# Manhattan Prosecutors file criminal charges for Trump re Stormy Daniels case - ongoing discussion here (Guilty on all 34 counts, May 30, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 9, 2023, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953 "2023-03-09T22:53:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 224
**Author:** ![Kelby2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ebca7d/32.png) [@Kelby2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby2)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4461 "2024-05-22T13:46:40Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > > [@OttoDaFe](#): > > > > I can believe he was expecting his crack defense team to blow so many holes in the prosecution’s case that even “so-called” Judge Merchan would be forced to bow before their brilliance, dismiss the charges and convict Joe Biden _in absentia_ for … something. That not happening may have been a blow to his worldview. > > Do you remember the first time it ever occurred to you to tell a lie, and your subsequent realization that your parents could tell? > > I don’t think Loser Donald ever had the latter revelation. He seems to think that all he has to do is say “Fake news, it never happened” and everyone is supposed to believe him, and anyone who doesn’t isn’t playing by the rules and is thus being “unfair” to him. So he told his lawyers to deny everything and in his mind that’s all it should take to secure a not guilty verdict, and the only reason it hasn’t is because Biden appointed a corrupt judge and attorneys specifically to “get Trump”. This. Reflective of his mental disorder. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4462 "2024-05-22T13:57:33Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > The prosecution’s case lies in, “Everything that Cohen has said which can be corroborated by another witness _has_ been so corroborated. Everything that hasn’t been corroborated by another witness is consistent with Trump’s behaviour in similar cases. There is no reason to suppose that Cohen is lying about any of it.” I know it was just CNN calling “_a horse race!_”, but during the first two weeks of the trial, the commentators were acting like the prosecution’s entire case could and would be made without Cohen’s testimony. And that Cohen’s testimony was like one petal on one flower on the icing of the case. All but superfluous. And now? It’s a one-man case? It’s now ALL on Cohen’s testimony? Aside from “_juries are unpredictable!_”, Trump is nailed to the wall right now. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4463 "2024-05-22T14:06:15Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I believe the prosecution instead is making the case that the uncorroborated parts of Cohen’s testimony are unnecessary for a finding of guilty. This is why the jury instructions are so important. Because a lot of this hinges on “intent to defraud” and “intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the commission thereof”. Depending on what the “another crime” was (tax fraud, conspiracy to interfere with the election, election finance violations) Cohen may be the primary evidence that the purpose of the payment was to commit or conceal that crime. And “intent to defraud” is a it tricky one too. Because who is being defrauded, and of what? Is it the state of NY? Is it the voters? Each of those requires different evidence, and the wording of all of that is what the lawyers are arguing about now. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4464 "2024-05-22T14:07:07Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > And now? It’s a one-man case? It’s now ALL on Cohen’s testimony? Aside from “_juries are unpredictable!_”, Trump is nailed to the wall right now. I suppose it’s a matter of philosophy. Which brick holds up the archway? All of them do, but if any one fails, the arch falls. The evidence is seen as a totality. Without the supporting evidence, just Cohen’s word would never be enough to convict Trump. But at the same time, without Cohen pointing the finger, none of the supporting evidence directly ties Trump to _this particular crime_. Does that mean it’s “all on him”? I don’t think so, l but I do believe that if he fails, the case fails. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4465 "2024-05-22T14:21:46Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Do you remember the first time it ever occurred to you to tell a lie, and your subsequent realization that your parents could tell? > > I don’t think Loser Donald ever had the latter revelation. He seems to think that all he has to do is say “Fake news, it never happened” and everyone is supposed to believe him, Unfortunately, too many people do believe him and it doesn’t even matter how outrageous the lie is. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4466 "2024-05-22T14:28:08Z")
Trump is what happens when someone spends decades of their life paying people to tell him the crowd is saying “booo-urns”. ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4467 "2024-05-22T15:26:41Z")
Those two attorneys on the jury – do we know what branch of law they are in? It occurs to me there are a lot of practicing lawyers who never see the inside of a courtroom. If these are two of them, their occupation may not have very much influence. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4468 "2024-05-22T15:29:30Z")
they are both corporate lawyers. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4469 "2024-05-22T15:39:48Z")
> [@anny\_m](#): > > It occurs to me there are a lot of practicing lawyers who never see the inside of a courtroom. Even if this is true, they are still schooled in the basic rules of evidence. It’s what being a lawyer is all about. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4470 "2024-05-22T15:42:28Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Even if this is true, they are still schooled in the basic rules of evidence. For many who never go to court, the rules they learned in law school are a bit fuzzy to say the least. Same for me, if I tried to do some securities transaction. But, as jurors they don’t need to know the rules, but understand the concepts. I think many lawyers would see the defense strategy as mostly floating red herrings and ignoring the elements of the offense. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4471 "2024-05-22T16:23:55Z")
I saw a few articles last night saying Trump started attacking the judge after he left the courthouse, but I don’t think I saw it mentioned here yet. > **[Trump Pushes Racist Dog Whistle as Hush-Money Trial Nears Verdict](https://newrepublic.com/post/181808/trump-racist-dog-whistle-hush-money-judge)** > > Donald Trump is getting desperate as his hush-money trial approaches its end. > “The judge hates Donald Trump,” Trump said, creepily referring to himself in the third person. “Just take a look. Take a look at him. Take a look at where he comes from.” ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4472 "2024-05-22T16:33:57Z")
Isn’t this violating the gag order? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4473 "2024-05-22T16:37:52Z")
> But the order doesn’t stop Trump from talking about the allegations against him or commenting on the judge or the elected top prosecutor. And despite a recent Trump remark, it doesn’t stop him from testifying in court if he chooses. [**SOURCE**](https://apnews.com/article/trump-hush-money-trial-gag-order-fae616037d3606cc60abbffb0e91f7ee) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4474 "2024-05-22T16:38:07Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Isn’t this violating the gag order? I don’t think the gag order restricts Trump from talking about the judge. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4475 "2024-05-22T16:51:03Z")
Oh, okay. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4476 "2024-05-22T16:51:26Z")
[quoting Trump] > [@Joey\_P](#): > > Take a look at where he comes from. Where does he come from? ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4477 "2024-05-22T16:56:19Z")
he was born in columbia. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4478 "2024-05-22T17:08:03Z")
Nitpick: Colombia. Also: Mechan lived in Queens from the age of 6. I guess a compelling case could be made for the untrustworthiness of people from Queens… ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4479 "2024-05-22T17:18:10Z")
i’m totally blaming spell check. dang it. i keep wondering why trump is going on about “the judge is highly conflicted”. i really don’t see a conflict of interest, unless he is referencing the daughter. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2024, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/4480 "2024-05-22T17:20:08Z")
I can’t help considering that Aileen Cannon was _also_ born in Colombia. Huh. Why would Merchan be the target of Trump’s xenophobic ire, but not Cannon?? Huh. Yeah. I got nothin’. :rolleyes: > [@rocking\_chair](#): > > i keep wondering why trump is going on about “the judge is highly conflicted”. i really don’t see a conflict of interest, unless he is referencing the daughter. He is. Plus, I think Merchan donated like $15 to Biden’s campaign a few years back, and maybe another $20 to other Democratic causes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=223) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=225)