show up make a statement that means: I don’t trust democracy.
Those who do show up and vote for nobody make a different statement: I trust democracy, but I don’t trust **you**.
Mandatory voting eliminates that difference. Does democracy want to know? If not, why not?
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/32 "2012-11-07T18:48:04Z")
> [@Bertal](#):
>
> Those who don’t show up make a statement that means: I don’t trust democracy.
Or, I dob’t give a shit. I think more of that then what you said.
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### Author:  [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/33 "2012-11-07T19:28:39Z")
> [@Eonwe](#):
>
> Why does having me “on record” as saying “I vote for no one” have value, while me not showing up and voting for no one does not?
Simple. Not showing up means _nothing_. Perhaps you don’t trust the process, perhaps you are apathetic, maybe the line was too long to bother with, maybe you had a cold, etc…
Compulsory voting eliminates all the non political reasons for not voting. When you check the “I choose to abstain” box you are making a statement about the process in general. When you choose the “I choose to vote for no one” you are making a statement about the candidates presented. While there will always be margin for error, this system properly counts those who feel disaffected with the system as well as those who choose to completely abstain for political reasons. Everyone else will just select a candidate, or write one in and send their ballot back. At the end of the count we have a fuller, more accurate picture of the populace and its opinions, (informed, ignorant or otherwise)
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### Author:  [@solosam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solosam)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/34 "2012-11-07T19:29:29Z")
> [@](#):
>
> That just makes you look too lazy or disinterested to vote. If you want to differentiate yourself from that, show up and vote third party or mickey mouse write in - at least it conveys the message you wish to convey.
Yeah, that’s what I did this year (third party).
I just wish there was a better way to let them know I hate both candidates equally.
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### Author:  [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/35 "2012-11-07T19:32:58Z")
> [@I\_Made\_French\_Toast\_For\_You](#):
>
> I hope I’m not being “whooshed” but: voting to abstain from voting is both hilarious and disturbing. Mostly disturbing.
>
> An awful idea. The government needs to earn its legitimacy through noncompulsory voting.
The simple act of voting does not confer legitimacy, the act of \*voting for a candidate \*does. That is the difference. Leaving the option open to abstain provides both the opportunity to confer legitimacy as well as the ability to discern what percentage of the population is not being adequately served by the current system.
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### Author:  [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/36 "2012-11-07T19:33:14Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#):
>
> Should voting be madatory in the US? I certainly think so. Jury duty is madatory. The draft is madatory. If you’re the witness in a criminal matter, testifying can be madatory. Is voting any less important than these?
Jury duty is not a right. Draft is not a right. Being a witness in a criminal matter is not a right. Voting is. You make in mandatory, you’re taking away my right to vote.
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### Author:  [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/37 "2012-11-07T19:36:54Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#):
>
> Compulsory voting eliminates all the non political reasons for not voting. When you check the “I choose to abstain” box you are making a statement about the process in general. When you choose the “I choose to vote for no one” you are making a statement about the candidates presented.
Ok. How do I choose NOT to make a statement?
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### Author:  [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/38 "2012-11-07T19:37:58Z")
It is obligatory in Peru. Everyone has the national ID (very cheap, and free for those who can’t get it).
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### Author:  [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/39 "2012-11-07T19:52:06Z")
> [@Terr](#):
>
> Ok. How do I choose NOT to make a statement?
Same thing as choosing to abstain for all practical purposes. You didn’t cast a vote, you chose not to. The only difference is the record.
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### Author:  [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)
#### Post date: [November 7, 2012, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/mandatory-voting/640189/40 "2012-11-07T20:27:00Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#):
>
> Same thing as choosing to abstain for all practical purposes. You didn’t cast a vote, you chose not to. The only difference is the record.
No. You say abstaining is useful because it “sends a message”. How do I not send a message then? Or are you taking that away from me?
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