# Many university students don't want "discussion;" they want compliance. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 12, 2015, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342 "2015-11-12T00:42:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/61 "2015-11-16T05:18:06Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > A learning environment that is full of easily-avoided and unnecessary stressors on students such that they’re distracted from their core job of learning In your opinion, what are easily-avoided and unnecessary stressors on students? Can you give us an example, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/62 "2015-11-16T11:46:08Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > In your opinion, what are easily-avoided and unnecessary stressors on students? > > Can you give us an example, perhaps? Blackface ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/63 "2015-11-16T14:45:59Z")
Who was wearing blackface in a learning environment? I thought it was Halloween parties. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/64 "2015-11-16T17:32:22Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > In your opinion, what are easily-avoided and unnecessary stressors on students? > > Can you give us an example, perhaps? Death threats? Nooses hung in trees on campus, white students calling the black students “nigger” and threatening to kill them? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/65 "2015-11-16T18:22:46Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Who was wearing blackface in a learning environment? I thought it was Halloween parties. Where were those parties? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/66 "2015-11-16T18:34:13Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Where were those parties? I have no idea. I presume they weren’t held during class. Therefore I don’t see how they interfered with the learning environment. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/67 "2015-11-16T18:36:45Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Death threats? Nooses hung in trees on campus, white students calling the black students “nigger” and threatening to kill them? At my school you just had to yell “thermodynamics test!” and students would flee in terror… ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/68 "2015-11-16T19:04:16Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I have no idea. I presume they weren’t held during class. Therefore I don’t see how they interfered with the learning environment. Huh. Why do you think colleges provide dormitory space, if you don’t consider dorms to be part of a learning environment? Do you at least admit that your ideas about what comprises a learning environment are at odds with, literally, centuries of academic thought in Europe and America? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/69 "2015-11-16T19:12:27Z")
Do you consider a Halloween party a learning environment? Is a Halloween party subject to the same rules as a classroom? Is a professor a required attendee? Do they get graded on their costumes? Is there anywhere that isn’t subject to the same rules as a classroom? Or are students required to abide by a dress code 24/7? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/70 "2015-11-16T19:19:54Z")
A Halloween party thrown by a school-sanctioned organization on school grounds or a registered fraternity/sorority house, yes. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/71 "2015-11-16T19:23:14Z")
Do you mean that such a Halloween party is a learning environment, and subject to the same rules as a classroom, or is not? Not clear what the “yes” means. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/72 "2015-11-16T20:01:19Z")
I mean that such a Halloween party is part of the learning environment, yes. The college’s cafeteria, health center, library, shooting range, band practice rooms and football field are also part of that learning environment. Subject to the same rules as a classroom? No. But I can’t think of any rules that are relevant to this discussion which would not still apply. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/73 "2015-11-16T20:15:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Do you mean that such a Halloween party is a learning environment, and subject to the same rules as a classroom, or is not? Not clear what the “yes” means. > > Regards, > Shodan On the infinitesimally small chance that this question is being asked in earnest, I am going to point out that not all classrooms have the same rules. Students in a chem lab have different rules and standards of conduct than students in an advanced history symposium of 10 people, which has different rules than students in a 400 person psychology lecture, which is different still than students in Acting 301. So “same rules as a classroom” is pretty much a meaningless phrase. However, to a certain extent, all of those classrooms probably have an unstated rule of treating fellow students with respect. I do think that the school should hold school affiliated organizations to that very minimum standard - even for those organizations’ Halloween parties. Are you saying that students shouldn’t treat each other decently? Or just that once they step through the classroom door, there are no longer any rules at all? ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/74 "2015-11-16T20:49:26Z")
Look at this latest [story](http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/) from Dartmouth college where the students yelling Black Lives Matter disrupted the studying of the other students. What the heck are they hoping to prove with this? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/75 "2015-11-16T21:25:56Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Do you consider a Halloween party a learning environment? Is a Halloween party subject to the same rules as a classroom? Is a professor a required attendee? Do they get graded on their costumes? > > Is there anywhere that isn’t subject to the same rules as a classroom? Or are students required to abide by a dress code 24/7? No, no, no, no, yes, no. I’ll entertain the idea that you’re genuinely confused about what I’m saying, so here goes nothing: A Halloween party isn’t a learning environment, any more than a furtive kiss is an office building. A Halloween party is an event, not an environment. If it happens on a university campus, it’s an event that happens in a learning environment. Students that attend many universities live on campus because living on campus makes it significantly easier to devote their time to their education. For many students, blatantly racist activities on campus interfere with their ability to concentrate on their studies. A university interested in giving a wide range of students the best possible environment in which to conduct their studies will consider whether certain on-campus activities interfere with studies. If the activities interfere, they’ll ask whether allowing these activities serves some other purpose. If it doesn’t, they’ll consider getting rid of those activities. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/76 "2015-11-16T21:52:51Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > A Halloween party thrown by a school-sanctioned organization on school grounds or a registered fraternity/sorority house, yes. School sanctioned or not, people still have freedom of speech. And the left’s crusade against fundamental human liberties is eventually going to have consequences for them. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/77 "2015-11-16T21:58:41Z")
> **[Dartmouth students lead profane Black Lives Matter protest](https://www.campusreform.org/article?id=6990)** > > 0 Sounds like acceptable behavior in order to intimidate those who don’t share the same progressive views. Don’t display enough virtue and get mobbed! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/78 "2015-11-16T22:19:26Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > School sanctioned or not, people still have freedom of speech. And the left’s crusade against fundamental human liberties is eventually going to have consequences for them. Yes, yes, we’ll contact our lawyers now. You pop into every thread with the same tired refrain. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/79 "2015-11-16T23:46:02Z")
> [@WF\_Tomba](#): > > The impression I get is that today’s college students are anxious, depressed, and generally unhappy. College apparently just sucks now. What did society expect would happen when grading curves turn failing grades into A’s and students are told how awesome they are. When I went to college my counselor told me “you’re not in high school and nobody cares if you fail. The college is not going to babysit you”. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342/80 "2015-11-16T23:48:58Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > School sanctioned or not, people still have freedom of speech. And the left’s crusade against fundamental human liberties is eventually going to have consequences for them. You mean like asking for a college President’s resignation? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/many-university-students-dont-want-discussion-they-want-compliance/737342.md?page=5)