# Manhattan Prosecutors file criminal charges for Trump re Stormy Daniels case - ongoing discussion here (Guilty on all 34 counts, May 30, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 9, 2023, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953 "2023-03-09T22:53:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/381 "2023-03-24T14:58:15Z")
He thinks he’s untouchable and can pull shit like this: > ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/382 "2023-03-24T15:01:56Z")
And so far he’s been completely right about being untouchable. It’s been working for 75 years. There’s no reason to be confident it’ll stop working any time soon. It might quit working, but don’t bet on it. ---
**Author:** ![DeadTreasSecretaries](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deadtreassecretaries/32/4817_2.png) [@DeadTreasSecretaries](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeadTreasSecretaries)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/383 "2023-03-24T15:19:56Z")
This is basically the same scenario that already happened on J6 so immediately seems unlikely at least. I guess we’ll have to wait and see if he ends up getting charged in either case. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/384 "2023-03-24T15:30:04Z")
> [@Daithi\_Lacha](#): > > What are the chances that, if something truly unfortunate does occur, they immediately come for Trump on the grounds that he was fomenting violence? Doubtful. I think the legal threshold is that the language has to be intended to provoke _imminent_ lawless action or violence (and they have the capability of doing so). Generic & vague threats of violence _someday_ (wink wink, nudge nudge) get to hide behind the banner of free speech. ---
**Author:** ![Daithi\_Lacha](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daithi_lacha/32/5430_2.png) [@Daithi\_Lacha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daithi_Lacha)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/385 "2023-03-24T15:34:53Z")
Dadgummit! ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/386 "2023-03-24T16:00:18Z")
> [@Daithi\_Lacha](#): > > What are the chances that, if something truly unfortunate does occur, they immediately come for Trump on the grounds that he was fomenting violence? Zero. > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > He thinks he’s untouchable and can pull shit like this: He is and he can. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/387 "2023-03-24T17:30:09Z")
If a crime is committed and no one gets in trouble or wants to arrest the person, was it really a crime? /s ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/388 "2023-03-24T18:42:38Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > > [@Czarcasm](#): > > > > [GOP threatens to defund the prosecutor as Trump indictment looms](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/gop-threatens-defund-prosecutor-trump-indictment-looms-rcna75675) > > Yeh, right, because the federal government funds state elected offices all the time, eh? Good grief. Even for these yahoos, that’s truly dumb flailing. The DA’s general counsel has responded to the letter from the Congressional committee. She sent them a letter, full of legalese and case cites and references to the 10th amendment and state sovereignty and protection of privacy and protection of the law enforcement process and a whole lotta other stuff. It all boils down to: “Pound sand.” Letter embedded in this NPR article: [https://www.npr.org/2023/03/23/1165578270/new-york-da-investigating-trump-calls-gop-requests-unprecedented-and-unlawful](https://www.npr.org/2023/03/23/1165578270/new-york-da-investigating-trump-calls-gop-requests-unprecedented-and-unlawful) ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/389 "2023-03-24T18:58:04Z")
What letter says v. what trump & co hear: [![](https://desertdemocrat.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/gary-larson-far-side-cartoon-what-we-say-to-dogs-blah-blah-ginger.jpeg?w=640) ](https://desertdemocrat.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/gary-larson-far-side-cartoon-what-we-say-to-dogs-blah-blah-ginger.jpeg?w=640) ---
**Author:** ![Inferior\_Desecrator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9f8e36/32.png) [@Inferior\_Desecrator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inferior_Desecrator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/390 "2023-03-24T19:56:53Z")
Personally, I think TFG was baited. Just enough info that it would get to him (re: Tues) and TPTB knew he would run with it. Reaction is gauged on every level, chats, deep web, CIs, and actual physical response/protests. Charges will roll out based on this intelligence. Just a hunch. If it was me and I was going to poke several million people, I would like to know what to expect. We only know about the surface chatter, what might be going on in the cellar? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/391 "2023-03-24T20:28:25Z")
> **[Manhattan DA probing Trump received death threat letter with white powder](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/da-bragg-investigating-trump-received-threatening-letter-white-powder-rcna76591)** > > The substance, which investigators later determined was non-hazardous, was found in a letter addressed to DA Alvin Bragg. Nevermind rounding up hundreds of loonies, lone wolves (is it a contradiction to pluralize that?) will do, too. "The FBI and NYPD are investigating a letter containing a death threat and white powder that was mailed to Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg, whose office is investigating former President Donald Trump, law-enforcement sources told NBC News. The letter was addressed to Bragg and said, "“ALVIN: I AM GOING TO KILL YOU!!!” the sources said. It contained a small amount of white powder. " ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/392 "2023-03-24T21:34:51Z")
> [@Inferior\_Desecrator](#): > > Personally, I think TFG was baited. Just enough info that it would get to him (re: Tues) and TPTB knew he would run with it. Reaction is gauged on every level, chats, deep web, CIs, and actual physical response/protests. I think this is a possibility, too (welcome back to the forum, btw!). When Bragg invited Trump to testify, Trump knew Bragg was at the end of his presentation to the grand jury. We should be clear that Alvin Bragg never said if or when Trump would be indicted. That all came from Trump himself. The minute Trump announced he’d be “arrested” on Tuesday, Bragg decided to indict Trump on any day _other_ than Tuesday. It not only gave law enforcement a quick overview of what reaction to the news they could expect from Trump’s supporters once the indictment was filed, but it also gave them an opportunity to let Trump cry wolf at least once. I’m pretty sure Trump’s Waco rally is another reason Trump wasn’t indicted over this past week. No sense giving him so much red meat for an audience primed to honk it down. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/393 "2023-03-24T22:16:28Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > I’ve been wondering about voir dire. If after the jury is empaneled and the trial is over. What if a juror clearly admitted to the rest of the jurors that they had lied during voir dire. Late to the party and you’ve already gotten great responses from @Procrustus and @Ann_Hedonia. But just to add to their excellent information, this is how it goes down, at least where I clerked: If a juror is found to have lied during voir dire prior to the end of case presentation, the juror is excused and replaced with an alternate. The lying juror is sometimes prosecuted for this, but rarely. If a juror is found to have lied after deliberations have begun but before a verdict is taken and the judge determines that other jurors haven’t been tainted, the lying juror is excused and replaced with an alternate. The liar is prosecuted for perjury at the discretion of the prosecutor. If a juror is found to have lied after deliberations have begun but before a verdict is taken and the judge determines that other jurors _have_ been tainted, the lying juror is excused and a smart judge will immediately declare a mistrial and start again. Never. Ever. Take. A. Verdict. From. A. Tainted. Jury. (I saw this error happen once in a huge case. It was immensely consequential and tragic.) The juror will probably be prosecuted for perjury. If a juror is found to have lied after the verdict is taken but the jury still convicts, then the defendant has a great big issue on appeal and will probably win a new trial. The DA may decide to try the case a second time or they may be more inclined to settle, because the appeals process takes time. By the time a new trial is ordered, witnesses may be out of reach of a subpoena, victims much older, everyone’s memories are less clear or maybe critical witnesses have died. It’s an awful situation for a prosecutor. The most awful situation is if the juror lied during voir dire and as a result, the defendant is found not guilty as a result of those lies. If the verdict has been taken, then yes, double jeopardy attaches and the defendant goes free. The juror will almost certainly be prosecuted to the full extent of the law for perjury. Happily, I never saw this one happen in my career. But I have experienced some of the other situations. It’s never a good thing when a juror lies to get on a jury for whatever reason. > [@Daithi\_Lacha](#): > > What are the chances that, if something truly unfortunate does occur, they immediately come for Trump on the grounds that he was fomenting violence? I see a very strict gag order in Individual One’s near future. Let him violate it once (what are the chances?), and it’ll be home detention for him, with limited access to internet and phone. Trump is giving the judges in his cases every reason to issue tight restrictions on his pre-trial speech. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/394 "2023-03-24T22:28:03Z")
NY federal judge’s ruling to have an “anonymous jury” decide the April 25 E Jean Carroll civil rape case against Trump for their own protection because in the judge’s words, Trump has in social media attacked jurors, judges and law enforcement, including attacking this week the Stormy Daniel’s hush money coverup grand jury. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tEGE7tRWnY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tEGE7tRWnY) ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/395 "2023-03-24T22:43:05Z")
> [@dougrb](#): > > Trump has in social media attacked jurors, judges and law enforcement, including attacking this week the Stormy Daniel’s hush money coverup grand jury. And the Manhattan district attorney himself. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/396 "2023-03-24T22:51:14Z")
Gawd. Wait until the real shit hits the fan. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/397 "2023-03-24T22:54:18Z")
Thank you Aspenglow. It’s why it’s good (and bad) to be specialized. In my job as a programmer, I just cannot know everything. And when something out of my vision comes along, it’s best to leave it to the pros. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/398 "2023-03-24T22:56:47Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I see a very strict gag order in Individual One’s near future. Let him violate it once (what are the chances?), and it’ll be home detention for him, with limited access to internet and phone. Would a gag order apply to various enablers like Giuliani? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/399 "2023-03-24T23:01:15Z")
I don’t see how, but it will be tough for those people to act as Trump’s cats’ paws if Trump himself is forbidden to speak about the case to anyone except his attorneys. Because if he’s speaking to Giuliani about it and Giuliani is not his attorney in the case, then Trump is violating his gag order. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2023, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/400 "2023-03-24T23:37:32Z")
You have to give him credit for another first. An “anonymous jury” in a civil case. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=21)