Marijuana legalisation

[ssj_man2k]

male, 15, democrat(not officially, of course)

Legalize it. I’ve been smoking for a few months now. My grades haven’t dropped a bit (i get straight A’s) and i’m much happier. Pot should be legal because of all the benefits you can get from legalizing it, and all the things you have to deal with when it is iilegal.

I think that if pot had that same rules as cigarettes, it would be fine. I doubt people would be going outside for 15 minutes to toke up, because their bosses probably wouldn’t allow it.

And don’t bitch about the smell. You probably do alot of annoying things too, but you don’t hear us complaining. And i like the smell, so by your logic, it should be legal.

I was wondering, is there somewhere where you can get a percentage on how many ppl smoke pot? I know tons of people that do, i was just wondering about an actual percentage.

And about the whole “america not wanting it legal thing,” many people on this board aren’t from america, and most of us are highly educated and/or smart. Most of the public is not this way, sadly. And thus, they live in ignorance.

[Dijon_Warlock]

Ah, yes…there’s always an OP in these things, isn’t there? 36, Legalise it or outlaw tobacco, one of the two. Or, if we’re going to have one legal and one not, reverse them. Having things this way makes no sense. But it shore do make lots o’money fer the people in charge at the expense of the rest of us. I guess that’s the important thing, right?

[matt_mcl]

19, male, New Democrat candidate. I don’t smoke or drink, but I do use pot (rarely).

Legalization of pot was one of my campaign planks when I ran in the federal election last year. Considering that Canadian pot criminalization is pretty much well known to have been the product of one journalist’s racist hysteria campaign, there’s absolutely no reason that it should continue to be illegal now. We could save the money we spend on criminalization, quit harassing compassion clubs who provide marijuana to people dying of AIDS and cystic fibrosis, and tax and regulate the thing.

From every public policy viewpoint, it would seem to be much, much preferable to have quality, regulated weed sold in the depanneur or pharmacy bearing a government seal than to have inferior or even adulterated stuff sold at Berri metro by god-knows-who who got it god-knows-where.

[Homer]

19, pot smoker, libertarian, social radical

Legalize it and tax the shit out of it. You could make a pack the size of a pack of cigarettes, for about $.50 and people would pay $5/$10 for it, more even, depending on the quality. You could sell a ‘carton’ for $100 pretty easily. That’s ALOT of revenue.

There’s very little long term health effects (possible dna damage, but not proven by studies, and cancer, but if you’re smoking enough pot to get cancer, you’ve got other problems) and even less short term effects. The LD50 is astronomical, to the point of being unattainable. It has many proven medical and mental benefits. Quit being so fucking hypocritical, USA, and admit that pot’s not bad. It is cheaper and easier to grow that trees, makes significantly less pollution when processed into paper, and has many other industrial uses beyond that.

Every human brain has cannaboid receptors. What does that tell you? Your brain was built to receive cannibus. What does that mean to a creationist? God created your brain to handle cannibus. What does that mean to an evolutionist? At some point marijuana was so closely tied to human evolution that those without the receptors died out or were bred out.

Prove to me it’s any more of a gateway drug than smoking tobacco or drinking alcohol. I cannot think of ONE person who smokes pot that has never drank alcohol or smoked tobacco also. Yet do we point fingers at these? Nope. Why not? They’re legal and have lobbyists to keep that from happening.

Every human has the right and ability to make their own decisions about what they do to their own bodies, and it is not my business, yours, or the governments what choices a person makes, unless these choices become dangerous for society at large. Marijuana smoking does not do so. There is ZERO reason for it’s illegality.

You can claim that it can conflict with the brain’s functioning, in my case, and a great many others, I think it elevates it. I can honestly say that I am smarter, clearer, and deeper after being a ‘head’ for a year. I can also honestly say that the longer I go without (two weeks now) the more these effects wear away. My clarity and understanding during the height of my ‘head days’ was such that I devised dozens of ingenious inventions (which would make me millions of I had financial backing to patent and develop), and you can say it’s a pothead’s dream, but ask Silo, Louie, Ad Noctum, or Anthracite and they can educate you a bit on my ideas and inventions. On top of this, the semester before I started smoking pot, I made a 1.48 GPA. This last semester, I was smoking nearly a quarter ounce a day, and I had a 2.98 GPA. Motivation schmotivation, pot makes me smarter than I am naturally, and I can PROVE this. I also have increased recall and attention to detail while high. Smoking marijuana in NO WAY intereferes or interfered with my ‘normal’ life, other than having to drive around with the windows down and use visene before going to Mom’s house. In addition, some studies have shown that a person under the influence of marijuana is less likely to be involved in a traffic accident because they are more careful while driving.

Search on my history on this board, you’ll find alot of depression related posts by me. While smoking marijuana heavily, I showed no symptoms of depression. Now that I’ve not smoked for a few weeks, I can feel the onset again. Lack of ambition, not caring about stuff. Sure, pot may have made me a bit lazier, but being lazy is a hell of alot better than being sad.

Good God, people, even my grandparents, my grandfather being a Methodist minister and high school principal and grandmother being the daughter of an LDS preacher and a second grade teacher, believe that pot use is an individual’s own choice and they should have no right to interfere. Geez, my mom is a fundie and I’ve convinced HER that it should be legal.

It’s not ANYONE’s business but the smoker’s.

–Tim

[Homer]

BTW, don’t take my 1.48 GPA as an indication that I’m an idiot. I was depressed and my reaction was “FUCK class, I’m gonna sleep or masturbate. Then I’ll eat later. Then I’ll sleep some more.”

My 2.98 GPA was a result of “Hey! If I get up 15 minutes earlier, I can wake’n’bake, get to class stoned, absorb ten times the info I would have sober, and have fun doing it.”

–Tim

[cykrider]

*Originally posted by ssj_man2k *
**
I think that if pot had that same rules as cigarettes, it would be fine. I doubt people would be going outside for 15 minutes to toke up, because their bosses probably wouldn’t allow it.

And don’t bitch about the smell. You probably do alot of annoying things too, but you don’t hear us complaining. And i like the smell, so by your logic, it should be legal.
And about the whole “america not wanting it legal thing,” many people on this board aren’t from america, and most of us are highly educated and/or smart. Most of the public is not this way, sadly. And thus, they live in ignorance. **

Why wouldn’t the boss allow them to go outside and smoke? All the other employees who smoke cigarettes are allowed to. Maybe because of the effects of the weed?

Yes, I’m sure I do annoying things :rolleyes: But, I am one person. Pot smokers are their own little community. It’s on a much larger scale. I’m not sure where you get this “so by your logic” non-sense. Where did I say it should be illegal because of the smell? I was merely pointing out to SuaSponte that your choice to toke up affects more than just you.

Finally, you last paragraph makes no sense?

many people on this board aren’t from america, and most of us are highly educated and/or smart. Most of the public is not this way, sadly. And thus, they live in ignorance.

Ok, ya. I don’t agree that most of the public is stupid but for your sake I’ll go along with what your saying. And so if we follow your idea that most of america is not smart, then they live in ignorance. Hey, way to point out the obvious Sherlock.

So what does this

And about the whole “america not wanting it legal thing,”

have to do with anything?
Let me guess…The general american public doesn’t want it legal, because they’re not educated, so they’re ignorant? Is that right? Care to back that up buddy?
Thank you Dijon Warlock for the informative links. I see how this helps the side affects but to me, skaffen_amiskaw, made it sound like it fought AIDS and MS.

[Dijon_Warlock]

cykrider: You’re welcome.

Regarding toking at work, however: I don’t see why this would need to be a problem. People who smoke cigarettes at work also inflict their habits on others around them, but they’re still allowed to do it on the job. True, we’re getting more restrictive about smoking areas, which allows the nonsmokers to avoid the secondhand smoke; but we’ve still got people (some where I work) taking a ten minute smoke break every hour and a half (if not more), which also impacts the rest of us.

Smokers’ argument is that it’s legal, so they should be able to do it at work. My answer? Alcohol is legal, too; but I don’t see anyone getting beer breaks. Drug Free Workplace Policy, doncha know. Get the damn tobacco out of the workplace, too. If tokers can wait until they get off work to toke, and drinkers can wait until they get off work to drink, then smokers can wait until they get off work to smoke. If they can’t wait that long, get them some treatment, because they’re way more addicted than I ever was to anything.

[Homer]

I also wanted to add that when high, breathing stops being an unconcious, autonomous behavior, and I find myself conciously breathing which means that I am breathing deeper and fuller. I believe this may have something to do with the perceived mental gains.

–Tim

[Dijon_Warlock]

Nawww…yer jus’ like totally baked, dude…got any Fritos?

[Tomcat]

I’m sorry ckrider, but I don’t see the logic in many of your arguments, especially when held up in comparison to other drugs and situations.

Lower productivity and pot affecting you personally? Interesting…What about the lower productivity caused by having so many people sitting on their asses in jail 24/7? I get stoned about twice a month for about 4 to 6 hours on weekends, and my lower productivity affects society as a whole? :rolleyes: What about the $65,000 (Something I read, I might have gotten it wrong by 10% up or down) a year to keep people in jail that YOU have to pay for? And since America has the highest percentage in the developed world of its population behind bars, that adds up to quite a lot of money and lost productivity. So can your silly productivity argument. Legalized drugs that are taxed would pay for the rehabilitation of the harder users and keep over 1 million people out of jail, who would then get full-time jobs, thus contributing their dollars to taxes and consumerism.

Smoking at work probably won’t happen too much, I would guess it to be as rampant as people drinking at work, maybe slightly more because of ease of use. But companies have policies against legal drugs on the clock, so I’m sure pot would be included too.

And why should what people do in their free time affect you? I don’t buy that. OK, a concert, I’m sorry, it’s a slight bother. But my whole life I’ve had to deal with the annoying habits of people around me, it’s part of being in a society. Smokers in restaurants, babies crying in all sorts of places, people talking in movies, etc. It happens, deal. Don’t like it? Become a hermit, because you are never going to find a place where people mingle that everyone is of the same mind about everything.

I get this feeling that you were raised with a “drugs are bad, M’kay?” mentality and actively seek problems to support your views regardless of the evidence to the contrary. To support THIS view, I point to your trying to make an argument that people think pot would cure AIDS or MS. I have NEVER in my life EVER heard ANYONE make such a silly statement. Of-f***ing-course they don’t cure them, neither does anything so far, or else we wouldn’t NEED pot to treat the symptoms. As for people coming up to you and hitting on you while drunk & stoned…poor baby. A) How do you KNOW that they are on both? B) Deal. Again, if you don’t like living with other people around you, move to Idaho and start your own damned camp.

I know many pot smokers, and they are all very productive, caring, honest, intelligent and overall pretty neat people to know and be with. Is it because they smoke pot? No, not in the least. Pot is just something they do from time to time. It doesn’t define them in any way, it is just something that they do recreationally when the day is done, or they want to experience something while high. Yes, that stereotypical view of the pothead wasting away in front of a TV exists, but that is a stereotypical view that doesn’t hold up to the main part of the populace. Stop looking for trouble where it doesn’t exist. The illegality of drugs causes more harm to society than good. Legalize them and many problems will be lessened, if not disappear outright.

-Tcat

[Blackclaw]

*Originally posted by SuaSponte *
**

*Originally posted by Blackclaw *
**My opinion is that most folks fighting for across the board legalization of pot (not just for medical use) spend a great deal of time fighting for the right to do something that is a complete waste of time. **

You are absolutely right, and you are making an absolutely ridiculous argument.
**

This statement isn’t an arguement. It’s an opinion. I didn’t say they shouldn’t fight for said right and I didn’t tell anyone how they should be wasting their time instead. I’ll admit to not understanding the passion for which those who fight for legalization seem to posses.

“Fight for the right to be really mellow!”

I dunno, it just doesn’t motivate me.

[Blackclaw]

*Originally posted by ssj_man2k *
male, 15, democrat(not officially, of course)

I think that if pot had that same rules as cigarettes, it would be fine.

Considering you’re only 15, I predict that if pot had the same rules as cigarettes, they would be equally ineffective.

And don’t bitch about the smell. You probably do alot of annoying things too, but you don’t hear us complaining.

But bitching is my first amendment right! I don’t like the smell of cigars, cigarettes, or people who don’t bath for three days either. Doesn’t mean those folks don’t have the rights to those behaviors but if I complain enough maybe they’ll at least move away from me.

And I do hear you complaining!

"Blackclaw you’re on the computer too much! Can I check my email now? Geeze, it’s just a game!

Oh wait, that was my wife. Never mind.

Oh, I never did give my OP stats… male, 31, was Republican but now with George Bush as prez I’m changing my political status to grumpy.

[Tomcat]

*Originally posted by Blackclaw *
“Fight for the right to be really mellow!”
**

[Beastie Boys]
“You gotta fight
BUM BUM
For your right
BUM BUM
To PPPAAAAARRRRTTAAYYY!”
[/Beastie Boys]

I just had to do it…

-Tcat

[SuaSponte]

*Originally posted by cykrider *
As for this posted by **SuaSponte:

The point, to those of us who aren’t pot heads, is that it is the people’s time to decide whether to waste it or not, not the governments. **

Yes, but why should I have to pay for your loss of productivity? Why do I have to put up with your second hand smoke at a concert? Why do I have to tell you to “leave me the fuck alone” when you’re stoned off your ass, drunk, and hitting on me?

No one’s asking you to pay for anyone’s loss of productivity, or asking you to put up with second-hand smoke at a concert, or asking you to submit to unwelcome advances.

Loss of productivity - WTF? If I show up to work legally drunk, my ass gets fired. The same would happen if I were to show up at work (legally) stoned.

Second-hand smoke - If pot were legalized, smoking at a concert wouldn’t be. It’s illegal to smoke cigarettes at a concert. Ask the arena owner why they aren’t enforcing the current rules.

Advances - Not sure what this has to do with legalization. And, of course, I’ve seen enough sober people not getting the clue that the other person isn’t interested.

I think if we do leagalize it, we’ll just have that many more Americans sitting around on their ass being worthless and rotting their life away. And for those of you who are more productive when stoned, how bout getting off your lazy ass and doing something while you’re clean? Is it that hard? Personally, I think if you people need to get stoned to have fun, or be productive, then you’re weak.

You may very well be right. So? Who’s job is it to make people productive members of society, the government’s or the individual him/herself?

Now you might be saying, hey, this is about weed, not tobacco. Well, what’s the difference? I think if you leagalize weed, you’re going to have people walking outside for their 15 minutes to toke it up, then walk back to their cube and stare at the damn screensaver for another 2 hours.

Guess you’ve never had a real job. Even if pot were legal, the schmuck who goes outside to toke up will find he/she doesn’t have a job when he gets back (or at least faces discipline). It’s the same reason why most people don’t go out drinking on their lunch break.

Not to be baised though, same goes for the booze-hounds. Is your life that hard that you have to resort to drinking? Life isn’t fair and drinking isn’t going to make it any more fair. And neither is hitting your kids…

And if you even consider the thought of hitting a kid, drunk or not, do humanity a huge favor and take one for the team ok? I think suicide is wrong, but if you really feel the urge to beat a kid, maybe it’s something you should look into. You are a waste of resources.

Talk about veering off onto the road less traveled. We’ve gotten from legalization of pot to suicide in three easy steps. Gee, that’s not unbiased at all.
Hey, smoking pot may be the most immoral and unproductive action ever committed by man. What has that got to do with legalization? Is it the government’s job to protect its citizens from themselves? To make them do the productive thing?

Let’s take a hypothetical - a young kid is a prodigy in biochemistry. All of his college professors think he is the real deal - the vertible “kid who will cure cancer”. If he goes into medical research, he is very likely going to do much to alleviate human suffering.
The kid has another great talent - he can hit the big-league curveball. The kid decides, the hell with medicine, I want the big bucks, and drops out of college to be a ballplayer.

Immoral? Probably. Unproductive? Absolutely. Should the government force the kid back into medical research? I don’t think so.

Sua

[SuaSponte]

*Originally posted by Blackclaw *
I’ll admit to not understanding the passion for which those who fight for legalization seem to posses.

“Fight for the right to be really mellow!”

I dunno, it just doesn’t motivate me.

Of course, you are right - with all the problems in the world, pot prohibition is mighty low on the list.

But principle can be found in the silliest things. For example, I am outraged by recent reports of cases where high school kids have been suspended or disciplined for wearing Wiccan symbols at school.
I am never going to wear a Wiccan symbol or practice the religion.
I think Wicca is kind of silly.
The whole business doesn’t affect me in the least.

But, the suspensions were wrong, and, because the ACLU is fighting back, I’ve increased my donations to the group.

Sua

[handy]

Mr O, Alaska is one area it’s legal. Parts of Arizona. Parts of California but that might have changed recently.

Of course it’s always legal in the police evidence room.

[SuaSponte]

*Originally posted by handy *
**Mr O, Alaska is one area it’s legal. Parts of Arizona. Parts of California but that might have changed recently.

Of course it’s always legal in the police evidence room. **

Actually no, handy. In some states and in some areas, it may no longer be against state or local law (and actually, I do not believe that is true either - in Alaska, for example, the ballot initiative to legalize pot was voted down last year), but marijuana possession is illegal under federal law, which applies equally in all states. The DEA or the FBI can arrest a person for marijuana in any state, regardless of local law.

Sua

[cykrider]

Ok SuaSponte I’ll agree with the fact that the gov’t had no right to tell us what to do. However, I think it’s absurd that people think it makes them better people and that it will solve alot of problems. Just because it makes you smart doesn’t mean the 14 year old down the street who smokes pot is on his way to getting a PhD. It affects everyone differently.

[SuaSponte]

*Originally posted by cykrider *
**Ok SuaSponte I’ll agree with the fact that the gov’t had no right to tell us what to do. However, I think it’s absurd that people think it makes them better people and that it will solve alot of problems. Just because it makes you smart doesn’t mean the 14 year old down the street who smokes pot is on his way to getting a PhD. It affects everyone differently. **

We are in utter agreement. The rubes who claim that hemp will save the environment, or that smoking pot will instigate peace and goodwill in all mankind are their own worst enemies when it comes to legalization.

Sua

[cykrider]

This has crossed my mind though. I don’t think it’s fair for the government to tell us what to do, that’s my leet h4x0r anarchist side coming out I guess. But should this be limited to just drugs? I’m against abortion, but I’m pro choice. I don’t think the government should stop you from smoking pot, but I don’t think you should do it. I don’t the government should throw hackers in jail for just looking around/learning. (Script kidding OTOH, toss them in juvi tell they learn how to program or someting.) But should the government stop someone from smoking crack or shooting up?

If a person can smoke crack without it causing them to do something illegal, is it ok? If pot is legal and crack is illegal, I think you’re holding a double standard.