# Marco Rubio presidential campaign discussion thread. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 14, 2015, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685 "2015-04-14T21:41:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/241 "2016-02-04T06:53:06Z")
Rubio did better than expected in Iowa, so the media is fawning all over him. I say third place is third place. But let’s talk about the issues. In New Hampshire it basically comes down [Rubio vs. Christie](http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/02/03/despite-polls-chris-christie-says-its-down-to-him-and-marco-rubio-in-new-hampshire/), according to Chris Christie. Christie says that Rubio is, “ **the boy in the bubble** ”, given the way Rubio has difficulty veering away from his set of scripted responses. Christie doesn’t think that anyone can, “Show me the significant accomplishment that Senator Rubio has done while he’s in the United States Senate.” I think that sponsoring a piece of legislation can be a significant accomplishment, but flip-flopping on immigration isn’t leadership. Rubio sponsored a bunch of tax breaks and loopholes for big business in Nov 2011 (the AGREE Act) but I don’t think that passed. You would think that Marco Rubio could persuade Mitch McConnell to hand him something that he could sponsor and pass, but I guess he doesn’t have the leverage. I guess Rubio is basically a doorstop. Remarking on Rubio’s tendency to hide from the media Christie says that Rubio, "…acts like the king of England… It sounds like he’s in the witness protection program.” Where’s Marco? Donald Trump, one of the most sought after political commentators on television, said that Rubio is “ **a lightweight choker** ”, who “couldn’t even respond properly to President Obama’s State of the Union speech without pouring sweat and chugging water.” He thinks Rubio is “ **highly overrated** ” and given Rubio’s patchy Senate attendance and invisible legislative record it is easy to see why. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/242 "2016-02-04T07:11:15Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Rubio did better than expected in Iowa . . . No, he didn’t. The polls said he was going to come in third place and he came in third place. What happened is that he grabbed something off the shelf of pre-fabricated speeches that are normally used after upset victories. He seemed to think that if he could lay on enough artificially flavored earnestness that everyone would go along with the conceit. As unbecoming as his bitterness toward Rubio may be, Christie is right on this point: Rubio clearly just memorizes these canned phrases and mechanically spits them out. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/243 "2016-02-04T13:45:05Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > No, he didn’t. The polls said he was going to come in third place and he came in third place. Yeah, but the polls said he was going to come in third with maybe 15% of the vote, while Trump and Cruz nearly doubled that. Instead, he finished with 23%, just four percentage points behind Cruz, and one behind Trump. You’re welcome to see the expected and actual scenarios as essentially the same thing, but just saying you won’t have much company. Even a Rubio-hater like me has to admit that he did far better than anyone was expecting, dammitall. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/244 "2016-02-04T13:47:21Z")
Oh, and [via Kevin Drum](http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/02/marco-rubio-lashes-out-against-call-religious-toleration): [Obama](https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2016/02/03/remarks-president-islamic-society-baltimore), speaking at a mosque yesterday: > [@](#): > > If we’re serious about freedom of religion — and I’m speaking now to my fellow Christians who remain the majority in this country — we have to understand an attack on one faith is an attack on all our faiths. And when any religious group is targeted, we all have a responsibility to speak up. And we have to reject a politics that seeks to manipulate prejudice or bias, and targets people because of religion. [Rubio’s response](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/02/03/trump-and-rubio-question-president-obamas-visit-to-a-mosque/): > [@](#): > > Always pitting people against each other. Always. Look at today: he gave a speech at a mosque. Oh, you know, basically implying that America is discriminating against Muslims…It’s this constant pitting people against each other that I can’t stand. Seriously, WTF?! ETA: [No, there’s no anti-Muslim discrimination in the U.S. No, not at all.](http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2016/02/marco-rubio-very-upset-president-obama-went-mosque) ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/245 "2016-02-04T14:06:28Z")
In Rubio’s defense, that’s exactly what A) his base thought when they heard Obama speak, and B) that’s exactly what they wanted to hear from Rubio. Playing to your base is a great way to build momentum. IOW, like the Battle of the Bulge, sound tactics in support of a reprehensible regime. The horror is that right wing propaganda has so thoroughly poisoned the environment that a sizeable fraction of America has little connection with reality; only with the Bizarro world imposed on them by the talking heads. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/246 "2016-02-04T14:20:27Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > In Rubio’s defense, that’s exactly what A) his base thought when they heard Obama speak, and B) that’s exactly what they wanted to hear from Rubio. No question, it’s good political strategy if you’re trying to win the GOP nomination. But as you say, sound tactics in support of a reprehensible regime. And even aside from whether there is anti-Muslim discrimination in the U.S., I’ll be damned if I can see how Obama’s remarks can be interpreted as pitting people against each other. What Obama’s saying is precisely the _opposite_ of that - that we’re all in this together, and we should act like it. And somehow Rubio plays Opposite Day and interprets that to mean Obama’s pitting people against each other. That was the part that made me go, “Seriously, WTF?!” Even taking for granted the natural tendency of politicians to put the worst possible spin on what their opponents say, this made my head spin. ---
**Author:** ![2ManyTacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/3da27b/32.png) [@2ManyTacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2ManyTacos)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/247 "2016-02-04T14:28:44Z")
Yeah, I thought that Rubio’s “victory” speech in Iowa was just weird. Seriously, the guy came in third place, yet based on his speech you’d think that he’d just won the nomination. Strange. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/248 "2016-02-04T14:36:40Z")
I read the whole speech and I thought it was mostly fine, but I can understand how Christians would a feel little put off about being singled out in the snippet quoted above. Everything else was praising Muslims for their service to community and their rich history in America, and that’s well and good and probably needed to be said. But it’s not hard to see how the optics of his little lecture directed specifically at Christians about religious tolerance came off, quite literally, as holier than thou. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/249 "2016-02-04T14:54:40Z")
Rubio is an ass. Obama gives a nice speech at a mosque denouncing anti-Muslim bigotry and telling their faithful that they are Americans and they belong here. Even Hugh Fucking Hewitt called the speech “superb”. But no, Rubio sees this as a chance to shore up his Islamo0phobe bona fides and calls the speech “divisive” because… well because Muslims. Fuck you, Marco. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/250 "2016-02-04T15:08:56Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I read the whole speech and I thought it was mostly fine, but I can understand how Christians would a feel little put off about being singled out in the snippet quoted above. Everything else was praising Muslims for their service to community and their rich history in America, and that’s well and good and probably needed to be said. But it’s not hard to see how the optics of his little lecture directed specifically at Christians about religious tolerance came off, quite literally, as holier than thou. Jesuschrist! How sensitive are you/these people! “Singled out”? “Holier than”? Obama there was speaking to his own majority group, American Christians. It’s, like, the least-threatening, least-critical way they could possibly have been addressed, and still include the concept that they had any responsibility at all for, and any stake in, their country. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/251 "2016-02-04T15:14:17Z")
Ah yes, Republican logic. Republican + Bigotry, zealotry, hate = ‘Freedom of Speech’ Democrats + anything really = “Divisive” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/252 "2016-02-04T15:15:21Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Jesuschrist! How sensitive are you/these people! “Singled out”? “Holier than”? Obama there was speaking to his own majority group, American Christians. It’s, like, the least-threatening, least-critical way they could possibly have been addressed, and still include the concept that they had any responsibility at all for, and any stake in, their country. But it was still critical. That’s persecution. [sarcasm] ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/253 "2016-02-04T15:32:54Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I read the whole speech and I thought it was mostly fine . . . You have to hear his delivery to really get what Rubio is doing. When you hear it, you can immediately tell that he ordered a correspondence course from the back of a comic book called “You Can Be an Inspirational Speaker,” and he’s hoping that will get him into the White House. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Rubio is an ass. . . He’s actually just _emulating_ an ass, the biggest jackass of the whole bunch: Ted Cruz. Rubio himself doesn’t have enough substance to be a real ass. He sees Cruz grabbing all these religious votes, and just cravenly tries to do the same. It’s the squirrel that he’s chasing at this moment. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/254 "2016-02-04T16:04:10Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > But it was still critical. That’s persecution. [sarcasm] You know who was more aggressively critical about antipathy toward Muslims? George W. Bush. > [@](#): > > Describing Muslims as doctors, lawyers, soldiers and parents, Bush demanded that they be treated respectfully. “Those who feel like they can intimidate our fellow citizens to take out their anger don’t represent the best of America, they represent the worst of humankind, and they should be ashamed of that kind of behavior,” he said. That’s from [when _he_ visited a mosque](https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/2001/09/18/bush-visits-mosque-to-forestall-hate-crimes/d6c41c9c-9e89-4008-b7f9-292e352bc7c7/?tid=a_inl). ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/255 "2016-02-04T16:04:25Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Jesuschrist! How sensitive are you/these people! “Singled out”? “Holier than”? Obama there was speaking to his own majority group, American Christians. It’s, like, the least-threatening, least-critical way they could possibly have been addressed, and still include the concept that they had any responsibility at all for, and any stake in, their country. I do not identify as Christian, so I’m not one of “those people” whose sensitivity you (somewhat ironically) call into question. “Singled out?” Yes, quite clearly the lecture on “being serious about religious freedom” is directed specifically at Christians. “Holier than thou?” Yes, like he’s morally superior to his fellow Christians. As if they don’t know what religious freedom means. And I would reiterate that outside of that one instance, I thought it was a very good speech. > [@guizot](#): > > You have to hear his delivery to really get what Rubio is doing. When you hear it, you can immediately tell that he ordered a correspondence course from the back of a comic book called “You Can Be an Inspirational Speaker,” and he’s hoping that will get him into the White House. I’ll grant you, I did not see and hear Obama’s speech or Rubio’s reaction. Just the written words. Maybe Obama’s delivery was softer than my interpretation. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/256 "2016-02-04T16:15:44Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > You have to hear his delivery to really get what Rubio is doing. When you hear it, you can immediately tell that he ordered a correspondence course from the back of a comic book called “You Can Be an Inspirational Speaker,” and he’s hoping that will get him into the White House. > [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I’ll grant you, I did not see and hear Obama’s speech or Rubio’s reaction. Just the written words. Maybe Obama’s delivery was softer than my interpretation. **Barkis is Willin’** , I think you and \*\*guizot \*\*are speaking about two different things. I believe \*\*guizot \*\*is speaking about Rubio’s speech after his third place finish in the Iowa caucus, and you’re speaking about Rubio’s response to Obama’s speech at the mosque. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/257 "2016-02-04T16:27:54Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Jesuschrist! How sensitive are you/these people! “Singled out”? “Holier than”? Obama there was speaking to his own majority group, American Christians. It’s, like, the least-threatening, least-critical way they could possibly have been addressed, and still include the concept that they had any responsibility at all for, and any stake in, their country. QFT. > [@Peremensoe](#): > > You know who was more aggressively critical about antipathy toward Muslims? George W. Bush. > > That’s from [when _he_ visited a mosque](https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/2001/09/18/bush-visits-mosque-to-forestall-hate-crimes/d6c41c9c-9e89-4008-b7f9-292e352bc7c7/?tid=a_inl). This, too. > [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > I do not identify as Christian, so I’m not one of “those people” whose sensitivity you (somewhat ironically) call into question. > > “Singled out?” Yes, quite clearly the lecture on “being serious about religious freedom” is directed specifically at Christians. “Holier than thou?” Yes, like he’s morally superior to his fellow Christians. As if they don’t know what religious freedom means. FWIW, I _do_ identify as Christian, and I didn’t feel the least bit singled out or targeted or lectured to. First of all, his language didn’t seem to be ‘I’m up here, and you’re down there.’ It struck me as one believer addressing his fellow believers as an equal. It’s all ‘we’ and not ‘you.’ Second, when I found the Lord, apparently I missed out on the distribution of the hypersensitivity-to-persecution gene that too many of my brethren and sistern seem to have gotten. So I’m kind of atypical there. But let’s be real here: there are too many supposed Christians who believe that they’re entitled to run the country to conform with their beliefs. (And they regard resistance to that as persecution. Ain’t enough rolleyes for that.) They don’t see that as hostility towards persons of different faiths, or none at all - or even hostility towards Christians who think they’ve got the whole damn thing all wrong. If trying to open their eyes a bit there is regarded as some sort of attack, well, that’s a commentary on them more than anything else. ---
**Author:** ![cutman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@cutman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cutman74)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2016, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/258 "2016-02-06T22:25:29Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > QFT. > > This, too. > > FWIW, I _do_ identify as Christian, and I didn’t feel the least bit singled out or targeted or lectured to. > > First of all, his language didn’t seem to be ‘I’m up here, and you’re down there.’ It struck me as one believer addressing his fellow believers as an equal. It’s all ‘we’ and not ‘you.’ > > Second, when I found the Lord, apparently I missed out on the distribution of the hypersensitivity-to-persecution gene that too many of my brethren and sistern seem to have gotten. So I’m kind of atypical there. > > But let’s be real here: there are too many supposed Christians who believe that they’re entitled to run the country to conform with their beliefs. (And they regard resistance to that as persecution. Ain’t enough rolleyes for that.) They don’t see that as hostility towards persons of different faiths, or none at all - or even hostility towards Christians who think they’ve got the whole damn thing all wrong. If trying to open their eyes a bit there is regarded as some sort of attack, well, that’s a commentary on them more than anything else. This, exactly. Said much better than I could have. The Christianity I was raised with taught compassion and love and trying to gather others into the fold. I’m not really hip on that last one. I think some of the ideas about proselytizing are misinterpretations of what Jesus was saying. That’s the beauty of o book like that, and its curse. I’m free to interpret it and so are those who use it to spread hate. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2016, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/259 "2016-02-16T21:17:32Z")
It’s morning again in America! So says a new Rubio campaign ad, which opens with an inspiring scene of the sun rising over a bustling city skyline, with a serene peaceful harbor in the foreground. An iconic image juxtaposing commerce and natural beauty in an idyllic harmony that would surely tug at the heart strings of patriotism. [Too bad it’s actually Vancouver](http://blogs.vancouversun.com/2016/02/15/vancouver-skyline-featured-in-marco-rubios-morning-again-in-america-campaign-ad/). 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2016, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685/260 "2016-02-16T21:21:14Z")
If it’s Vancouver, the sun is probably really setting. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marco-rubio-presidential-campaign-discussion-thread/717685.md?page=14)