# Manhattan Prosecutors file criminal charges for Trump re Stormy Daniels case - ongoing discussion here (Guilty on all 34 counts, May 30, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 9, 2023, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953 "2023-03-09T22:53:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 162
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3221 "2024-05-08T16:13:27Z")
> [@simster](#): > > With so many going on at a given time, you have to keep notes to not get them confused. Just like when posting in these threads. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Mikkel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikkel/32/13151_2.png) [@Mikkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikkel)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3222 "2024-05-08T16:14:42Z")
Thank you all three, I guess that make sense. I wondered why a whole day was used on that kind of sordid story. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3223 "2024-05-08T16:17:48Z")
> [@Mikkel](#): > > I wondered why a whole day was used on that kind of sordid story. If it was completely unnecessary the judge wouldn’t have allowed it at all. As it was, the story had some unnecessary details which the judge commented on, and also mentioned that the defense was lax in not objecting when it would have been appropriate to do so, and then the defense tried to game the court by requesting a mistrial. (Which the judge would have no part of.) It’s the legal equivalent of buying a sandwich, pulling out a dead fly from a little bag right in front of the waiter and putting it in the sandwich, then demanding your meal be free because there is a fly in it. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3224 "2024-05-08T16:28:24Z")
I realize this is the millionth time some tiny unpublicized facet of a trump scandal should on its own be enough to rule out him being POTUS, and pointing it out won’t stop from being POTUS… But FFS… > **[CNN Reporter Says Trump Got ‘A Little Physical’ Prompting His Attorney In Court](https://www.yahoo.com/news/cnn-reporter-says-trump-got-112546784.html)** > > Paula Reid said the former president was actively prodding his lawyer to object. > **[Judge threatens Trump with contempt for 'cursing audibly' during Stormy...](https://www.yahoo.com/news/judge-threatens-trump-contempt-cursing-233309619.html)** > > In a private sidebar conversation, the judge said Donald Trump was "cursing audibly" and had "uttered a vulgarity" while Stormy Daniels testified. Regardless of the facts of the case either of these things ON THERE OWN should be fatal for a presidential campaign. Being able to react calmly and rationally in a crisis and not… I dunno… starting physical altercation with your female lawyer (and only your female lawyer not your male lawyers) is one of the primary characteristics a POTUS should have ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3225 "2024-05-08T16:33:23Z")
“If I have to warn you again you may force me to warn you again!” ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3226 "2024-05-08T16:45:34Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > another scandal could wipe out his chances of beating Biden Actually, at that time, he was _not_ running against Biden. His opponent was _a woman_, which could have made the salacious details that much more problematic. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3227 "2024-05-08T16:49:44Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > It’s the legal equivalent of buying a sandwich, pulling out a dead fly from a little bag right in front of the waiter and putting it in the sandwich, then demanding your meal be free because there is a fly in it. More like, buying a sandwich, seeing it’s got lettuce on it, eating half the sandwich, then complaining, “Hey! I didn’t want lettuce on my sandwich!” They didn’t alter her testimony, they just let it go on longer than they wanted it to before complaining. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3228 "2024-05-08T17:02:43Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > The tryst between Daniels and Trump is the story Trump wanted to bury because the election was just weeks away and the salacious details of the story would be powerful. On the heels of the Access Hollywood tape, Trump knew another scandal could wipe out his chances of beating **Biden.** Minor correction - Clinton, not Biden. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3229 "2024-05-08T17:05:44Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > Trump and Habba should _both_ spend the weekend in jail\* for violating the gag order You have proof beyond a reasonable doubt that Trump instructed Hanna to make that statement? Because without that, the court has no power to jail someone. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3230 "2024-05-08T17:11:13Z")
Yeah. Total brain fart. Thanks for correcting it 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3231 "2024-05-08T17:12:32Z")
I do not. Does Trump have to have specifically told her to say something in order for it to violate the gag order? If she is his official spokesperson, shouldn’t the gag order apply to her as well as him? I don’t know. I’m not a lawyer. I guess it depends on the specifics of the gag order. But it seems to me like most competent attorneys would know better than to stick their foot in it like she did. (And of course, some of it is just wishful thinking.) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3232 "2024-05-08T17:29:51Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > most competent attorneys would know better They would. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3233 "2024-05-08T17:44:22Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > But then he falsified business records to make it a deductible, legitimate business expense. There’s something very weak and pathetic about this crime. Candidates are allowed unlimited contributions to their own campaign: David Koch used that loophole to run for Vice President under the Libertarian ticket. Trump had his company pay Cohen $420,000 to pass $130,000 to Stormy, fraudulently claiming the larger amount as a deduction. Trump could have made this a campaign contribution, reportable after the campaign was over. Yes, it would have looked weird having an “NDA agreement” line item next to the name “Stormy Daniels”, but the regulatory filing deadline was after the inauguration, on the last weekday of January. ([Cite](https://www.fec.gov/updates/reports-due-in-2016/)). Not ideal, but Trump didn’t care too much about what happened after the election. He’s a liar: he could have just made something up. ---
**Author:** ![JacobSwan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3234 "2024-05-08T17:48:07Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > Minor correction - Clinton, not Biden. It feels like it’s taken so long for this to reach Court that I wouldn’t be surprised if you meant Bill rather than Hillary. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3235 "2024-05-08T17:52:10Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Trump could have made this a campaign contribution, reportable after the campaign was over. Would that have been a deductible business or personal expense? If he would have had to pay tax on it, he wouldn’t have done it. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3236 "2024-05-08T18:05:14Z")
Campaign contributions are not deductible. The pitfall for DJT was his being convinced that he should not even _need_ to “lie about it later”. That he should just never be asked about what is this. ---
**Author:** ![Sandwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@Sandwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sandwich)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3237 "2024-05-08T18:15:29Z")
What confuses me, is why all this is just a misdemeanor, absent some other crime. Surely by misrepresenting these payments disgraced former president Trump has understated this business’s profits, which feels like it should be tax evasion, which should be a felony. It feels like it should be a felony even if in the end it didn’t change the tax payable, since it must count as an attempt to evade tax. What am I missing? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3238 "2024-05-08T18:42:31Z")
I got something wrong in this comment (mine, to which I’m currently replying), and I think it’s material. Michael Cohen did NOT plead guilty to falsifying business records. He pleaded guilty to making false statements to the US Congress. Which, IMNALHO, means that Cohen’s crime (as well as other state and federal election and tax crimes) _could_ be used as the predicate crime that upped Trump’s misdemeanors into felonies. So there 😉 ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3239 "2024-05-08T18:49:10Z")
> [@Sandwich](#): > > What confuses me, is why all this is just a misdemeanor, This is New York. Big business takes place in New York. If fraudulent accounting records, for any purpose, including tax evasion, was a felony, the entire US economy would collapse. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2024, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/3240 "2024-05-08T18:51:57Z")
> [@Sandwich](#): > > Surely by misrepresenting these payments disgraced former president Trump has understated this business’s profits, which feels like it should be tax evasion There’s a case for potential tax fraud for sure, but the falsification of the records is not necessarily indicative that the revenue figures were wrong. There are potentially some ethical (and certainly some potential legal) issues with how a repayment is made, but that doesn’t automatically mean the company revenue numbers were wrong. This isn’t even limited to Trump. I am allowed to use my company issued credit card for personal expenses, but each month, I have to tag such expenses and repay the company from my own funds. And reportedly, Trump signed checks drawn from a personal account to cover the payments. As long as the bookkeeping is correct, there shouldn’t be a problem. But if I used the card to pay for “legal services” that never occurred and paid back the money anyway, there is still a potential legal issue, even if the money was repaid from my personal account. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=161) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=163)