# Manhattan Prosecutors file criminal charges for Trump re Stormy Daniels case - ongoing discussion here (Guilty on all 34 counts, May 30, 2024) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 9, 2023, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953 "2023-03-09T22:53:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 99
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1961 "2024-04-20T11:28:00Z")
The briefcase is filled with one of those. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1962 "2024-04-20T11:31:37Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > How exactly do the fines work? Would Trump get a bill in the mail or would he need to pay on the spot before he’s allowed to leave the courthouse at tge end of the day? Perhaps put up a bond? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1963 "2024-04-20T12:32:02Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > So he did say in court today he was going to testify. I am assuming when his lawyers finally overcome his narcissism and megalomania with his fear of prison, he can change his mind without prejudicing his case? The decision to testify or not is Donald’s, and his alone. His lawyers can make recommendations, but at some point during the trial (before the defense has a chance to present their case), the judge will confirm with donald his decision. But it’s not predetermined (I.e. the choice could depend on how the government’s case is going, so it isn’t something a defendant has to decide in advance) ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1964 "2024-04-20T13:49:31Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > So he did say in court today he was going to testify. That does not mean he will testify, or even that he now expects to testify. At the moment he said it, he saw some benefit to doing so, probably to look confident, strong, and unafraid. That sort of bluff and bluster is what Trump does, but the words don’t actually mean anything. I suppose it’s human nature to hear someone’s words and try to attach some meaning or intent to them. With Trump, there is none. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1965 "2024-04-20T13:54:28Z")
FWIW, in this video, former prosecutor Glenn Kirschner mentions in passing that he thinks it’s possible that Judge Merchan _would_ put Trump in jail for contempt if he keeps violating the gag order or for other antics in court. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/QdQR00eGpLM/maxresdefault.jpg "Prosecutors deliver first MAJOR blow to Trump at trial") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdQR00eGpLM) ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1966 "2024-04-20T14:15:51Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > > [@griffin1977](#): > > > > So he did say in court today he was going to testify. > > That does not mean he will testify, or even that he now expects to testify. At the moment he said it, he saw some benefit to doing so, probably to look confident, strong, and unafraid. That sort of bluff and bluster is what Trump does, but the words don’t actually mean anything. Each state has their particular nuances in regards to procedure. They’ll have hearings named for state cases, for example. So, in New York, for example, they have (and in Donald’s trial had) a hearing called a “Sandoval hearing”, based on the following rule, found in a New York case called People v. Sandoval > [@](#): > > Evidence of prior specific criminal, vicious or immoral conduct should be admitted if the nature of such conduct or the circumstances in which it occurred bear logically and reasonably on the issue of credibility. Lapse of time, however, will affect the materiality if not the relevance of previous conduct. [https://www.nycourts.gov/reporter/archives/p\_sandoval.htm](https://www.nycourts.gov/reporter/archives/p_sandoval.htm) The hearing is to determine what qualifies. They had that Sandoval hearing Friday In Donald’s case. Judge Merchan won’t rule until Monday, but the DA spelled out what types of things they’d intend to use to impeach his credibility. > [@](#): > > Chief among the topics prosecutors asked to discuss were the civil fraud trials that Mr. Trump lost in quick succession in recent months. In one, the New York attorney general accused him of having conspired with others to inflate his net worth. In the other, the writer E. Jean Carroll accused him of defamation for remarks he had made in 2019 after she accused him of raping her decades earlier… > > Prosecutors are also asking to bring up a civil jury’s finding last year that Mr. Trump was liable for sexually abusing Ms. Carroll… > > There was only one issue on which Justice Merchan seemed to be clearly indicate that he was inclined to side with the prosecution. Prosecutors asked whether they could cross-examine Mr. Trump about a lawsuit he filed against Hillary Rodham Clinton and others that a federal judge in Florida, Donald Middlebrooks, determined was “frivolous.” > > Justice Merchan read aloud from Judge Middlebrook’s decision, which said that Mr. Trump was a “sophisticated litigant who is repeatedly using the courts to seek revenge on political adversaries,” and a “mastermind of strategic abuse of the judicial process.” Part of the reason for this hearing is so the defendant will know what can come out, for the jury to hear, if he takes the stand. It’s sort of a cautionary exercise. There’s _no doubt_ that his lawyers will point to the Judge’s ruling (assuming it’s favorable to the DA) as a reason **not** to testify. > **[Prosecutors Want to Ask Trump About Attacks on Women](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/19/nyregion/trump-trial-manhattan-sandoval-hearing.html)** > > Prosecutors are seeking to cross-examine the former president, should he take the stand, about lawsuits he has lost, including a civil jury’s finding last year that he was liable for sexually abusing the writer E. Jean Carroll. ---
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1967 "2024-04-20T14:22:37Z")
Trump isn’t looking so good. He’s going to come down with covid or something and request a delay due to his inability to assist his lawyers and his great concern that he might be contagious. He could, no doubt, find some MD to go on record confirming his claims. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1968 "2024-04-20T14:28:27Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > There’s _no doubt_ that his lawyers will point to the Judge’s ruling (assuming it’s favorable to the DA) as a reason **not** to testify. Sure, that may well figure into Trump’s decision to take the stand, when the time comes. If he does choose not to testify, he will never admit that fear of the consequences was the reason. He’ll probably say something like “I knew the deck was stacked against me, and I couldn’t get a fair trial, so I chose not to.” I don’t know, and don’t care to know, how Donald makes those kinds of decisions. We only have his explanations of why he does things, and as I said, those mean nothing. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1969 "2024-04-20T14:29:36Z")
His default answer on this one is that his “lawyers wouldn’t let him.” I’ve lost count of the number of times he’s used that one. ETA: It’s akin to “I wanted to do the right thing, but my basic nature wouldn’t let me.” ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1970 "2024-04-20T14:53:56Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > His default answer on this one is that his “lawyers wouldn’t let him.” Which will be funny when, outside the presence of the jury, the judge addresses donald directly and instructs him that it’s up to _him_ to choose whether to testify, and then asks him for his decision. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1971 "2024-04-20T14:55:31Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > He could, no doubt, find some MD to go on record confirming his claims. Contagious bone spurs? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1972 "2024-04-20T15:01:30Z")
But, but, he’s the healthiest ex-president in the history of the republic! ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1973 "2024-04-20T15:43:48Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > The decision to testify or not is Donald’s, and his alone. His lawyers can make recommendations, And _making recommendations_ right now means spending every waking hour pleading with Trump to not testify, for the love of the god. > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > the words don’t actually mean anything. Here’s the thing, right, this wasn’t one of his delusional rants to the press. This was a clear, unambiguous statement of “yes I will testify”, made by a defendant during a Sandoval hearing in a felony trial to the judge. I am assuming it won’t have particularly big ramifications when his lawyers finally get through to him and he goes back on it. But he’s gonna learn the hard way that statements made in court by a defendant in a felony trial do actually mean something. They can mean spending 30 days in jail for starters. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1974 "2024-04-20T15:57:33Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > This was a clear, unambiguous statement of “yes I will testify”, made by a defendant during a Sandoval hearing in a felony trial to the judge. I am assuming it won’t have particularly big ramifications when his lawyers finally get through to him and he goes back on it. I’m not familiar with this type of hearing, but my thought is that (1) if he said that to the judge in support of his lawyers’ arguments that certain evidence should be excluded, and (2) the judge relies on that assertion as the basis to exclude evidence, and (3) he doesn’t testify, does that mean that the prosecution can then ask to introduce the evidence after all? If I’ve misstated how the process works, my apologies. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1975 "2024-04-20T16:06:36Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > There’s _no doubt_ that his lawyers will point to the Judge’s ruling (assuming it’s favorable to the DA) as a reason **not** to testify Though will the fact Trump gave an unambiguous “yes I will testify” during the Sandoval hearing have any implications when they do eventually convince him to not testify? I’m assuming no and there is no way the jury will ever know he said that (but that his lawyers still wish he had used more ambiguous legalese when he answered) ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1976 "2024-04-20T16:07:58Z")
If he states to the judge and prosecution that he will testify, does that give the prosecution the right to call him as a witness? (I’m thinking as a rebuttal witness to someone called by the defense.) ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1977 "2024-04-20T16:10:07Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > does that mean that the prosecution can then ask to introduce the evidence after all? As I understand it this evidence could only be considered as the response to the defendant’s testimony, so if he doesn’t testify it cannot be introduced no matter what the judge says. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1978 "2024-04-20T16:11:11Z")
Ah, that makes sense. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1979 "2024-04-20T16:12:22Z")
> [@anny\_m](#): > > If he states to the judge and prosecution that he will testify, does that give the prosecution the right to call him as a witness? (I’m thinking as a rebuttal witness to someone called by the defense.) Of course not. The defendant has an absolute right not to testify. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2024, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953/1980 "2024-04-20T16:18:27Z")
If the defendant agrees to testify but then invokes the Fifth Amendment declining to answer some (or all) questions, does the prosecution have the right to introduce evidence based on the question the defendant refused to answer? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=98) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/manhattan-prosecutors-file-criminal-charges-for-trump-re-stormy-daniels-case-ongoing-discussion-here-guilty-on-all-34-counts-may-30-2024/980953.md?page=100)