# Marine petitions for conscientious objector status; didn't know Marines were violent **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 4, 2003, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480 "2003-04-04T16:02:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/141 "2003-04-08T02:35:36Z")
Christ on a pogo stick. **Monty** and I end up on the same side of an issue and everybody thinks **Monty** ’s an asshole. That’s just _swell_. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/142 "2003-04-08T02:41:12Z")
Otto: It’s because I keep clamoring for, dare I say it, facts instead of emotional reaction. Apparently, it’s better, in some folks’ minds, to toss one’s thinking out the window than to actually approach the issue with, dare I say it, facts. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/143 "2003-04-08T02:58:19Z")
Thank you, **Monty** , for being the only one to approach this issue with your level of fact and decorum. ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/144 "2003-04-08T03:09:47Z")
What the hell? I’ve seen nothing but facts cited thoughout this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Wabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wabbit)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/145 "2003-04-08T03:46:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Monty \* > \*\*Otto: It’s because I keep clamoring for, dare I say it, facts instead of emotional reaction. Apparently, it’s better, in some folks’ minds, to toss one’s thinking out the window than to actually approach the issue with, dare I say it, facts. \*\* Yes, your responses have been practically vulcan-like in their rationality and lack of emotion. Oh wait, I seem to recall a certain poster saying things like ‘small words suit you’, ‘bitch’, and ‘go to hell’. Who would that be, **Monty**? You’re hardly on the side of the angels here, you Paragon of Emotionlessness. Of course, neither am I but you don’t see me running around crowing about rational I’ve been. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/146 "2003-04-08T12:43:55Z")
I’m still waiting for **Otto** and **kevja** to apologize to poor **Astorian** for jumping all over him, accusing him of being a fucktard homophobe, and the like, because they failed to recognize the Monty Python quote he posted. They can be forgiven for not recognizing it, but once it was pointed out to them, I think some apologies were in order, no? ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/147 "2003-04-08T13:22:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Early Out \* > \*\* … because they failed to recognize the Monty Python quote he posted. They can be forgiven for not recognizing it, but once it was pointed out to them, I think some apologies were in order, no? \*\* Don’t jump to conclusions, here, I’m not so sure they can be forgiven for not recognizing Monty Python. They may be so ashamed they can’t address the issue just yet. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/148 "2003-04-08T13:27:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBill \* > **I’m not so sure they can be forgiven for not recognizing Monty Python.** This raises an interesting question. Does sincerely uttering the phrase “Monty _Who_?” warrant banishment to a dark dungeon somewhere? (“Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.”) ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/149 "2003-04-08T13:37:25Z")
Yes, clearly. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/150 "2003-04-08T14:54:03Z")
Apparently, some folks are confusing “clamoring” with something else. An additional question for UncleBill: On which Hadith did y’all rely to declare the self-identified Muslim isn’t Muslim? ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/151 "2003-04-08T15:25:16Z")
That decision was left up to those who were assigned to investigate his C.O. Package, I have no clue what their specific criteria was. I spoke to him, conducted an interview, reviewed his package at my level, wrote my observations and recommendations, and forwarded the package up the chain of command. My role was not to decide whether or not it was legit. I could guess, based on my interviews with him, that since he was generally unaware of basic Muslim beliefs (5 Pillars of Islam, birthplace of Mohammed, etc…), he was unable to provide sufficient evidence of his reasons for the package. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/152 "2003-04-08T15:36:28Z")
QUOTE]\*Originally posted by Wabbit \* **Sure, we could do that as long as you agree that you’re a pie-in-the-sky idiot with his head so far up his ass that you’ve evolved to breath methane. Alternatively, we could can the name-calling and act polite–your call. Also note in your article that he says it’s ultimately his fault. This is the first thing this guy has said that makes sense. Now all he has to do is own up to his mistake and all will be well in Wabbitland once again.** [/QUOTE] Hmm…let’s review the thread and see who started the name-calling between you and me. Oh, it was you. And if you want to can the name-calling, try canning it in relation to LCpl Funk as well. How about that. And hey, the guy has said from the get-go that this is his fault and his responsibility and what do you know, has turned himself in to face the consequenses of his actions. I’m sure he’s sleeping better at night knowing that he’s OK in your book. Jackass. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/153 "2003-04-08T15:49:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Early Out \* > \*\*I’m still waiting for **Otto** and **kevja** to apologize to poor **Astorian** for jumping all over him, accusing him of being a fucktard homophobe, and the like, because they failed to recognize the Monty Python quote he posted. They can be forgiven for not recognizing it, but once it was pointed out to them, I think some apologies were in order, no? \*\* I don’t think any apologiy is in order, no. Quoting homophobic shit is still quoting homophobic shit. How about an apology from **astorian** for the misunderstanding? **astorian** is the one who should be seeking “forgiveness.” ---
**Author:** ![Dravin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/da6949/32.png) [@Dravin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dravin)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/154 "2003-04-08T16:23:03Z")
How is the quote homophobic? Homophobic and using stereotypes aren’t interchangeable ya know. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/155 "2003-04-08T20:58:15Z")
**Otto** : apparently, nothing more than a humorless asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/156 "2003-04-08T21:00:30Z")
Oh, and by the way, **Otto** , the part of the “Mary” recruiter in the sketch was played by Graham Chapman, a gay man. Some homophobe, that one! ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/157 "2003-04-08T21:24:01Z")
Obscure Monty Python skit recognition used to be a prerequisite to get into this place, it was on the entrance exam and everything. Nowadays, they’ll just let anyone in here. I’ll go out on a limb here and say the Monty Python bunch weren’t actually _afraid_ of homosexuals. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/158 "2003-04-08T21:37:07Z")
Gosh, how could I have been so foolish as to think that a message on a message board posted utterly bereft of context and **without the benefit of even a fucking set of quotation marks** might be a quote from a Python sketch I never heard of as opposed to the actual opinion of the poster? How could I have expected that, in accordance with what appears to be fairly standard practice here, **astorian** maybe should have done the [Monty Python] [/Monty Python] thing or at the very least put quotation marks around his comment? How could I possibly have interpreted a comment listing off several gay stereotypes in a thread about a gay Marine as perhaps being the slightest bit homophobic? What was I thinking, expecting that maybe the person who posted it (and who has not posted a follow-up in response to the minor shitstorm kicked up by it) would have the decency to apologize for making a comment that more than one person has taken as being anti-gay? IOW, **Early Out** , fuck you. ---
**Author:** ![Wabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wabbit)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/159 "2003-04-08T23:23:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Otto \* > \*\*Hmm…let’s review the thread and see who started the name-calling between you and me. Oh, it was you. And if you want to can the name-calling, try canning it in relation to LCpl Funk as well. How about that. And hey, the guy has said from the get-go that this is his fault and his responsibility and what do you know, has turned himself in to face the consequenses of his actions. I’m sure he’s sleeping better at night knowing that he’s OK in your book. > > Jackass. \*\* Well, if you’re referring to the post where I said that (hypothetically) I could call you some ridiculous names and you could respond with equally ridiculous names, it was meant to show how how silly this whole exercise could become. Sorry you missed the inference, but you sure are proving my point here. Thanks (I guess). And I’m not going to stop giving my opinions just because they don’t fit with your worldview. From my reading of the facts, this guy is a malingerer and nothing I’ve seen to this point with the possible exception of him actually accepting that it’s his fault has convinced me he is anything but. Sorry that doesn’t fit with your viewpoint there **Otto** , but them’s the breaks. Oh, and since we’re in “silly-name-calling” mode now, how’s about this one: syphilic whoremongering putz. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2003, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480/160 "2003-04-08T23:38:28Z")
No, no, no. _ **Silly** _ namecalling! Schnazzeling uppigidious frazzalacious nerd swergler! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/marine-petitions-for-conscientious-objector-status-didnt-know-marines-were-violent/166480.md?page=9)